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Do you think a unit of Broadsides with plasma upgrades and a meaty kroot shield is a worthwhile awnser to an army heavy with terminators and vehicles? It makes quite a fat static target and seems likely to be assaulted and shot at, but theres Kroot! So who cares right?
Besides that element, I planned on a mobile army. I wanted plasma and fusion wielding chrisis suits holding the middle with pathfinders to point (mostly to react to any deep strikes or advances, as chrisis suits were ment to do). Stealth suits and a unit of firewarriors in a devilfish on the oppisite flank to move in for the kill.
I didnt plan on taking a hammerhead even though I own one, which Im sure you'll say is blasphemy! But... the great advantage of the HH is its mobility and its versatility. I'm just not going to need that big AP4 pie plate against a few marines, and my broadsides have those tougher targets on lockdown.
Its worth noting, me and my brother agreed to use the old shield drone rules until the new codex comes out, so all my suits can take a few shots before they start taking meaningful casaulties.
1500 points is what Im shooting for.
If you want a full list I could supply that too. =d I'm pretty much expecting everyone to say 'frick those static elements, take HH's and keep running from termies!' but the concentrated high strength, low AP weaponry is soo shiny! Imagine 20 armor piercing shots (3 broadsides with plasmas and 4 chrisis suits plasmas and fusions) WITH markerlights available to that area. ^_^ Makes deep striking positively suicidal. His other option is striking at my more vulnerable mobile flank, which makes the terminators low mobility a real asset (to me). My chrisis team can still deploy quickly and my broadsides are of course in range of nearly everything anyway.
Any criticism to my plans/plots/schemes?
It could work, bit if even a single terminator lives he could cause a lot of pain. I personally like this, combined with as much plasma as the crisis suits can take you have an army that will cut marines in half.
Thats what those kroot are for! Since I'm obliged to take a unit of infantry in addition to my squad of fire warriors anyway, a lot of cheap melee specealists are ideal for soaking up any stragglers that make it through that withering firepower.
I've been thinking however...20 armor piercing shots seems like a lot of overkill, even for two terminator squads. And before you question that, yeah my brother DOES field 10 terminators with tons of weaponry even in 1000 point matches. I may swap most of my fusion blasters out for simple missile pods for that ranged punch. It wont be negating any armor saves but it'll give my expensive chrisis suits something to shoot while they wait for terminators to drop in and play. Just in case he sits a devistator squad in cover directly across from my broadsides or something else I wouldnt expect him to do, I have something to JSJ back with. If he just decides to ignore my broadside team or (the last thing I would expect O.o) sit back in cover and try to outshoot me, I wont have a worthless chrisis team just hanging out waiting for action.
Fair enough, in my experience its not the fire warriors that are the biggest threat, its stuff like stealth suits, maybe drop the kroot and a broadside for a stealth team? IMO they are a real pain for marine to deal with (damn jump packs!).
The kroot are woefully ineffective at stopping terminators, but i'm not known for my tactical sense so they may work, I don't know.
I planned on my mobile front consisting entirely of stealth suits backed up by fire warriors actually.
I need 2 troop choises, so kroot must stay, and shielding my broadsides is the perfect use for them. Also, they arent really ment to 'stop' the terminators. They are cheap. They come with a strength and WS equal to terminators, 2 CC attacks a piece (3 if they charge) and thier cover happens to be forest they get a bunch of awsome bonuses. Their almost the perfect unit to throw at terminators.
Their purpose isnt specifically to kill terminators however. Thier usefulness lies in tieing up espensive units in close combat. Lots of wounds for few points. Even if they dont survive combat, they've served thier purpose by allowing me enough time to position my chrisis suits and broadsides to finish them off.
Look at it this way. 5 terminators cost 250+ and get 10 attacks (does a powerfist count as an additional close combat weapon? 15 attacks then?). Their absolutely made to take out tough targets in melee and survive. 20 kroot cost around 140. They get 40 attacks, in fact 60 if they countercharge. If they cannot charge, those terminators arent close enough to really threaten my broadsides anyway. With half hitting, and half wounding. Thats still 15 armor saves he has to make.
Of course, we both know he wont have 5 terminators to a squad by the end of my shooting phase. And assuming those boys take powerfists, he'll never get the chance to strike back.
Kroot (or any big mob of cheap CC units) are absolutely the last unit a terminator wants to charge first.
Last edited by StevenSane; January 10th, 2006 at 14:41.
Good point, then the challenge become keeping the kroot alive, which may/may not be an easy task (hmmm, whirlwinds...).
Yeah, I fear whirlwinds. >_< Your stealing the thoughts from my brain man. Thankfully, one of those cool things about kroot are they get a 4+ cover save in woods or jungle, so they will almost always get a 50% cover save. They also move through it without testing, and see and shoot through 12". Kroot are friggin awsome in woods. I shouldnt be too worried though, heavy support are what railguns are for.
If a whirlwind can see my kroot, my broadsides can see his whirlwind.
Last edited by StevenSane; January 10th, 2006 at 15:04.
I would be more concerned about the LOS, I can't remember the strength of missile pods but I doubt it can take out a whirlwind.
Also, terminators with heavy flamers are going to be your worst nightmare, heck its even better if you put the broadside in the cover with the kroot!
I use my XV8,s (all with Plasma / Fusion and Multi) and Kroot exactly as your describing,Originally Posted by StevenSane
I use 5 lone suits so I usually get between 9 to 12 AP1/AP2 shots of at termies and if the Termies do deep strike near my FW I have a 20 strong Kroot squad to first shoot them (either 20 shots or 40 rapid fire) and then they will counter assault.
I never assault 1st because even if a few Termies survive the hail of shooting coming there way and assault next turn I will have enough Kroot left to beat them or tie them up.
The XV8 helios variation I use can hurt termies with shooting and can even survive a few rounds of CC because they have Shield Gens.
If I face Marines I will always keep a couple of my 5 XV8's close enough to the FW lines to be able to move shoot and jump back out of range (termies are slow).
One thing though dont use Kroot for meat shields its a waste, like you said they are awesome in woods and pretty good in cover so use them were they excel.
Ordance from Marines is pretty rare, rare enough not to worry about, preds are more of a problem especially for XV's.
I personaly dont rate BS they are to vulnerable to heavy weapons and lose the ability to shoot if they move (which against fastish lists they will have to do). I much prefer to leave the armour killing to XV8's and use HH to hit the rest of the enemy list and take armour if needed, works for me.
The best thing versus termies is crisis with plasma, period. It is a very direct counter. One reson is the Ap2. ANother is that termies, deep striking or not, will never, ever, be able to get assault the crisis unless you screw up badly. That's important. Broadisides can't do that. Using broadsides to kill termies is like using a bazooka to kill a ****roach. Except with termies it's a housecat instead of a ****roach. It's still overkill. I'm not saying you shouldn't target them when all the vehicles are gone, I'm just saying that shouldn't be why you brought the broadsides.