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Thread: Zen HQ

  1. #1
    Dark Eldar Zealot Wicky's Avatar
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    Zen HQ

    Anyone out there in cyberspace land NOT use an uber HQ? I know that a raider full of Incubi and a tooled up Dark Lord looks the part and can tear most armies a new one but personally I like the lowest points cost HQ possible, prefering to spend the money on more troops and elites. One to three Haemonculii does me fine and I really don't miss dragging around those power weapon equipped androids with no fleet of foot rule to keep up with the rest of the group. I know the theory, pop them out of a portal straight into close combat but it seems like I am playing two differnt armies here - one with armour and one without and I must admit that I like playing the latter much better! Perhaps its my liking of using a "shock " army in maximum mode and those delicious flamer templates laid down by the Haemonculii destructors make me quiver in anticipation of the result.
    But really, what would you rather have - one almighty Dark Lord or another squad of warriors with the attached Haemonculus for almost the same cost?


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  3. #2
    Senior Member crucial's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by wickywacky1
    But really, what would you rather have - one almighty Dark Lord or another squad of warriors with the attached Haemonculus for almost the same cost?
    for the same cost? well a squad of 13-15 warriors + splinter cannons and blasters is more than the cost of our archon with shadow field, agoniser, splinter pistol and combat drugs anyway. factor in the haemy and its a pretty bad example.

    this warrior squad is another scoring unit and is quite flexable whatever army you face, but you should already have a few of these anyway.

    you should remember that the HQ dosnt have to be a tooled out archon. make him a drachon and give him a few goodies. if he makes it into combat hes gonna own.

    still nothing wrong with using a few haemonculi though
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    Member Asmodean's Avatar
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    well, I used to be minimalist, much like you....

    But with the advent of my beautiful, beautiful incubi (they seriously pwn every other humanoid model the DE have, imho) I keep finding excuses to field them :wub:

    Added to the fact that they can seriously pierce some armour, and in larger point battles, there is actually room for them, you start running out of reasons not to field them.

    They are the one unit in our army that can stand upto largish amounts of pain, and they look damn cool while doing it.

    Against termies and MEQ, they're priceless, winning battles that even wyches take a long time fighting, almost instantly...

    And I say again, they manage to look pretty good while cleaving a large hole in the opponents forces....

    If you don't spend a lot of time touching up and perfecting your beautiful, beautiful incubi, I'd say, don't field them unless you vs a lot of MEQ...

    but even against tyrannids, they provide the hard hitting, awesome team I want to put my Archon in.

    And the fear factor they provide has endless amusement.

    The lengths the opposition go to to hide their sorry warriors from my wrathfilled incubi....

    It's quite funny really.

    Incubi are how I see my force, what represents DE to me....
    And Thus I like to include them.

    Tactically, they fit in as well as any other unit I have, albeit a little more expensive for a lot more MEQ pop.

    :ninja:
    minimalism is the key.

  5. #4
    Archite of Caerbannog KwiKwag's Avatar
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    Lately I have been trying out a new Zen HQ one that is probably the wierdest and non-fluffiest. Its a grotesques squad accompanied by a Dracite in a Raider. Sound strange? In my last game against the Tau this squad easily defeated 3 different (easy) targets and took ShadowSun as a prisoner. In the open, they dont get shot at by small arms fire and seem to attract the big guns. I really dont mind losing the grotesques thinking that at a certain point when there are only a couple grots left the Dracite can separate whenever it wants. For me, this unit has my fancy and coming out of the web I am anxious to see what they can do even against the fearless armies (auto-fallback is only a bonus).

    Can't explain it fluff wise - I guess I am taking advantage of a loop-hole?

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    Tomb King medic_4077's Avatar
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    I field a standard Punisher Archon and just attach him to a raider (wytches or warriors). I found my incubi were 2 for 3 against marines (effective but not devestatingly so, they never actually won me the game) and all but useless against IG and Chaos. I get more milage out of a second wytch squad.
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    Senior Member crucial's Avatar
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    yeah i wanted to use some grotesques using a box of warhammer zombies as my source.

    Quote Originally Posted by KwiKwag
    and coming out of the web I am anxious to see what they can do even against the fearless armies (auto-fallback is only a bonus).
    but you do know that you will have to roll seperate reserve rolls? i know i know... its a *****... i hope GW will fix this or something soon because i have to attach my archon/dracite to a retinue everytime they come outa the warp I WANNA SEPERATE THE UNIT DAMN-IT!!! lol

    you could still use urien tho as his uber grots count as a bodyguard... have you tried him at all?
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  8. #7
    Dark Eldar Zealot Wicky's Avatar
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    My original post concerning the cost of a tooled up Dark Lord (shadowfield, combat drugs, agoniser and splinter pistol) verses a warrior squad could be put into perspective by looking up the points cost of such a Combat monster compared to a 10man warrior with 2 splinter cannons and an attached heamonculus (destructor and scissorhands) being only about 5pts more. This is a pretty good example I think con sidering they are all properly equipped for war and I stick by my decision. The tactical flexibility exhibited by the larger squad is for more useful in my style of play.

  9. #8
    Archite of Caerbannog KwiKwag's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by crucial
    but you do know that you will have to roll seperate reserve rolls? i know i know... its a *****... i hope GW will fix this or something soon because i have to attach my archon/dracite to a retinue everytime they come outa the warp I WANNA SEPERATE THE UNIT DAMN-IT!!! lol

    you could still use urien tho as his uber grots count as a bodyguard... have you tried him at all?
    LOL, I know what you mean! It's a something you have to consider not being able to separate and leg it.

    I am aware of the rolling separate for HQ in reserves but I have alway been successful in convincing that unless the Dracite comes with the grotesques then they would never be allowed to come through the warp. The fact that in order to get the raider in the first place was because of the Dracite and that he would HAVE to be on the Raider with the Grotesques otherwise they would've been left in Commorragh looking at butterflies.

    I understand it either way but this is the only instance of this problem and my opponents and the GW store I play at allow it - I am not saying I'm right, I am just saying that is how we play it.

    Sorry, didnt want to steal the thread. I like where you going with the decision more warriors is better than an Uber HQ. Other than my recent experiment with the Dracite and grotesques - my HQ did little and I started to frown on Uber HQ's. I would say that from 1500 you could draw a line that uber HQ's and the use of 2 HQ's starts here. At 2000 points I would hesitate if I didn't have one or the other knowing my opponent was going to field something tricky and may need some "special" attention - but then again, using troops and elites could just be the solution.
    Last edited by KwiKwag; June 13th, 2006 at 00:54.

  10. #9
    Son of LO Tenozuma's Avatar
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    The thing is, a good archon (131 or 135 points) is not an uber expensive HQ, in fact, hes really very cheap for what he does, he can be invaluable as he can rip right into the enemt on turn 2 on a bike or in a raider or be coupled with a squad of grotesques (he detaches at the end of the movement phase) to make enemies auto fall back (archon does all the killing and catches them with his I7, this works wonders on necrons as they can't get up after being caught in a sweeping advance and they are not fearless. A haemonculi wouldn't have been able to do that as they aren't good enough in close combat. A lord also allows the option of taking incubi which rip into the most common opponent, meqs. They also do great against tau, stormtroopers, sisters of battle without the invunerable, eldar aspect warriors (except for banshees) and so on and so forth.

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