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All Right, I hope this post doesn't seem to dumb but I was wondering if I could get some help: I love Fire Dragons, having everyone in the squad with melta weapons is pretty tight, but I don't know how to use them well. I mean, I could put them in a transport, but I don't want to use them like that. I don't want to sacrifice points that I could put into more fire power somewhere else. Also, I always feel like running them up to tanks in a transport is suicide.
One thing that I do thend to use them as, are protection to my defender guardian squads, or anything hanging out in back that gets in trouble if something deepstrikes near it or starts charging toward them....but I would like to make the squad more effective than just sitting in back the whole game. If anyone has any suggestions I would really appreciate it. Thanks!
Last edited by Desert_Wolf; February 25th, 2007 at 14:54.
I think if you want a unit that sits back and responds to threats, fire dragons are not what you want. Fire dragons are vulnerable, short-ranged and slow. They're a strike unit and that means you really need to mount them up and have them hunt targets rather than having units coming to them (because they won't. The dragons will die long before the enemy gets close enough).
You're looking at 100+ pts just sitting around doing nothing, which puts you at a disadvantage. It's more suicidal than sending them across the table to engage armoured targets.
Warp spiders would be a better choice for what you want - they're fast, still have high S weapons, tougher to kill (the all important 3+ save), and can be adapted to changing situations.
Having an army and not owning a rulebook is like owning a car with no steering wheel.Originally Posted by amishcellphone
I agree with what Rork said, I'de also like to add that you have to mount them in a transport for manuvrability and protection. I don't think that mounting 6 in a falcon is a good use of them, as they just murk one tank then die. I think maxin out the unit to 10, with no exarch, and mounting them in a serpent is the best way to use them. Hunt heavy hitters with them, stuff like termies, oblits, bikes and big bugs. Just make sure that once you've finished shooting to mount them back up in the serpent and move on to the next target.
10 in a serpent is great. I used it at a tourney a while back and they just take anything out. Always remember they don't need to hunt tanks. They are a cheap source of low ap firepower.
6 in a falcon is basically a guaranteed kill on a tank so if you come up against a russ or land raider or something they give you a quick kill. They are unlikely to make back their points but can seriously help a battle.
And 10 dragons in a serpent really kill monoliths.
But yes basically dragons really need a transport. Scorpions and occasionally (rarely) banshees are the only aspects that can go on foot.
Cool, Thanks for the advice guys. I guess there really isn't a way to get around not putting them in a serpent. I'm pretty sure I'm gonna have to go out and get one now. And, yah; Rork...I use Warp Spiders too, I love them!! They can do almost anything, they really aren't that bad at tank busting if its needed either.
Alright, thanks again I was really hoping I could get around the transport idea, lol, but I'll have to try the idea out.
Fire Dragons sport very potent weaponry that will turn any solid unit into a pile of slag; as such their role is specifically to dealing with Because of this their squad numbers rarely need to be more than six to ensure the destruction of a target. However their armour is relatively light and weapons at a short range meaning they need some form of enhanced movement or they may find themselves being cut down. Opposing jump pack infantry will prove Fire Dragons weak point when placed on foot. If they are to move on foot it’s a good idea to have your army create various threat locations so your opponent is divided between those tasks and your Fire Dragons. Units like Warp Spiders, Jetbikes and Swooping Hawks are brilliant for this task; they also have the movement capabilities to aid the Fire Dragons should they be caught out. With a decent Ballistic Skill and weapons strength large squads Fire Dragons lend themselves to effectively eliminating large squads of heavily armoured infantry. They will prove deadly against Space Marines, Necrons and especially Thousand Sons Chaos Marines. With the aid of a Farseer the chances of them knocking out a whole squad in a single salvo is very likely. However if the Fire Dragons do not kill enough they may find themselves defenceless the following turn so it would be wise to have a second squad about to cover against anti-infantry shooting and possible assaults.
Fire Dragon Exarch:
The presence of an Exarch enables the squad to better guarantee the destruction of armoured units. Unlike the close combat aspects his presence isn’t as vital to the effectiveness of the squad since they a purely short ranged shooting unit which the Fire Dragons alone are quite capable of. Because his available upgrades are relatively low cost he can afford all or most of them quite easily.
This is an extended Fusiongun. The longer barrel improves the weapons range and armour penetration capabilities. Highly valuable weapon when on foot as weapons range reaching the opponent may prove a struggle, the inclusion of a Firepike improves the chances of hitting an armoured units. However when in a transport the Firepike may not prove much of a use as the extensive movement a skimmer provides is for more the sufficient for Fusionguns to reach their target.
While Fusionguns are limited to being effective against small solid units the Dragons breath promotes itself to dealing the large squads of infantry. This will increase the squads choice in targets, when combined with a transport the weapon can be effectively be bought to use. Without a transport it may prove difficult to bring the weapon into range.
When combining this power with a Fusiongun or Firepike it will enable the Exarch a very high chance of knocking down a vehicle, but because there’s a whole squad of Fusionguns accompanying him this power will prove of little use. However because the squad in general lacks the shooting rate to deal with large squads of infantry this Crack Shot is highly useful when put to use with a Dragons Breath as each wound becomes more vital.
Very useful power to have as it greatly improves the chances of the Squad in knocking out a vehicle when out of half range. More useful when presented to foot slogging Fire Dragons as their chances of reaching 6” towards a vehicle without fleet of foot is very unlikely.
The Wave Serpent:
When a Falcon is not an available option then the Wave Serpent is always an option. Having this will utilise the “Drive and Drop” strategy and with the capacity to house a large squad of Fire Dragons they will be able to dish out enough shots to threaten heavy infantry and the toughest of all creatures. Being a skimmer also grants the squad access to almost any part of the field within a single movement phase if not two. The presence of a Wave Serpent also adds a highly mobile weapons platform to the battlefield. Because Fire Dragons aren’t suited to remaining in the front lines by themselves or act as shock troopers the option to act as long range support unit your army is in place will prove invaluable if you want a constant hail of fire. With the excessive movement capabilities it is very easy for the squad to catch up to the rest of the army. Having a carrier at their command also means they can sit back and wait for opposing transports to draw near, the chances of them moving less than 6” is very unlikely thus you can entangle passengers to finish them off at your leisure.
This is your best chance of having them sit back to counter units otherwise moving forwards on foot is the only other way I'd use them since they simply don't have the movement capabilities to take on such a task. Note mounting them in a Falcon is popular choice as oppose to a dedicated transport.
Foot-slogging eldar is possible. This uses no tanks whatsoever.
The idea is to create several threats, harlequins are basically a must. Infiltrating scorpions fill the next elite slot then usually banshees in the 3rd. Fire dragons COULD do it I guess.
A lot of guardians and avengers as troops. Warp spiders and hawks to back them up. Avatar leading the army.
However that requires a very specific army and I would have to say, just buy a wave serpent. Its easier and more effective.
Yah...I've got a pretty balanced army. I'm probably going to start fielding Wraithguard at higher points games, but I was just making sure there wasn't a good way to footslog Fire Dragons. My one plan (that I haven't tried yet) is to move them behind the my Avatar and scorpions, or even my wraithlord. That way I can make my opponent have to make a tough decision on what they truly want to shoot at, and either way it'll be hard to take out all the squads, plus I'll have back up for from my prism cannon, vypers, falcons, and a couple star cannons.
I usually field:
Two squads of Guardians w/starcannons
squad of 6 Sorpions w/ exarch that has scorpion claw
sometimes Fire Dragons
squads of Warpies w/exarch
two vypers (one with b-lance and one with missle launcher (for the range))
Wraithlord w/starcannon and scater laser
Everything else is varied depending on the points, but that is pretty much the skeletal version of my lists. *shrugs* Last time I was at a tournament I was without my scorpions...so I'm excited for my next one with them.
i'm not eldar, but i learned something that may be usefull by playing against them. they can be used as a sort of insurence unit. what i mean by this is that offensive/ very mobile enemy vehicals, such as say a close combat dreadnought will get up close to you, making it easy for the fire dragons to respond. be carefull though of things like heavy flamers. also, if you advance them on foot behind some other squads(maybe dire avengers or a wraith lord or whatever you crazy eldar kids are into now a days) of yours that are getting close to the enemy, your opponent will either not notice/ forget that your tiny 5 man fire dragon squad is there. also, the other units may make them over look a small fire dragon squad.
That is not dead which may eternal lie,
for in strange aeons even death may die.
Feel free to try out dragons on foot. Post any tips you find out on here.
Theres always room to try and learn new things.