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I commonly play BT and have faced crusaders with blessed hulls many times. Everyone agrees that a crusader is a pain the butt to play against especially when you are playing with a race such as dark edlar where its weakest guns can take down our tanks. So my question, does anyone has any really good suggestions of how to kill these things ESPECIALLY when they have blessed hull???
I already tried lancing it, but as stated before...it has blessed hulls so all our lances can ever do is scratch glances its armor on a 6+ dmg roll.
I also tried using haywire grenades which dont always guarantee success even though they do have the highest chance of killing it outright. And then even if you kill it, your wyches just remain there near the tanks, standing like idiots, waiting to get destroyed in the next shooting phase. So in the end you loose a wych unit in exchange for his crusader...if the oponent is smart enough to shoot them when they are most vulnerable.
I also tried ignoring it, but thats easier said then done especially when it destroyed half of your army before you can ever get to it. Ignoring monolith is one thing, but a LR crusader CANT be ignored with its 6 twin bolters, twin assault and melta weapons.
I also tried using bikes, but then AGAIN, it has blessed hull so blasters are useless and agoniser can only do some much on its 6+ glance, so bikes are the stupidest of all choices. I cant believe I actually tried them...how foolish of me.
I also tried just massing all my fire on it, and just like all other options...didnt turn out too good for me
SOOOO, any GOOD ideas???
Last edited by Caluin; March 11th, 2007 at 17:23.
i can see where u are coming from, and i can see you are pained by it. it really sucks, eh?
to be brutally honest, you have tried so much and still grasping for straws, it seems your luck against this specific vehicle/friends model is...... shockingly horrible.
i 'spose its fair to say your friend has had a good laugh at your attempts, and has become a little cocky about the situation, yes? was his LR Crusaders' movements a little predictable? try let his arrogance concerning the vehicles invulnerability get the better of him, and spring a phat trap- something along the lines of, well, make your army not so threatening, then jam half your army in his face in a position in that, if the vehicle dies, you gain great benefit from its smoking carcass
i read you have tried wyches with haywire, did you give the succubus the goblet of spite? maybe that would help get the hits you need to glance more?
its a difficult situation, and as you said, it aint as easy to ignore as one might think, yet you are quick, fake yourself a bit- make it look like you wanna ignore it, use your speed to run- but actually, let him believe you are scared, and he'll possibly become too confident. then smack him with everything at once. sometimes it works, often it doesnt- but better to unload everything at once, rather than try scratch it every turn.
reminds me of a Khorne DP i used to fight. it kept tearing my guardsman apart, with its speed and savagness. but, over time, he became over confident- and eventually, he was so confident as to want to charge earlier than neccessary- lets just say the light show that followed put him back in the box of course, he learnt his lesson, and later took feel no pain. so i force weaponed him. so he takes collar of khorne.... so i take a few more meltaguns and die-hards....
problem is, the Blessed LR vs DE situation doesnt evolve. either you get lucky, or not. you havent got lucky yet, hopefully soon u'll roll some darn 6's to glance!
*EDIT: hopfully u'll roll some 6's on the glance*
i cant think of anything else to help. it is a onesided problem. and annoying at that.
Hm.. sounds pretty bad.
This is coming for a once-wannabe-dark eldar player. My best guess would be deepstriking units somewhere close. Hellions for example, albeit expensive units, could charge and use hit n run. Also,they could deepstrike somewhere near. Use a unit of 3
I was going to say Jetbikes. Or even a Wych squad with haywires. But you've tried those. I'm not a rulesbuff, but wouldn't like 10 wyches, scaling nets AND screaming jets be an ideal assault thing for a tank like that? By rulesbuff I mean.. I don't know if you can deepstrike, disembark and assault. Also... after assault you could embark... but I'm not sure how that stuff all works out. But then again, it's a real pointsink too.
Also, you could get behind the Crusader more easy. Thus giving you more decent cover.
Regarding the Hellions.. I do know you can't deepstrike and fire, thus a combination of 1 blaster, hell glaive and a succubus with haywires doesn't work out, at least, the blaster doesn't. Although you could deepstrike somewhere within say... 12 to 18 inches behind cover even... and next turn make a move, fire the blaster and assault with the 'nades. But there's
But I do think wyches give it a bigger chance of succeeding cause of the amounts of haywires they can take. There should be at least a 6 in it? Another note would be to make sure the other stuff in your army is more interesting to fire at.
I'd say take wyches with with a raider and deepstrike. But yeah.. I don't know how it rules-wise would work exactly
One word - Kroot.
Hate to sound like a broken record but have you tried a squad of Kroot vultures that would get 4 attacks (on the charge) with a master-crafted eviscerator (chain-fist)? My kroot have NEVER failed to destroy any tank they come in contact with (of course that is the trick though, getting into cc with a tank). I would gladly trade the kroot to destroy this vessel of doom.
Other than kroot, the squad of 5 wyches with haywires and the goblet of spite seem to be the only answer other than kroot. Personally, I wouldnt mind of sacrificing a 200 point unit to destroy a 250+ point target - so sacrificing wyches or kroot is fine by me.
I dont think there is a "free ride" on this one, you gotta sacrifice and just deal with it.
I am asking cause I was supposed to play an extreme 40k battle with 1 HQ, 1 ELITE, 3 TROOPS, 1 FAST and 1 HEAVY choice.
I turned out to be facing 5 LR crusaders and standard LR from his BT army. He took the crusaders as troop, elite, HQ, and fast transports so when I found out that I would be facing all of them with blessed hulls, I simply withdrew from battle as this is one pathetic fight that wouldnt be worth fighting.
In the end he started complaining about why I didnt want to play him, hmm I wonder why? tisk tisk!!!
HA! that guy smells funny, mabey you should have just borrowed a different army from a friend, and drop pod an entire uber-melta-corps marine list, just to rub in the fact that he upgraded 5 (!!!!!!) LR for Lance protection.
5 LAND RAIDERS!!!!!!!
now, i have played pure grey knights against a 3x LR Black Templars army, obviously i would get cremed, and i did, but i played for the fun of such an uphill battle.....
but DE vs 5 (!!!!) BLESSED LR, thats rediculous!
but good on you for not playing. its definately a waste of time, and im glad to hear he started whinging about "Why wont you play me boo-hoo whinge."
Rep Given 2u :yes:
EDIT: good on you Cal for highlighting 'destroyed', it adds necessary emphasis
was there no points limit?
cause i can see taking a dual force org chart, kitted out to the nines with raiders and 5 man dl squads as a distinct possiblity, you get a lot of different targets with the 5 man squads deployed seperatly to the raiders, and for +5 points. with so many pooints locked up in LRC's he wont have much chance to kill all those squads and raiders.
I mean you get 2.5 squads per LRC, then you could also take some raider wyches with the suc having melta bombs, and two blasters. such things as those, and surely, SURELY his LRC's have to die!!! and of course surroud the LRC's so the marines in side can't escape....
on a side note. i think we might have found our use for scourges.... but ravagers are still tempting...
Scourges would have been useless since the they would need a 6+ to glance, and they would have absolutely no mobility.
As for wyches, yes they would probably kill one LR with haywires but would then get torn apart by the others.
Point is, even with all these things taken into account, that fight wouldnt be worth fighting as the only army that would have any chance beating them in anihilate type mission would be imperial guard.
Yeah that is really lame, because some armies can really abuse not having a point limit for that reason. Dark eldar can't really abuse it so they get the short end of things there. Maybe use a points limit next time.
Prey they don't take you alive