Eldar Tactics Vs. Nids and Necrons - Warhammer 40K Fantasy
 

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  1. #1
    Senior Member Shiz_Vaerth's Avatar
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    Eldar Tactics Vs. Nids and Necrons

    HI, I'm fairly new to playing but no stranger to watching and planning and I realise that the two biggest threats to my army are the Nid and Necron armies two of my friends have. When I have it prepared I will put up our army lists, but until then does anyone have any general hints and/or army choices I should have?

    Last edited by Shiz_Vaerth; April 19th, 2007 at 05:33. Reason: typo
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  3. #2
    Son of LO psichotykwyrm's Avatar
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    Well, without seeing your list its hard to get definitive, but I can give ya some general tips against Necrons.

    If he has Destroyers, take them out first with whatever long-range weaponry ya have first. Destroyers will demolish your troops if you leave them in the open, so take cover when you can.

    Howling Banshees and Harlequins can easily come out on top in CC, so lock up as fast as you can. If you're able to take out the Necron Lord in CC, then do so. Get rid of that Resurrection Orb as soon as possible.

    Remember we Necrons phase out when you kill 75% of the "Necron" models. So focus on killing his Warriors. Most Necron lists will have a majority of Warriors. This would be pretty easy with a prism cannon.

    Holofields should keep his Heavy Destroyers from pwning your grav tanks.

    Keep your vehicles out of range/sight of as many of his weapons as possible. Even if they don't have sufficient strength to glance/penetrate, gauss automatically glances on a 6 to hit. There are very few times were a vehicle survived my Warriors rapid-firing.

    Beware the Veil of Darkness. While most players may use this as an escape option, someone a little gutsier(or maybe crazy like myself) will use it to teleport a unit behind you. This uses deepstrike rules, so if you keep your units spread out enough, it will make it too dangerous to try to Veil around. This will also keep him from being able to deepstrike a monolith into the middle of your army.

    Avoid the Monolith. Remember that you get no bonus penetration against it, so only weapons with a S9 can penetrate(or S8 AP1), and S8 can only glance(unless AP1). And that's only if you roll a SIX!! It's Flux Arc can hit any unit within 12" d6 times at S5 AP4. So if you can't take it out just avoid it like the plague. You're better off just trying to phase him out.

    Hope that helps, just don't let your buddy playing Necrons know that their is a traitor amonst our ranks.... *looks about shiftily*
    Last edited by psichotykwyrm; April 30th, 2007 at 08:33.
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  4. #3
    The Fallen Cheredanine's Avatar
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    411 (x8)

    As above really, the problem is the varriety avvailable to Eldar, if yuou can tell us what is in your army then we can help, ideally if you can give us a clue what sort of army they play it would help too
    Everything you have been told is a lie!


  5. #4
    I AM the Evil Twin! Jared van Kell's Avatar
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    Against Nids I have found the best solution is to prioritise your firepower as much as possible. Here is some advice.

    1.Kill the small ones.

    Though the larger monsters can be distracting, they are usually used by tyranid players to administer the killing blow so you really do not need to worry about them too much in the early stages of the game (unless of course your opponant has taken a winged hive tyrant).
    Hormagaunts and Genestealers have high number of attacks and can move very quickly across the board which can really hurt your smaller elite units. Try to maximise the amount of time you have to fire at them by targeting units at the limit of your range so that your opponant has to remove units from the front rather than from the rear as the extra inches could mean the difference between them arriving at your lines in turn 3 or turn 4.
    Raveners can also be a real thorn in your side as they are very fast moving and can support the advance of the smaller Nids so some attention should be paid towards taking them out.

    2. Try to break up their synapse network.

    As everyone knows Tyranids rely on their Synapse creatures to keep them together and in the fight. Taking them out is usually a good idea but not always easily done.
    Instead of going for the Hive Tyrant with a few Tyrant Guard protecting it, go for the softer, easier to kill creatures such as Tyranid warriors, Zoanathropes and if possible winged Tyrants as this can isolate entire broods potentially taking them out of the game. Dark Reapers can excell in this role.
    Basically life sucks, there is only war and you're probably gonna get eaten by Tyranids, have fun.

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  6. #5
    Senior Member dymew's Avatar
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    Having played tyranids for the past few years I've noticed that the following are mistakes that my opponents make that give me a large advantage.

    I agree with Jared in that you should be most careful of his small and quick units. Everything on a small base in the 'Nid army can basically fleet, so you need to consider that even though he looks far, those bugs will be comming in faster than you think. The most devastating blow a tyranid player can inflict is to get into CC with 2 or more units as this blocks firelanes allowing the slower elements of his army to advance.

    IF you don't have enough shots to kill the small bugs, destroying the synapse net is a good option. HOWEVER, note that almost everything synapse has a 2+ save so unless ur packing in the lances, it'll take more than 1 turn to burn down the net. Any tyranid player worth his/her salt will also have a very well build network, with 3-5 synapse nodes that all must be destroyed before the network falls apart.

    Dark Reapers are NOT very effective against any synapse creatures besides warriors due to the 2+ save, I'd swap them out for a 6x scatterlaser warwalker group.

    You can use your skimmers as a mobile wall to block his assault lanes and delay assault for a turn or two, which can be gamebreaking. Whatever you do, do not assault genestealers, there's very little in the eldar list that can beat a genestealer group. Just shoot the stealers. Eldar will tend to outshoot tyranids unless he's fielding multiple dakka fexes so use your superior firepower to your advantage.

    Other than that, I can't provide any more advise until you provide us with a list.
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  7. #6
    Senior Member MurekZar's Avatar
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    I play Eldars and 'Nids... Coming back on the synapse-breakdown strategy :

    1. This strategy will not be effective against all Tyranid armies, but only against those fielding and relying mainly on Gaunts / Hormagaunts. Other units are either not dependant on the Synaptic field (Genestealers and Ripper Swarms...) or have high Ld, so their Instinctive Behavior test is likely to succeed (Raveners, Gargoyles), or are Fearless (Lictors, Carnifexes).

    2. Taking out the Synaptic figs :

    Quote Originally Posted by dymew View Post
    IF you don't have enough shots to kill the small bugs, destroying the synapse net is a good option. HOWEVER, note that almost everything synapse has a 2+ save so unless ur packing in the lances, it'll take more than 1 turn to burn down the net. Any tyranid player worth his/her salt will also have a very well build network, with 3-5 synapse nodes that all must be destroyed before the network falls apart.
    I do not fully agree with this, it's a bit more complicated...

    2+ saves come on the Zoanthropes which may have the Synapse power, or may not, depending on what option your opponent has chosen. Be sure to check this before you deploy... Apart from the high Sv, the Zoans are relatively easy to kill (medium T, "only" 2 wounds...)

    A 2+ save may have been taken (at a cost) by the Hive Tyrant, either as armour or as a Mind Power. Check this too before you start... Due to his high T, large number of wounds and possibly Guard retinue, the Hive Tyrant is certainly very tough to get down...

    The other Synapses (Broodlord, Warriors) cannot have 2+ saves. Maximum save on a Warrior is 4+ if he has extra armour (not allowed for winged ones, though...).


    So before choosing a synapse-breakdown strategy you have to :
    - identify if your opponent army really relies on synapses
    - if that is the case, identify where the synapses are, and how resilient they are.

    Getting the synapse net down is not easy, and not necessarily crippling...

    Hope this helps...

  8. #7
    Senior Member dymew's Avatar
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    It's true that pulling down the entire net may not be detrimental depending on your opponent's army composition. Yes genestealers and rippers do not have to take Inscintive Behavior tests, but everything else does. Being fearless does not exclude you from these tests, you simply don't fall back but lurk instead. And making your opponent take leadership tests all his creatures, something is likely to fall back. Nothing like seeing a fully kitted Fex lurking because he failed his IB test.

    One thing I always see if people forgetting to take their IB tests because their opponents don't remind them and they either don't remember or choose to ignore it. Make SURE that you make your opponents take every IB test that they're required to do. It could be the difference between a 2nd turn charge and a 3rd turn wipe.

    Also, I suggest going after synapse only if you find that you don't have enough guns to kill all the small gaunts; such a large number of gaunts usually indicates that he's using a synapse net to support those gaunts.

    Zoans are only relatively easy to kill if you shoot them with AP2 weapons, anything less and those shots are most likely going to waste.

    Warriors I found shouldn't be depended as a base for your synapse net. They're simply too fragile, unless fielded in large units (5+ warriors) where you have enough non-insta-killable wounds so soak up some damage. Then again they're still T4 4+ wounds so a good volley from avengers will really put up the hurt. If your opponent is taking warriors as a basis for his synapse net, and not as a support unit for his hormagaunts, then I suggest putting shots into the warriors to kill them since they go down easy.
    Dreams give us a vision of a world unlike any we have seen. They present us with a glimpse of a better life; a goal to aspire to, and in the face of insurmountable odds, they provide us with the power to overcome, to live on, and to succeed where we would have otherwise failed.

  9. #8
    Member thorn_in_your_side's Avatar
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    i wouldn't aprove of you putting up other peoples army lists, with out permition. i'm the nids player who shiz vearth is talking about. try using large blast weapons against the tyranids, a gaunt is the same streangth and toughness as a guardian. use that as a model, genestealers are a tactical marine, and a hive tyrant just screams "kill me"
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    Son of LO psichotykwyrm's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by thorn_in_your_side View Post
    i wouldn't aprove of you putting up other peoples army lists, with out permition.
    Not to sound rude or indignant, but when did an army list become some kind of TOP SECRET document? You do realize that if asked, you must show your list to your opponent(s) before a game, right? Your army list is a public document. Kinda. If you are relying on surprise to win a game, you might wanna ask for tips from this nice community here, like your buddy did. Plenty of friendly advice to go around.

    Sorry if this sounds kinda mean, can't think of a better way to phrase it all right now.
    "It takes a vast amount of self control to be this dangerous."
    ---Ogvai Ogvai Helmshrot, Jarl of Tra, VI Legion Astartes

  11. #10
    Senior Member Seth the Dark's Avatar
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    I would say Dark Reapers are your best bet against both armies right now since their weapons can take out most Necrons and the harder to kill Tyranids.
    "They say the Darkness consumes you. They don't say what happens after It's done."

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