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i was at my local hobby store and after a game i was talking to a fellow tau player and a guy who's been in 40k since before it was 40k. and we were discussing armies that tau have problems with. the first one said was two drop podding librarians with fear of the darkness. i concluded later on that a full mech army would stem most of that attack but what about protecting crisis suits? and does the librarian need line of site to cause the moral checks, or is it anything within 12"?
the second army was a nid army with all the monsterous creaturs. this one im not shure about because im not familar with nids so can anyone tell me what that type of army would consist of? or better yet good tactics?
p.s. i play an all comers hybrid list that has more mobile elements then static.
Never give up. Never give up. HIT, HIT, HIT, HIT!
I think your right about mech, seal em up and move em around and he wont have much to scare away. For crisis suits I only take commanders up to 1500 so far, so they can usually just pass those, I'd be more afraid of the libby's squad shooting him. Monstrous creatures are kinda annoying I guess, they can take a lot of punishment and venom cannons only glance anyhow so your vehicles arent really at an advantage. They're slow tho, so just pound the flying tyrant if he brings one, and any small quick things, and you can keep your distance from the rest. You should be able to move out of range (36" on his potent weapons) if you deploy on one side and make a 12" lateral move every turn.
There are few armies that will NOT have trouble with 2 FotD Librarians. The Librarians do not need LOS with that power. The best way to handle it is to refuse to play, in my opinion. Mech is the way to fight it; spread your suits out and consider deepstriking them more than you normally would. The positional relay can help with this.
The ol' Tyranid Gozilla list consists of two Tyrants, 3-6 Carnifexes depending on game size, and minimal other models. It is very hit or miss vs Tau, very slow, easily outmaneuvered by both skimmers and suits...but it can still get lucky. Focus on killing one at a time; losing even one will really hurt the Tyranid player. Broadsides with stabilizers will have a field day!
Flip through the Codexes for both Marines and Tyranids when you can. Know thy enemy.
Is there any particular reason you're worried about these two armylists? Both are fairly rare.
"My tanks have names, my men have numbers." -Col. Edmund Grahvess, 23rd Kronecker Prison Guard
As pointed out, both lists are rare, but I figured I would point out some particular threats in the nidzilla list Although you should be able to outmanuever most of the big nasties, a flying tyrant properly equiped can be hell to take down, even with tau weaponry, and will have his own field day with whatever he closes on, like oh.... battlesuits come to mind. Don't count out the fexs though, a dakka fex can bring a squad of warriors or kroot down quick, and can even spam enough fire on your devilfish and pirahnahs to do some damage, although its range is somewhat limited. 8 high strength shots that reroll hits and wounds is bad for tau health. The venom cannon/barbed strangler combo is more ranged, and cause pinning, so don't leave your warriors out too long.
As far as the DSing Libies, short of calling cheese and not playing, all you can do is try and get your suits and tanks to shoot them up during the turn they are stationary after deepstriking. Hopefully you can kill off most of his squad, and maybe cause a wound on the libbie if you are lucky. Also, as far as this list goes, he has to hope both squads come in same turn. They can arrive piecemiel and be taken as such.
Hope this helps.
Battlesuits, putting the BS in BullS*%t.
The real pain in the ass is Tigurius that dude doubles the range of his FOTD, thats every unit within 24" but again he has no inv save and is expensive.
I actually have very rarely seen a marine player who uses deep strike FOTD because it is very risky and places the librarian in a very bad position if it fails
Zilla nid lists are actually not that bad for Tau, I would rather see one of these deployed than a fast assault based list anyday.
We have ample weaponry to take these down and even a fully tricked out carnie can be taken down, the trick is to use enough low AP weapons fusion, plasma, rail guns, remember the best save a Carnie can get is 2+ (beaten by every weapon I listed) and have no access to invulnerable saves, max tgh is 7 but only if they take the expensive bonded exo, so tgh 6 is more common and thats still 2+ to wound for the rail and fusion and 4+ for the plasma and thats not bad.
Best tip is to take down the synapse, usually a tyrant and/or warriors, this really helps against any Nid list even zilla's, the carnie may be fearless but it still has to take instinctive behaviour tests if its out of synapse range.
This is also a major weakness of zilla lists to keep the army in synapse control the synapse creatures have to stay close so their mobility is sometimes restricted, so use the Tau mobility to keep safe.
Another strength Tau have is superior weapons range Deathrains are really good against nids , force enough hits and saves will be lost, target the synapse creatures first with as much high strength low AP weapons as possible (deathrains are brilliant for taking down Warriors).
I find a more assault orientated fast Nid list is always much harder to counter, especially because the vast majority of Nid assault units can move horrendously fast and even skimmer based Tau list have a hard time, a winged Tyrant with twin twin linked devourers is murderous for Tau, but again the key is the synapse, remember Nids are only insta kill immune, do not need to roll tests etc if they are in synapse range, remove synapse and its a lot easier.
my mate uses Nids and he never seems to have trouble with synapse range. any idea were i can read about it on the Nid's forum?? I don't have the codex and don't wanna seem like I'm saying he's cheating until I can prove it!!!
He seems to think that fearless creatures automatically pass synapes test. what about lictors? do they need synapse?
If a unit is n synapse range they pass any LDS test automatically (not psychic or target priority tests), they automaticaly rally if they fall back into synapse and multi wound creatures in synapse range cannot be insta killed (nasty).
This link takes you to a thread that answers a lot of questions:http://www.librarium-online.com/foru...-tyranids.html
This link takes you to the GW Nid FAQ which is also helpful:
GW Online : Download Agreement
but basically if a Carnie or Lictor is out of synapse range it has to pass an instinctive behaviour test to move, if it fails it has to lurk, if it lurks it can fire, the fearless rule means it does not have to fall back but it cannot move, also a Carnie can not benefit from the +1 to a cover save when lurking because it is a monstrous creature.
Lictors do need to be in Synapse to auto pass LDS tests, but they do not test for instinctive behaviour on the turn they land (they already moved when DS'ing) and they can assault as normal when DS'ing but if not in synapse range and they lost the assault they would test as per a normal unit losing an assault.
If the Lictor is not in synapse range the turn after it DS's it would have to take an instinctive behaviour test, it would lurk if it failed and would gain +1 to its already impressive cover save (to a max of 2+) and would not be able to assault.
Basically kill the synapse as quick as possible
Hope that helps
Most Nidzilla armies will not require synapse. I run all MC's once in awhile in my Nid list. It consists of the following:
1 CC flying hive tyrant
1 Shooty walking hive tyrant w/ tyrant guard
6 units of Ripper Swarms w/ 12" assault (no synapse required for these beauties)
3 Flying Warriors w/ rending
3 Shooty Fexes w/ 2+ armor save and Toughness 7
So, synapse doesn't matter much though it could slow down the fexes a bit if it gets killed off. I would suggest just trying to outmaneuver the list and take down one MC at a time.
-Thread Killer Bryan
Tyranid Hive Fleet Typhoeus
T'au Empire, Bork'an Sept
and thanks everyone for the help. cleared up alot of things. now i know what to do.
Never give up. Never give up. HIT, HIT, HIT, HIT!
Here's why zilla lists are not that good
Ignore the walking tyrant for now
Carnies are over rated, they are slow and fall to low AP weapons, especially ones that are carried by units they cannot hope to catch.
Like I said a fast assault based list or balanced fast assault / shooty list is a lot more frightening than a zilla list.