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    Rending Bio-plasma

    There seems to be a consensus in the gaming community that the bio-plasma biomorph attack does not get the rending property if the model has rending claws. Earlier editions of the games have had FAQs saying bio-plasma does not rend.

    However, the way the rules word rending claws and bio-plasma in 4th ed tyranid codex, they acually couldn't be clearer in that it does indeed rend under these cercumstances, without acually saying it as part of an example.

    So what to do? Does it rend in your games? Have I somehow misinterpeted the rules? Does everyone just assume that because it didn't rend in 3rd ed, it doesen't in 4th ed either?
    Rending bio-plasma on warriors is too interesting to ignore..while being to lousy without the rending to even contemplate. Thus I need an answer before I start assembling my models. :p


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    Son of LO psichotykwyrm's Avatar
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    I know that the rule only mentions MC characteristics as an example, but I'm fairly certain that bio-plasma only gets +1S, double initiative, and always hits on 4+. Period.
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    It's a Trap! Warrior47's Avatar
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    While it is a bit unsportsman like IMO and I seriously doubt that a tournament will allow it, by RAW, bio-plasma does get rending as the rending rules states that all cc attacks are rending.


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    Son of LO psichotykwyrm's Avatar
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    443 (x8)

    And RAW, MC CC attacks ignore armor saves, and get 2d6 armor penetration. But yeah, this situation is already covered in the bio-plasma rule. Maybe the MC stuff was negated to make sure this wasn't used a an "Ultimate CC Skimmer Killshot". Though it is still nifty against the skimmers.
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    Quote Originally Posted by psichotykwyrm View Post
    I know that the rule only mentions MC characteristics as an example, but I'm fairly certain that bio-plasma only gets +1S, double initiative, and always hits on 4+. Period.

    The rule doesent mention the MC exception as an example at all. It is a very spesific wording, leaving no room to interpit it as an example. This is part of what makes the rule that it does rend so clear.
    Last edited by draxshared; July 17th, 2007 at 17:00.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Warrior47 View Post
    While it is a bit unsportsman like IMO and I seriously doubt that a tournament will allow it, by RAW, bio-plasma does get rending as the rending rules states that all cc attacks are rending.
    Why is a rending bio-plasma attack unsportsman like, while an armour ignoring pistol shot in cc for 1 pt is not (on a model with a power weapon)?
    While I do doubth that bio-plasma is intended to be able to rend, based on the history of the game and the way the producers seem to think, I see absolutely no reason at all why it would be unsportsan-like for it to rend.

    1 extra rending attack on a very expensive model with in a unit with an extremely low model count is in no way unsetteling for the game in any way whatsoever. It mearly makes an widely unused and precieved counter-productive option interesting and perhaps viable.


    *Edit*
    Are there any guidelines for what a tournament can change in the rules? I'm not making my army primeraly for tournaments, but it would be nice to know beforehand..

    I guess I should write to them rulesboys and ask 3-4 times about whether it rends or not. Do they answer email? I suspect calling them from my location would cost more than a double set of warriors would.. :p
    Last edited by draxshared; July 17th, 2007 at 04:35.

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    It's a Trap! Warrior47's Avatar
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    It would be unsportsman like IMO precisely because it is fairly obvious that it wasn't intended to rend. The same went for ranged implant attacks attacks in 3rd edition. By RAW it was allowed, but that wasn't what it was made for. It isn't an arguement of balance.

    *Edit*
    Are there any guidelines for what a tournament can change in the rules? I'm not making my army primeraly for tournaments, but it would be nice to know beforehand..

    I guess I should write to them rulesboys and ask 3-4 times about whether it rends or not. Do they answer email? I suspect calling them from my location would cost more than a double set of warriors would.. :p
    Most people don't even bother with rulez boyz. Very often you won't get the same answer more than once as you get different people answering and their answers aren't recorded for future reference.

    Essentially, tournaments can change whatever they please. A tournament could say all your models have to be a shade of pink to play and you can only have 1 troops choice. That isn't what you have to worry about though. The reason it might not be allowed in a tournament is because your opponent may put up a fuss and a judge may rule against you. Anyway, RAW technically allows it, so as long as the people you play with are okay with it, it should be fine.

    Here's an idea though to solve both problems. You have 2 sets of heads per warrior. Give one bioplasma and one without it. Then put 2 pieces of wire sticking out or a small magnet in the neck so that you can swap out heads. (the wire then requires matching holes in the head and the magnet obviously needs another magnet in the head, so the wire may be easier and more feasible) Then you can change at will.


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    No rending with bio plasma....Yes all close combat bio morphs can be used together at once, but Bio plasma is not a close combat bio morph, you will notice it is listed in Bio morph enhancements section, notice how you cant use implant attack with bio plamsa either

    But go easy on draxshared, one day eventually GW will release a codex that is straight forward with no major mistakes in and rules that are clearly defined...and we will all die of shock.
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    Unfortunately, when GW releases that Codex for the Tyranids, we'll all be fielding Combat Broods and things will be jacked up in price and come with way more biomorphs than we want and we won't be able to customize them anymore, etc. etc. etc. (read: they'll DarkAngelfy us). So let's hope we get to keep our poorly worded codex for another 5 years at least please.

    That said,

    The reason the pistol argument bothers me is that pistols combined with power weapons don't get to have one of their attacks go at double initiative and hit no matter what on a 4+, and you'll also note power weapons don't get to roll extra dice if they roll a 6 on a vehicle's pen roll. There are other issues with the argument, but those should appear most obvious to the average reader.

    Trying to claim rending bio-plasma would somehow be just the same as 2nd ccw using power weapon statistics is just plain stupid. OUR equivalent for that is Scything Talons becoming rending due to rending claws ... 2nd ccw gaining rending b/c of the rending claws = 2nd ccw gaining power due to the power sword. Bio-Plasma is it's own thing. It's a spit from the dude's mouth on the way in. It's practically a 0.5" ranged attack. Move along (not that it hasn't already been lain to rest, but that comparison bugged me a lil).
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    Quote Originally Posted by Warrior47 View Post
    It would be unsportsman like IMO precisely because it is fairly obvious that it wasn't intended to rend. The same went for ranged implant attacks attacks in 3rd edition.
    This is what it's all about isn't it. They have previously stated that bio-plasma doesen't rend in earlier editions, so it has a history. It makes most of us have a preconception that it's not supposed to rend.
    The fact is that it's not obvious ut should not rend. No more so than rending ST or armour ignoring pistol shots/slams. You could make a lot of arguments as to why ST or pistols should rend or ignore armour, but you could easily make the same with bio-plasma. The only thing that makes it "obvious" is the history of the game. "It didn't rend before so it's obvious it still shouldn't."

    The problem now is that the rules so clearly states that it now does rend. What makes everyone so sure it's not an intentional change? The only one thing I've found to indicate it's not intentional, is the rules text of Scything Talons(and that is a weak indication indeed).

    *edit*
    Remember that there tend to be alot of ppl that for all purposes are just asking "surely this is a mistake" with every new edition of the game. ..Whereas the most common FAQ answer for all purposes is "No it's not a mistake, it's a new edition with new rules."


    Quote Originally Posted by Warrior47 View Post
    It isn't an arguement of balance.
    Ok, I'll buy that one.



    Quote Originally Posted by Warrior47 View Post
    Here's an idea though to solve both problems. You have 2 sets of heads per warrior. Give one bioplasma and one without it. Then put 2 pieces of wire sticking out or a small magnet in the neck so that you can swap out heads. (the wire then requires matching holes in the head and the magnet obviously needs another magnet in the head, so the wire may be easier and more feasible) Then you can change at will.
    A fine solution indeed. Thanks man, I'll seriously consider doing it this way.
    However, it could also affect the rest of the armaments I choose for my warriors, so I fear I still have to take the outcome of this discussion into consideration when planning my models.
    Last edited by draxshared; July 17th, 2007 at 15:58.

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