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  1. #1
    Member LiefBlackclaw's Avatar
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    Ur'san Empire army book in the works

    I have been working on a new army book for few months now and have finished the first draft and need outside input. I will be posting bits and pieces of the book over the next couple weeks, but for now I will leave everyone with a basic overview of the origins of the Ur'san people. They are humans (Russians/polish) that were exiled during the reign of Boris goldgather before the Black Plague that ravaged the empire. Their flight took them to Kislev and their leader became corrupted by chaos. There was a split between loyalists and those tainted by chaos. After a desperate gambit the loyalists stop those corrupted, but are kicked out of Kislev after the many years they spent there. Of course they Ur'sans adopted many Kislev customs which I will get into later. This second flight brings them to an abandoned dwarven keep and setup camp only to be assaulted by orcs. Dwarves arrive in the Ur'sans darkest hour and help drive the orcs out. A peace treaty is agreed upon and many customs are traded. The leader that had assumed command of the civilization decides that his people need their own lands and make their final flight over the worlds edge mountains and establish a bulwark against chaos with allies such as Nippon and the kingdoms of ind.

    Last edited by LiefBlackclaw; November 13th, 2012 at 02:51.
    "Surround yourself with the greatest warriors at your command, or cower in the deepest and darkest hole you can find. It matters not. I shall take your head for the Great Khan and for the Emperor!" Kor'sarro Khan White Scars 3rd Compnay

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  3. #2
    Benevolent Dictator CaptainSarathai's Avatar
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    Same question as always: why?
    I know it may seem a bit meanspirited of me to ask, seeing as I already worked out a good 90% of my Nippon book, but it's still something that I think everyone needs to ask themselves before jumping in on a project like this, and it will help us to give you better input if we know what the end-goal and the motives are.
    As soon as you said "Russian/Polish" I immediately jumped to Kislev. I was wondering if you'd forgotten about Kislev or how you were going to handle that one. Secondly, you flee over the World's Edge into the Badlands. That's mapped territory for Fantasy, and it's filled with nothing but Orcs, Goblins, a couple of Strigoi Vampires, and the Chaos Dwarfs.
    In historical context there's nothing really like that, so it's not like you're going to be able to base your army on something that's already there. There's never been any mention of the Ur'San in the Fantasy cannon either, so you've got nothing to build from. When I worked on the Nippon book, it was incredibly easy - it's feudal Japan, and even the existing GW fluff says that. I knew I'd be featuring Beastmen and that the realm was populated by humans, I knew that their neighbors were Cathayan/Chinese, GW pretty much green-lighted all of the realworld history, all I had to do was give it a Fantasy spin.

    So it's sort of obvious that you're not trying to fill a hole in the Fantasy variety - it's not like Matthias when he does books for places that GW has mentioned or established but hasn't released an army for, like Araby, Albion, Nippon, Cathay, Ind, Tilea, etc. or updating an old army like his Dogs of War and Kislev books.

    Are you trying to fill a hole with playstyle? That would be a viable option I suppose, but as I found with my Nippon book - getting a new playstyle out there is hard. Especially when you're limited to dealing with traditional human statlines. We already have Brettonia (cavalry humans) and the Empire (rounded humans), and even Warriors of Chaos (combat humans) to an extent, plus of you want to really dig there's Kislev.
    The real question I'm driving at is: why would I want to download your rules and collect your army? If you can't convince other people that they should play it, then it's a pet-project for you to use personally. That's fine, but it means that you can really do whatever you want with the army because hey- it's your baby. If it's something that you hope to one day see in general use at an IndyGT like the old ChaosDwarf book, then you're going to need to provide a lot of incentive for people to look at your army and see something different, and not just say, "Oh, it's just Empire/Dwarfs/Army____ with different models."
    Pts Values for AoS here!

    Nippon Armybook: Isuu, Scribd, and free at Google Docs

  4. #3
    Member LiefBlackclaw's Avatar
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    So the answer to why I am attempting to write an army book and the armies playstyle is stemmed from 8th edition rules that make initiative mean something. The army has a low Initiative, but has magic items and spells that hex the enemies Initiative. Plus the other aspect I am going for is a tough "good forces" army. The lower initiative balances out the higher toughness.

    I should have stated the Ur'san's fled over the Steppes mountains, which when I looked through the High Elves book at thier world map it showed that these lands were unknown.

    As far as your army being based on feudal Japan my attempt is based on 18th century Polish military units. Hussars, Cossaks, Kossars, Boyars, Tzars, etc.

    I already know that people are going to say well Kislev already has these things, but they Ur'san's passed through the Kislev lands and adopted many of their traditions. Plus the Kislevs are dead as far as I know.

    here are two units I have written out.

    Cossaks
    M-4 WS-3 BS-3 S-3 T-4 W-1 I-2 A-1 LD-6
    special rule: Characters cannot join, cossaks do not cause panic in other non-cossak units for fleeing or being destroyed.
    equipment: light armor, shield, spear

    Hussar Riders
    M-4 WS-4 BS-3 S-3 T-4 W-1 I-2 A-1 LD-7
    Special rules: cause fear on the charge
    equipment: Barded steed, heavy armor, shield, lance
    option: may exchange lance for an Ice sabre

    Ice Sabre- +1 S
    "Surround yourself with the greatest warriors at your command, or cower in the deepest and darkest hole you can find. It matters not. I shall take your head for the Great Khan and for the Emperor!" Kor'sarro Khan White Scars 3rd Compnay

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    Member LiefBlackclaw's Avatar
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    Today I will go over the two basic Lord choices the Ur'san army can field.

    Tzar
    A Tzar is the pinnacle of soldier in the Ur’san Empire second only to the Ice Queen and High Tzar, who make up the twin throne that rules over all Ur’sa. Not elected like other races, but forged in the crucible of battle. They act as leaders of the many city-states that make up a greater empire. The many duties a Tzar fills range from commanding massive armies to enforcing laws in capital cities and outlying provinces. A Tzar has many troops at his disposal to enact the High Tzar’s will, great axe wielding Kossars, winged lancers, cannons, and rifle rangers to name but a few of the tools with which Tzars crush any foe that may muster before them.
    While a Tzar commands entire armies, his true potential becomes manifest as he slays foe after foe. Truly a Tzar is a god of war, blows glancing harmlessly off plated armor and rune etched Ice sabres slicing enemy warriors clean through. Even in the maelstrom of battle a Tzar retains control of his warriors, calling out charges, commanding troops to hold, and directing artillery fire at fell beasts that would tear great gouges in the Ur’san battle line. It is with this supreme power of will that Ur’sa stands as a bulwark against all things evil.

    M/WS/BS/S/T/W/I/A/LD
    4/5/5/4/5/3/3/4/9

    Special rule: The unit a Tzar joins is Immune to psychology, but if they flee for any reason they will lose this bonus. The unit loses to bonus if the Tzar leaves to unit.
    May have a Great weapon, Ice Sabre, Additional Handweapon, or spear
    May wear Light Armor, Heavy armor, Plate armor, shield
    May ride Ur'san Charger which may have barding, Great Snow owl, Ice Bear
    May choose 100 points of Magic items and/or 1 Blessing of Callisto

    Tzarina
    While a Tzar commands the armies direct actions it is the Ice Tzarinas that care to a soldiers spiritual well being. When Ur’san armies are faced with despair and doubt it is the Ice Tzarinas that boost their spirits and remind them of the duties Callisto demands of each and every Ur’san. To battle evil without strength of conviction and resolve is to invite folly before fighting begins. Many wars thought lost have turned to victory with the aid of the Tzarinas.
    A Tzarina is not without her magical capabilities and though she is charged with the well being of Ur’san’s she can unleash a torrent of magical energy. Swirling snow storms tear at the enemy, spears made of diamond hard ice pierce warriors clean through, and entire formations are frozen solid. All these spells work in conjunction with friendly warriors to slow enemies down and hold them in place leaving them ripe for slaying.
    Tzarinas are truly an asset on any battlefield and without them Ur’sa would have fallen into chaos many generations ago, but their duties transcend even the war torn landscape of battle. A Tzarina shares dominion over her city-state with her Tzar. This balances a Tzars aggressive nature with temperance and patience allowing this ruling class to make sound decisions in governorship and war.

    M/WS/BS/S/T/W/I/A/LD
    4/3/3/3/4/3/2/1/8
    May be upgraded to level 4
    May ride an Ur'san charger which may have barding, or a Great Snow owl
    May choose up to 100 points of Magic Items

    Since I have included a magic user I will explain the Lore of Ice
    Perk: Every time an Enemy unit has Ice Magic successfully cast upon them add an Ice Token; target unit will receive a -1 Initiative modifier for each Ice token. This is cumulative, but will not lower Initiative below 1. At the beginning of your Opponents turn each Unit or Character must take a Strength test for each Ice Token on them. For each test passed remove an Ice Token.

    5+ Ice Blast- 24” Target Unit suffers D6 S4 hits.

    7+ Frost Armor- 18” Target Units gains a 5+ ward save.

    8+ Glacial Wall- 24” Place a 5” X 2” feature, with entire feature within 24’. Treat this feature as Dangerous terrain. If a unit moves through Glacial Wall they receive an Ice token.

    10+ Ice Breath- Flame Template. Every model touched by template suffers a S5 hit.

    14+ Ice Storm- Place an Ice Token on every enemy unit within 18 inches. The Ice Magic perk does not stack with this spell, but Items do.

    19+ Freeze!- 18” Target unit cannot Move, March, or Charge, must Hold, and is hit automatically until your next Magic phase.

  7. #5
    Benevolent Dictator CaptainSarathai's Avatar
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    What you have looks good, as far as rules are concerned. Not so sure about Cossack units not causing panic in their buddies, because from what I remember, the Cossacks weren't considered second-class citizens until WW2 and Stalin's move to 'Decossackize' them. In many cases, the Cossacks seemed to be pretty well liked and tasked with important missions within the Tsarist Russian military. I'd go so far as to switch it the other way: friendly, non-cossack units do not cause panic in Cossack units. That would represent their elitism, and also the fact that they hold themselves apart from the Russian/Polish units in your army rather than the other way around.

    The only other quip that I have is the T4 on what is otherwise "just a human". Toughness bumps are a pretty big deal in Warhammer. There are very few T4 humans outside of the Warriors of Chaos, and even the massive and barbaric Marauders are still only T3. For the most part, T4 is reserved for Lords/Named-Characters in human armies. The Warriors have the boosted toughness because they're mutants who ignore pain. There are no humans below I3.
    Your description for the army (tough goodguys, with lowIni and -Ini spells) made me think of Lizardmen and their penchant for using Shadow/Light to make themselves faster. As for location - are you referring to the Eastern Steppes? That's Chaos land. Marauder tribes themed on Mongols run rampant in that territory, which is why Cathay build 'The Great Bastion' much further North than the actual Great Wall of China. For Kislev being dead, why not write a Kislev book? You would have more obvious access to the same units, much of the same fluff (there's precious little fluff for Kislev, and what does exist is already very similar to yours simply through the mutual draw on Russian/Muscovite history), and you could add in your Initiative-focused rules to make the army stand on it's own more strongly than the original Kislev lists ever did.

    I like what you're doing - I think that it would be pretty neat to see a human army that acts as the opposite to Warriors of Chaos and fights for good. I'm not so sure that I'd go with the Russians to accomplish that, since throughout history they have been more likely to employ lightly armored and fast-moving units rather than plated-out fighters, but I also can't think of an army that I would draw into the mirror - the Empire is already based on Germany and it's satellites, and their armies were probably the most armor-focused in history.
    Check out this redo of the Kislev book for some ideas of what has been [re]done in the past. I don't always agree with Matthias's design/fluff choices, but his rules are usually pretty solid, and he does a good job of grabbing the theme and style he goes for.
    Warhammer: Kislev
    Pts Values for AoS here!

    Nippon Armybook: Isuu, Scribd, and free at Google Docs

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