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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Hi All

i have my first game vs Imperial Guard this week and im not all that sure what to do with my list, however i have put some stuff together based on little bits of info i have found arround, i would really appreciate any feedback and sugestions to ensure the list is competative against an IG army :)

HQ = 315
Daemon Prince 155
Wings
Warptime

Chaos Lord 160
mark of Khorne
jump pack
Daemon Weapon

Troops - 695
10 csm chaos marine 225
2 flamer
IoK
Rhino

10 csm chaos marine 225
2 flamer
IoK
Rhino

10 Khorne Berzerker 245
Rhino

Fast Attack - 170
6 raptor 170
2 Melta
Iok

Heavy Support - 330
1 DF Defiler 150

8 CSM chaos marine 180
4 Heavy bolter

Infantry - 45
Vehicles - 4
MC's - 1

Points - 1510

I know the IG player will probably have a Leman Russ, a couple of Chrimeras & Sentinals, and alot of infantry.

Knowing this i have decided to take a few template weapons and ordinance to deal with the infantry, and then lots of marines to ultra grit the numbers down.

Let me know your thoughts and sugestions on what i should be doing better and i will be most greatful!

Moon
 

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Against guard I would tone down those icons of khorne. You don't really need them against anything in the IG list as you will win almost any combat you get into. Many times it is better to not slaughter all 10 men in a guard squad in one turn as you then get shot to bits if you can't consolidate D6" into other men. better to win the combat on the following IG combat phase and then you can move, fire pistols and assault again.

Drop icons and marks and get yourself more men or an obliterator or two to help with anti tank. If your opponent takes minimum men with 3 russ, 3 hellhounds and 3 sentinels all those icons of khorne will be pritty useless.
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
Cheers for the feedback Mad Cat!

Ill drop the icons as you mentioned, it seems to make sense, and ill probably swap the lord for either a lash or another squad of men.

He only takes max 1 russ and a couple of chrimeras & sentinals, however i am concerned about my tank busting ability, you think i should drop some flamers for meltas? or maybe some other sugestions?
 

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The only opp. I have plays guard. I guess if it were me there's a few things I would do different:

10 CSM
IoCG
2 Melta
Rhino

10 CSM
IoCG
2 Melta
Rhino

7 Havocs
4 Missle Launcher

now assumiong I did my math right this will put you at 1495, so you could giv something meltabombs. Not sure how your friends plays, but you are going to want the IoCG if he takes basilisks. If you think he will take infantry to the point of needing flamers you could go 1 flamer 1 melta. The havocs taking ML's makes them a well rounded unit for dealing with light armor and sentinels as wells as all that guard infantry. Hope this helps!
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
Revised list including some of the sugested changes,

Thanks lots for all your feedback guys, i have re-posted the list below with changes (icons gone and more meltas for flamers). Unfortunatly i dont have another rhino at the moment to have another troop squad, for this reason i have included the chosen squad. i have never used a lash sorcerer before, and i think i could make use of it against IG, moving his units into assault range etc, and i dont ahve any missile launher havoc models either :S

HQ = 280
Daemon Prince 155
Wings
Warptime

Chaos sorcerer 125
mark of slaanesh
Lash

Elite - 110
5 Chosen - 110
4 Flamers

Troops - 640
10 csm chaos marine 205
2 Melta
Rhino

9 csm chaos marine 190
2 Melta
Rhino

10 Khorne Berzerker 245
Rhino

Fast Attack - 140
6 raptor 170
2 Melta

Heavy Support - 330
1 DF Defiler 150

8 CSM chaos marine 180
4 Heavy bolter

Infantry - 49
Vehicles - 4
MC's - 1

Points - 1500


The game is tomorow night so any comments you can make tonight would be greatly appreciated!
 

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The other Kind of Fluff
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Hello Moonwatcher,

Let me echo those posts that say no to the IoK. Against guard, it's overkill, and you could use the points elsewhere.

Prince w/ Warp Time: Like the IoK, warp time is overkill. Keep him cheap.

Sorcerer: A good solid choice. However, at the 1500 point level, it's tough to include 2 HQs and at the same time, meet all of your other requirements. You'd be much better off dropping one of them.

Chosen: General Rule of Thumb: In havoc squads and chosen squads with a high count of special/heavy weapons, take one red shirt per special/heavy weapon. In this squad, that would entail you having a total of 8 wounds. At the 1500 point level, it's just too easy for your opponent to obliterate this squad on the first round.

Chaos Marines: Fine. Except, you need 10 marines in order to fetch the second special weapon (the second unit only has 9 marines ;Y). I'm guessing this was an oversight when you were reconfiguring your build. Happens to me all the time.

Berzerkers: While amazing against MEQ's and even Nid swarms now, they are a severe overkill -vs- I.G.. If you're looking to make your army competitive, then drop these pups in favor of another basic marine unit with flamers or meltas. Remember, rapid firing into guard really damages their numbers; it's one of our opponent's that simply cannot stand up against basic bolter fire.

Raptors: Not bad. Keep them hidden behind your advancing rhinos (which should be blowing smoke). Overall, you're a weak against armor. You *could* drop this unit and take a predator w/ las-sponsons.

I hope you don't mind, but here's what I'd run against I.G.:

HQ: 155

Daemon Prince- 155
*IoS
*Lash
*Flight


ELITE: 354

Chaos Chosen Squad- 177
*9x chosen
**3x flamers

Chaos Chosen Squad- 177
*9x chosen
**3x flamers


TROOPS: 615

Chaos Marine Squad- 205
*10x chaos marines
**2x melta guns

Chaos Marine Squad- 205
*10x chaos marines
**2x melta guns

Chaos Marine Squad- 205
*10x chaos marines
**2x melta guns


HEAVY: 375

Chaos Predator- 130
*las-sponsons

Chaos Predator- 130
*las-sponsons

Chaos Predator- 115
*heavy bolter sponsons
*havoc launcher

If I wanted to include defilers, then I'd take them in pairs (they generally work better in pairs).

Add: 2x defilers & 8x chosen squad w/ 2x melta guns
Drop: 1x rhino squad, 1x predator w/ las-sponsons, 1x predator w/ heavy bolter sponsons, reduce the 1 of the flame chosen squad to 8 men
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
What can i say, except i can find no reason to disagree with any of your sugestions Rabbit :)

I guess, wrongly, i have had to let my model collection somewhat dictate my list! i too would have prefered more basic marines over the zerkers from the little i know about guard, however i have no more marine models....although i would think as its a club game i think my oponent may be ok with me using the zerker models as regulr marines!

Sorry about the 9 man squad, you hit the nail on the head, i should be more awake!

Really appreciate you writing another list for me, as always! unfortunatly i have 3 rhinos and one of them is also my magnetised predator! lol

I couldnt agree more about the 2 defilers, however i only have 1...dammit :p

The chosen, i usually play these small squads as suicide squads, infiltrate in cover and then pop out whenever opurtune to get thier points back. i will try to squeze some points for 3 extra models in the unit though, on your advice ;)

I fear this may be the best i can do for now, however clearly i need to purchase that next squad of marines+rhino sooner than i thought :)


HQ = 280
Daemon Prince 155
Wings
MoS
Lash

Chaos sorcerer 125
MoS
Lash
(i didnt have the models (other than termies or bikes to replace this guy))

Elite - 164
8 Chosen - 164
4 Flamers

Troops - 590
10 chaos marine 205
2 Melta
Rhino

10 chaos marine 205
2 Melta
Rhino

9 chaos marine 180
1 Melta
Rhino
(sorcerer rides with these)

Fast Attack - 140
6 raptor 140
2 Melta

Heavy Support - 330
1 DF Defiler 150

8 Havocs 180
4 Heavy bolter

Infantry - 52
Vehicles - 4
MC's - 1

Points - 1500

I still really appreciate your thoughts though rabbit and understand that ill be at a slight dis-advantage, but at least ill get some experience. i would have loved to field the marine list i discussed with you:
http://www.librarium-online.com/forums/chaos-army-lists/111838-1500-marine-madness.html
however as you know i dont have the models yet so i;m still testing that one in stores (using some o the stores models ;) )

Take care,

Moon
 

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The other Kind of Fluff
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Understood all the way around, buddy. Honestly, I figured you had virtually every model known to exist in the chaos codex, if my memory serves. The Berzerkers are ok. They won't perform as well considering their cost against I.G., but they'll still do just fine. A single defiler, while not as consistent as two (obviously), isn't bad either. After all, it's also a fire magnet to help your rhinos across the way. Overall, you latest build looks pretty good, especially considering your model limitation. I suppose you should get to work on painting more models to add to your already ridiculously large collection :rofl.
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
Time to report back on the game :)

I won! It was a massacre, i played the final list i posted and with thanks to the advice you guys gave me i was able to really take advantge of my opponents army!

The raptors made bee-line for the lemen russ and destroyed it turn 2, the 3 squads of CSM rushed forward and unloaded turn 2 right on the enemy lines. as it turns out the chosen and defiler were not needed too muhc. There was no terain for me to infiltrate into 12" so they turned up late to the party and mopped up a few extras.

The heavy bolters decimated an entire squad in 1 turn. daemon prince was as effective as ever and the lashes were not even that nessasary.

One of the biggest things i have found recently is that the single best squad we have is 10 CSM in a rhino with 2 melta guns. for 205 points they are amazing value and should not be overlooked!

Once again thanks for the help all!! (next game - Dark eldar tomorow, another new army for me!)

Moon
 
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