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Discussion Starter · #1 · (Edited)
Hi there, Im new to the game and thought you could give me some help tweaking my army, Im interested in hearing your thoughts and suggestions... Ill be mostly playing Blood Angels and necrons and I want a fun list to play, I know I havent filled up to 1500 yet, I own all the models in the list and just want to see where you think i should go with the list, nothing is cast iron as yet. Thanks in advance guys ;)
Rich

Total Roster Cost: 1403 (Model count 34)

Chaos Lord (5#, 233 Pts)
1 Sorceror Lord @
General; Sorceror; Lightning Claw (x1); Combi-bolter
1 Mark of Tzeentch @ [
1 Daemonic Essence @ [
1 Daemonic Strength @ [
1 Familiar @ [
1 Gift of Chaos @ [
1 Bolt of Change @ [] Pts
1 Terminator Armour @ [] Pts
1 Spiky Bits @ [] Pts
1 Thrall Wizard @ [] Pts
1 Thrall Wizard @ [] Pts
1 Thrall Wizard @ [] Pts
1 Thrall Wizard @ [] Pts

I know he is pricey, Ive already converted him and I love the look of him, but i guess i might have to either drop one or more of the powers/gifts to make my list more competitive

Chosen (5#, 288 Pts)
0 Chosen of Tzeentch @ Pts
5 Chosen Terminators @ [] Pts
Sorceror; Chainfist (x1); Power Weapon (x4); Combi-bolter (x2); Combi-flamer (x2); Reaper autocannon (x1)
1 Mark of Tzeentch @ [] Pts
5 Gift of Chaos @ [] Pts
1 Terminator Armour @ [] Pts

Wanted some close combat punch to help the lord out up front keeping the heat of him and my rubrics while they lay down bolter fire and BoC

Chaos Space Marine Squad (11#, 271 Pts)
8 Favoured Thousand Sons @ Pts
Close combat weapon (x8); Bolter (x8)
1 Mark of Tzeentch @ [] Pts
1 Daemonic Essence @ [] Pts
1 Rubric Sign @ [] Pts
1 Favoured Unit @ [] Pts
1 Aspiring Champion (free) @ [] Pts
Sorceror; Bolt Pistol (x1); Powerfist (x1)
1 Mark of Tzeentch @ [] Pts
1 Bolt of Change @ [] Pts
1 Thrall Wizard @ [] Pts
1 Thrall Wizard @ [] Pts

Fairly standard I thought, possibly thinking about rhinos for both
Chaos Space Marine Squad (11#, 271 Pts)

8 Favoured Thousand Sons @ 271 Pts
Close combat weapon (x8); Bolter (x8)
1 Mark of Tzeentch @ [] Pts
1 Daemonic Essence @ [] Pts
1 Rubric Sign @ [] Pts
1 Favoured Unit @ [0] Pts
1 Aspiring Champion (free) @ [] Pts
Sorceror; Bolt Pistol (x1); Powerfist (x1)
1 Mark of Tzeentch @ [] Pts
1 Bolt of Change @ [] Pts
1 Thrall Wizard @ [] Pts
1 Thrall Wizard @ [] Pts

Defiler (1#, 150 Pts)
1 Defiler @ Pts
Battle Cannon; Heavy Flamer; Reaper autocannon
1 Daemonic Possession @ [ Pts

It looks so mean, I love the model, considerring indirect

Dreadnought (1#, 110 Pts)
1 Dreadnought @ 110 Pts
Dreadnought Close Combat Weapon; Twin-linked Bolter; Twin-linked Autocannon
1 Fire Frenzy @ [] Pts

Got a forgeworld 1ksons dred that i love, considerring buying the lascannon arm instead of the autocannon
 

· Librarian from Hell
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4,396 Posts
Beware of long post

Welcome to the hobby, LO and the ways of the Changer.
I've been playing Thousand Sons for a while now and I tell you it's a great choice you've made. They are not the easiest army to begin with due to their limitations in mobility but when you master those Rubriks none will stand in your way.

First a couple of things on how yo present the list, the individual points are not to be mentioned due to copyright-law and Forum rules. You can edit your post and delete them by clicking the pencil-icon in the lower-right corner of the post.

Next is another form issue, it's the amount of things things you write on each unit. It is a bit to carefully done, a bit to thorough. It gets a bit hard to see the important stuff. Just as an example:


Richm101 said:
Chaos Space Marine Squad (11#, 271 Pts)
8 Favoured Thousand Sons @ xxx Pts
Close combat weapon (x8); Bolter (x8)
1 Mark of Tzeentch @ [xx] Pts
1 Daemonic Essence @ [0] Pts
1 Rubric Sign @ [0] Pts
1 Favoured Unit @ [0] Pts
1 Aspiring Champion (free) @ [xx] Pts
Sorceror; Bolt Pistol (x1); Powerfist (x1)
1 Mark of Tzeentch @ [xx] Pts
1 Bolt of Change @ [xx] Pts
1 Thrall Wizard @ [x] Pts
1 Thrall Wizard @ [x] Pts
This should be like this:

9 Thousand Sons
Champion with
Powerfist
Bolt of Change
2 Thralls
-271p

All the other things we already know, like the bonus for the mark and the favoured number etc. It will make posting easier for you and reading easier for us. But as I said it's only form.
Before I start with your list I feel I must point out some important things to keep in mind when playing the Sons.

Mobility.
Since your units are slow you'll need some added mobility to have a chance. Not all your units must be equipped with Rhinos but at least one preferably two. This is important as you are sometimes required to get to a certain place: an objective or across the board.

Cheap HQ
As the basic trooper is so expensive you should not pay more for your HQ then you need. Give the Lt or Lord one specific role and keep him focused on it.

Rubrics
Those are the best units at your disposal, use them. The Daemon Pack with Flamer upgrade is also very good at dishing out fire. When it comes to possessed and chosen, be very careful. Those will eat your points faster then you can imagine and they do not have the staying power of the Rubrics.

Fast Attack
...screamers...? not the best unit in the game and I have never used them. The models are a bit to expensive for my liking.

Heavy Support
:) Yes, please.

Lord of Change has written a very good Tactica on the Sons, I recommend you read it if you have not done that already.

Now for your list:)

Lord
Mark of Tzeentch (MoT)
Terminator armour
Spiky Bits
Lightning Claw
Combi Bolter
D. Essence
D. Strength
Familiar
Gift of chaos
Bolt of Change
4 Thralls
233 points

This is a very expensive guy that might be killed by a single lascannon or a powerfist.
You got quite a lot of points on stuff he will only use under certain conditions, like while in close combat or while he is not in close combat.
You could get two Liutenants for the same price (near the same anyway)
Like this

Lt 1
MoT
Bolt of Change
4 Thralls
Close Combat weapon
Bolt Pistol
117 points

Lt 2
MoT
Terminator Armour
Darkblade
Close combat weapon
2 Thralls
Gift of Chaos
136 points

253 points together and quite some more punch.

However I recommend you start with one modest HQ and spend the rest of the points on troops and Heavy Support. (They are also fun)

Back to your HQ again, as the Lord can be a very personal thing, there are however some things that are strange in how you equipped him
1 Lightning Claw ( you get two for but a few more points) and Combi Bolter (when you shoot you use the Bolt of Change not this, so drop it).
Daemonic Essence, he has quite a few wounds already and need not another one. If you want to add on some durability go for the D.resilience instead, it will be better in the long run.
The two different powers have I already adressed. This might be good on fron-line champions however, but the spells should then complement one and other. Wind of Chaos and Gift of Chaos is a good combo in my experience. Especially when used by a champ in a rhino with some thralls and Rubrics to soak any damage.

Chosen (5#, 288 Pts)
0 Chosen of Tzeentch @ 368 Pts
5 Chosen Terminators @ [xxx] Pts
Sorceror; Chainfist (x1); Power Weapon (x4); Combi-bolter (x2); Combi-flamer (x2); Reaper autocannon (x1)
1 Mark of Tzeentch @ [xx] Pts
5 Gift of Chaos @ [xxx] Pts
1 Terminator Armour @ [xx] Pts

I do not get this unit. I'm not sure on how many they are and how many marks you have or anything. Are they all terminators?
If you have 5 Tzeentchian chosen terminators, I would like you to make the Rubric terminators instead.
I field 5 Rubric Terminators and a boosted up champ for ~260 points. They will last longer and still deal damage enough. If you retype this unit in the way I recommended I can give further critics.

Your troops are spot on. REally good and solid choices, you might add another Thrall to each Champ but that's just details. Try to get another unit and put it in a Rhino however, this unit needs not to be favoured as the thralls are in many ways better then the Rubrics when in CC. Keep the champ tooled up for CC and give him the Wind/Gift combo. It really causes pain I assure you.

The Defiler is a very good Choice in a Thousand Sons army, but it attracts alot of fire so it should have the Indirect Fire as you suggested. This also makes it possible to shoot hidden units such as Basilisks and Tau-Battlesuits.

The Dread should have a lascannon and Daemonic Possession, I've been recommended Parasitic Possession lately (OK and earlier apperantly:rolleyes: ) and it should also be a good upgrade. Many people recommend the Predator with Lascannons in turret and Sponsons, but mine has been nothing but a disappointment so I cannot recommend this and still sleep good tonight. I know it's due to apaling dicerolling, but still.

OK, this was a very long post but I hope there is something you can use.
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
Revised List

Hello again, thanks for your reply, i know it must have taken some time to reply and Im grateful you did... I editted my post to hide the points values, classic newbie, post first read the rules later ;)
I liked reading your advice, and ive worked out in my head how all this could play out if i take some of it.... so here goes the revised list

1499/1500 points..... Model count 50

Chaos Lord 181 pts
-Terminator Armour
-Darkblade
-CCW
-Daemonic Resilience
-BoC
-Thralls x4

The points cost for this model compared to my original 'uber-lord' it does make lots of sense, this one has way more value for points, im looking forward to remoddelling my current lord to have the darkblade ;)

Flamers (8} 184pts

Ugly ugly models, but ive read up on them and they do sound to be a worthwhile addition, equiv of a heavy bolter each and 2 wounds, sound too good to be true

Favoured Rubriks (8+AC) 276 pts
-Powerfist
-BoC
-Thralls x3
-Icon

Favoured Rubriks (8+AC) 276 pts
-Powerfist
-BoC
-Thralls x3
-Icon

Standard stuff again, added the icon to both favoured squads for summoning

Rubriks (5+AC) 262 pts
-Powerfist
-GoC
-Thralls x4
-Rhino

I thought id give this squad a go, a variaton on your GoC/WoC combo you mentioned, didnt quite have the points to do that, so what do you think of this?

Defiler 175pts
-Indirect
-Autocannon
-Heavy flamer

I thought indirect made sense

Dreadnought 145 pts
-Daemonic Possession
-Lascannon
-CCW

And there is the revised dreadnought


I think this already looks like a good improvement, before i was tying up a third of my points with 6 models, i think this already looks more balanced, and the list is definately easier to read..... Thanks again!
Rich
 

· Librarian from Hell
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4,396 Posts
It looks much better.
One thing you must keep in mind is that when your Lord is accompanied by Thralls he loses his Independent Character (IC) status as they together form a unit. This means he can be targeted for shooting just like any other unit.
If you have him join one of the Rubric squads this won't be a problem any more, but he'll need to shoot at the same target as the unit.
Now, he has the Darkblade (I've made one, you can access my Gallery through the Signature, he is the last of my pictures) and Bolt of Change. Once again he shines in two diferent areas. You should have him in CC to earn his points and while in CC (Close Combat) you cannot shoot. You could try to give him Doombolt instead and maybe one or two thralls. This will save you points to get a familiar and Wind of Chaos for the Rhino unit.
Wind of Chaos (especially with Thralls) is extremely powerful against heavy units such as Marines or their equivilants (MEQ) with 3+ save. It's also a great way of thinning them down before charging in the next round.
Remember that it's you who choses which model is turned into a spawn with Gift of Chaos. Make sure to pick Powerfists and veteran sarges first.

Once again, good luck.
 

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I would actually drop a few thralls from your lord and your rhino champ. Then stick himn in there as a cc unit (also switch BoC on your lord for winds of chaos, IMO best psychich power in the game). Also drop the heavy flamer is not needed on your defiler, he should be no wear near the enemy. Also try and fit a p fist on your rhino champ, then you are good. Good luck.
 

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This list is turning out to be great! now for my 2 cents,

I dont play 1000sons but i do know that a flamer wont help your defiler very much, they are "ok" in cc at best but it would be wise not to get it into that situation.I suggest the Havoc launcher, its a pritty decent ordanece weapon and can be used if the shoot at you and destroy your battle cannon and/or auto cannons.

i hope my 2 cents helps and you can see what i mem
 
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