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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
HQ: 152 (8%)
Farseer Rajjan- 72-Fortune, Runes of Witnessing, Ghost Helm, Shuriken Pistol, Close Combat Weapon

Avatar- 80

Elites: 293 (16%)
Viper Jetbike- 100-Two Shuriken Catapults, Crystal Targeting Matrix

Guardian Defender Squad- 193
14 Guardian Defenders
2 Guardian Crewmen with a Star Cannon Weapon Platform
1 Warlock with Conceal

Troops: 1095 (59%)
Striking Scorpions- 171
8 Striking Scorpions
1 Exarch with Scorpion’s Claw
Wave Serpent- 135-Twin Linked Bright Lance, Spirit Stones

Fire Dragons- 153
9 Fire Dragons
Wave Serpent- 135-Twin Linked Bright Lance, Spirit Stones

Striking Scorpions- 114
6 Striking Scorpions
-Haywire Grenades

Warp Spiders- 203
8 Warp Spiders
1 Warp Spider Exarch with Withdraw

Kroot Carnivore Squad- 184
16 Kroot Carnivore Kindred
1 Kroot Carnivore Kindred Shaper with Eviscerator and Bolt Pistol

Heavy Support: 310 (17%)
Falcon- 190-Star Cannon, Holo Field, Spirit Stones

Wraithlord- 120-Brightlance, Two Flamers

The little squad of scorps goes in the falcon. Their purpose is as my all-perpose-backup squad. They capture a quick table quarter, help out a doomed squad in CC, or finish off a stubborn tank. The falcon ensures they get where they need to be quickly and intact. My army is spit into two groups. The attcaking/fast bit, and the defending/slow bit. The slow group is made of the Avatar, WL, guardians, viper(CTM) and kroot(if w/o infiltrate). This group performs very well in tandem with each other-- everyone supporting and protecting the ther. And the other remaining units obviously make up the attacking squads. The point of the Dragons is useually not anti-tank, but rather anti-heavy-infantry.The big scorpions take the farseer with them and perform as my main CC brute squad.

I'm not quite sure how to use my Spiders, as they're a new addition to my army, so help in that area would be much appreiciated(sp).

I would like to note, I only include two star cannons, and two heavy support.

So what do you think?
-Cypher
 

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señor brushman!
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I would try to get a better weapon on the Vyper. Maybe take off Ghost Helm and Runes of Witnessing on the Farseer. These aren't neccesary and it pretty rare that they help.

I don't know much about Kroot so I can't help you there...

Otherwise, I like your list!

~Ben
 

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Simple Green.
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969 Posts
1) Those Kroot bring pain to my eyes, use Guardians instead, you can have 20 guardians, a Warlock,and have 13 points left, replacing the Kroot. PLUS...Guardians have better saves and better weapons!!! Why would you switch meatshields for lesser meatshields?

2) Upgrade the Shuri-Cats on the Falcon to shuri-cannon, so the Falcon has a min. str-6 gun and can shoot EVERYTHING 24" away...

3) I would switch the Scorpions and Fire Dragons, making the Scorpions 10x in the WaveSerpeant, and 6x Dragons in the Falcon. Dragons don't need a full squad to be effective and if you're worried about them not working get a farseer /w guide and stick him in the Falcon with 5x Dragons (inc. Exarch /w Firepike for an extra punch)

4) Drop the CTM on the Vyper, you can't have two shurican catapults, unless you mean cannons...then it's ok but still drop the CTM, it's useless.

Hope that helped for now :alien:
 

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I like it, the idea of adding kroot is interesting. But, I don't see their point, as stated, unless you just wanted the longer ranged weapons? The fast group is pretty good, and i second the fire dragon notion. Although the fire dragons are cool, you don't need 10, where you often need 10 scoprs. Replace the 6 scorps with 10, and lower it to 6 dragons, and switch their transports.

Also, on the warp spiders:
I like to think of my self as a serious warp spider proponent, I use them every game. They are great, but there are a few t hings you need to understand:

1. You have to be withing 6" to shoot. The 12" range is misleading, since if you move, you can't shoot, and even if you don't move, you can only shoot once.

2. The last thing you want is for them to be in close combat. Why would you want to go from a S6 gun to an S3 punch? seriously.... withdraw is a must.

3. Their gun is S6! If you are fighting space marines, and your opponent has a squad of terminators, don't shoot at them. Your scorps will do better against them. Instead, warp jump over next to the side armor of their predator, or even play with that cute little dreadnought.... I have killed 2 predators and immobilized a dreadnought this way.

Just thoughts....
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
Excuse me? Kroot have SOOO many things up on guardians.
The list:
Infitrate
S4
Aguably the best standard issuse gun in the game(ap6 bolter that counts as 2 ccws) This weapon kicks the stuffing out of a shuriken catipult. period.
3 wound 3 attack eviverator(two handed chainfist)
Fieldcraft, forests are everywhere.(no difficult in forest, and a 4+ cover save)

All this for 4 less moddels( 2 less wounds) and a 6+ save. In short they are better at shooting and far better at close combat then gaurdians and have more and better special rules.

If you'd read my post, you'd know that my firedragons so indeed need to have more then 6 moddels. I don't kill tanks, I kill infantry with them. killing an average of 3 (with 6), I much perfer 5(with 9). In addition, against guard or Tau they make good close combat troops.

A typo on my part: the viper has 2 cannons

-Cypher
 

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Born from Tears of Angels
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Not that I am surprised but this is the 1st time I am seeing Kroot in an eldar army, too used to seeing Tau have them. Are they really that good???
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
Yeah, I heart their spiky avien krootiness. They even work out great fluffwise; why wouldn't a dying race want to hire others to die for them?

In addition, they have the most cost-effective snipers in the game.
Here's the link:http://uk.games-workshop.com/tau/kroot%2Dlist/

btw, I'd just like to say, that I have tried puting 6 dragons in a falcon. And I much perfer it my way.
 

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Jhagadurn said:
I like it, the idea of adding kroot is interesting. But, I don't see their point, as stated, unless you just wanted the longer ranged weapons? The fast group is pretty good, and i second the fire dragon notion. Although the fire dragons are cool, you don't need 10, where you often need 10 scoprs. Replace the 6 scorps with 10, and lower it to 6 dragons, and switch their transports.
Fully Agreed.

Also, on the warp spiders:
I like to think of my self as a serious warp spider proponent, I use them every game. They are great, but there are a few t hings you need to understand:

1. You have to be withing 6" to shoot. The 12" range is misleading, since if you move, you can't shoot, and even if you don't move, you can only shoot once.
Unless you're playing by 3rd edition rules, you're wrong, that's why they have a range of 12. Spiders can move 12, shoot 2 shots at 12, then jump back however far you roll on the roll.

2. The last thing you want is for them to be in close combat. Why would you want to go from a S6 gun to an S3 punch? seriously.... withdraw is a must.

3. Their gun is S6! If you are fighting space marines, and your opponent has a squad of terminators, don't shoot at them. Your scorps will do better against them. Instead, warp jump over next to the side armor of their predator, or even play with that cute little dreadnought.... I have killed 2 predators and immobilized a dreadnought this way.

Just thoughts....
I agree with everything except the terminators. if your opponent fields termies, that's why we have star cannons, and bright lances. Scorpions can't hope to match them in combat.

Edit: On a side note, if you're wanting the 6 scorpions for the haywire grenades, get storm guardians, give 'em grenades and flamers, make 'em multipurpose. If you're wanting 'em for their combat ability, you need to increase their numbers and give 'em infiltrate. they'll be better able to cover the Kroot (and vice versa) and you'll have alot more success with supperior numbers. And of course they need an exarch w/ a claw.
 

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Jhagadurn said:
3. Their gun is S6! If you are fighting space marines, and your opponent has a squad of terminators, don't shoot at them. Your scorps will do better against them.
Just thoughts....
Dude, scorpions will get anihilated. Terminators have power armor you cant possible even hope for their tiny chain swords to peneteerate it, your only hope is banshees and still it will be pretty hard to kill em
 

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señor brushman!
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Dude, scorpions will get anihilated. Terminators have power armor you cant possible even hope for their tiny chain swords to peneteerate it, your only hope is banshees and still it will be pretty hard to kill em
I assume you meant Terminator armour. I fully agree - Scorpions will probally die in CC. The Scorps won't be getting their saves, while the Terminators get there's which they will rarely miss.

The better bet would be Banshee's against the Terminators, but even then, the Terminators would probally win because of the Banshee's low strength.

~Ben
 

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true, even banshees will have a tough time, banshees will do a good job slowing em down though, they might not win but they will sure distact em for a couple of turns and probably kill most of the squad before getting anihilated
 

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Simple Green.
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Don't give Banshees the cold shoulder, I run a squad of 10x (inc. Exarch /w executioner), in a Wave Serpeant. Usually I get charge, I go first (even if they are in cover), they have enough attacks to wound an avg. of 4-5 termies, usually 1 will be saved, then the exarch normally kills 1-2. Most terminator squads are only 5x man squads so Banshees already win BUT, the transport "should" have a T-L starcannon, so that will avg. 1-2 kills on the turn they charge. Just because they have str-3 doesn't mean they can's kill termies, the only ones I have EVER lost combat to were GK ones because it was a squad of 9x and 1x Grandmaster...
 

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señor brushman!
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Don't give Banshees the cold shoulder, I run a squad of 10x (inc. Exarch /w executioner), in a Wave Serpeant. Usually I get charge, I go first (even if they are in cover), they have enough attacks to wound an avg. of 4-5 termies, usually 1 will be saved, then the exarch normally kills 1-2. Most terminator squads are only 5x man squads so Banshees already win BUT, the transport "should" have a T-L starcannon, so that will avg. 1-2 kills on the turn they charge. Just because they have str-3 doesn't mean they can's kill termies, the only ones I have EVER lost combat to were GK ones because it was a squad of 9x and 1x Grandmaster...
True, Banshee's can work well against them, but Im just saying they're not super "uber" squads of death that will kill any Terminators or other strong unit they come across. Their low strength can hurt a lot and if they don't kill enough Terminators in the first round, then they're usually in for a beatin'.

~Ben
 

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id definetley agree with dropping the kroot and replacing with more guardians, they're just 100% better and 40A will do SOMETHING in CC! id say drop ghost helms and if you can, give witch blades to whoever can have them. it gives you AV in CC and also makes wounding big things alot easier *die C'Tan* id say drop the fire dragons because they never really make an impact on games and replace them with banshees because that many A on the charge chops most heavy infantry up just fine. warp spiders are good against armies your lit is weak against, mainly swarm armies where they AP- wont hurt and the high S with high shots will make their points back, plus they can move rapidly and hide rapidly. definetley make sure your falcon has a shuriken cannon because catapaults on a vehicle never do anything and a falcon is a shooter. lastly, i really dont think the warlock needs conceal as i assume your using the guardians to hold back and fire and than rush into CC and give you outnumbering, and if you hold back youll have cover 9 times out of 10 and if they shoot at your guardians, awesome your CC squads dont die. thats a few more points to fool with.
 

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i disagree with dropping the fire dragons, i'd say they only need to be a 5 man with an exarch that has Fire Pike and perhaps Burning Fist incase it gets rushed or can't finish the job, on the average at shooting they will be able to wound with roughly 4 out of 6 shots and really their true calling should be hunting termies or something else that will give heartache to most Eldar armies
 

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Born from Tears of Angels
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Emp. said:
Don't give Banshees the cold shoulder, I run a squad of 10x (inc. Exarch /w executioner), in a Wave Serpeant. Usually I get charge, I go first (even if they are in cover), they have enough attacks to wound an avg. of 4-5 termies, usually 1 will be saved, then the exarch normally kills 1-2. Most terminator squads are only 5x man squads so Banshees already win BUT, the transport "should" have a T-L starcannon, so that will avg. 1-2 kills on the turn they charge. Just because they have str-3 doesn't mean they can's kill termies, the only ones I have EVER lost combat to were GK ones because it was a squad of 9x and 1x Grandmaster...
You are really overestimating the banshees, i am not saying that they are bad or anything but I dont think they get this lucky on hitting termies, every time I play I only kill 2 to 4 termies a turn and my exarch definitely doesnt kill 2 more. I think you are basing your opinion on good dice roll which doesnt usually happen...
 

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Discussion Starter · #17 · (Edited)
Im sorry guys, But lets try to keep this ON TOPIC. I don't want my post canibalized into another banshie thread.

Im gunna be using this at Dundarcon in a couple days. It's not all painted, so unless I really get my ass in gear, I'll have to use a comprimised list.

But anyway...

id definetley agree with dropping the kroot and replacing with more guardians, they're just 100% better and 40A will do SOMETHING in CC! id say drop ghost helms and if you can, give witch blades to whoever can have them. it gives you AV in CC and also makes wounding big things alot easier *die C'Tan*
Did you read my post about kroot at all? If you did, read it again. I gave reasons why I like kroot. You just said that they are better. Personally, I perfer 48 S4 attacks plus 4 powerfist attack all at WS4 to 40 S3 attacks at WS3. In addition kroot are BETTER AT SHOOTING THAN GUARDIANS!!!! Get that through your head. Better close combat, better range, better special rules, nuf said.
I'd just like to ask what the point of a 15 point WB is, when I get my ass handed to me in close cambat regardless? If you ask me, I say they arn't worth it on 'locks. And as for my 'seer, yes, it would be nice, but there are better things to spend the points on. coughvehiclespiritstonesaspectwarriorscough


For those of you who acctually responed to my list and not the post before yours. I will deeply consider switching the places of my little scorpions and my fire dragons. Thats a pretty good idea. However, it is really nice to decimate squads of expensive veteren marines or terminatiors without taking a single casualty. Then, quite often, next turn they are ready to jump back into the serpent and rinse and repeat.
I do see how another dedicated close combat squad would be nice. However, I don't like banshies(if anyone says anything about me not likeing banshies, I'll put them in a safe-room with Hanibal Lecter:O ), and I would feal guilty useing scorps instead due to... well I dunno, it just seems more eldar-sque to have one of each instead of 2 of 1. Plus then I'd be 1 point over and I'd have to drop the ghost helm(for only 5 points it seems like a sin not to take it).

Thanks to those who responded to my list
-Cypher
 

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Okay first of all, I was responding to the thread not you and was agreeing with someone who disliked the Kroot. My personal opinion is that Guardians do better but if you like Kroot, use Kroot it;s your army not mine. Just take a chill pill guy. My reasons for not using Ghost Helms is because even at 5 points they don't do much. It's not even guarantted to stop PotW and the ability to cut a Demon's WS in half is pretty much pointless since all most demons are good enough in combat for it not to come into play. I guess if you charge some Nurglings or Horrors. Just my opinion.
 

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In her defence, that combination would almost always kill a 5 man Termie Squad. 27A that hit on 4's so odds say 13-14 will hit. 1 in 3 will wound so that's 4 Invulnerables there. The Star Cannon usually forces 2 more. The Exarch will at least cause 1 more as she hits and wounds on a 3+ with 3A. Now obviously you have to charge but with the transport and fleet that's not very difficult. Mathematics aren't definite but odds say she's right, just over confident on the total number of wounds caused.
 

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Discussion Starter · #20 ·
I'm sorry to sound pissy, but if you want to discuss banshie tactics, make your own thread.
Please do not double post, it's rude.

I created this thread for you to respond to my army-list. Not for you to thread-jack it.

-Cypher
 
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