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It came from the warp...
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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
After my recent bout against a Steel Legion IG player I've decided to redo my list a little in order to better combat that army considering of all the armies I fight against, it is the only one that matches me armor for armor and outnumbers me 2 to 1. I don't want to tailor my list entirely for it, as this is still to be used against all comers, but that IG list is a tough nut to crack.

His List:
6 Chimeras: 2 Lascannon Heavy Weapons teams, 3 tri-Plasma Veteran squads, Command Squad
Infantry squad on foot to hold their objective
2 empty Vendettas
Valkyrie containing a tri-melta Veteran Squad
2 Leman Russ
Leman Russ Demolisher

My list:
==HQ==
Farseer- 105
---Doom, Runes of Warding, Runes of Witnessing
Prince Yriel - 155
==Troops==
2x 10 Dire Avengers – 152[304]
---Exarch, Dual Avenger Shuriken Catapults, Bladestorm
2x Wave Serpent – 125[250]
---Twin-Linked Scatter Laser, Spirit Stones
10 Storm Guardians – 127
---2 Flamers, Warlock, Destructor
Wave Serpent – 140
--- Twin-Linked Scatter Laser, Spirit Stones, Star Engines
==Elites==
2x 7 Fire Dragons – 112[224]
2x Wave Serpent – 125[250]
---Twin-Linked Shuriken Cannon, Spirit Stones, Star Engines
==Fast Attack==
8 Warp Spiders – 203
---Exarch, Dual Death Spinners, Powerblades
==Heavy Support==
2x Fire Prism – 115[230]

Total – 1988


Yriel rides with a Dragon squad
Farseer rides with Storm Guardians, usually going flat-out
Warp Spiders deep-strike behind armor(within reason, no sense losing 200 points to deep-strike mishap
Everything else should be rather self-explanitory, standard reserve mech tactics.

Any suggestions to improve this list? My main problem is the Vendettas/Valkyrie as my Fire Dragons are too busy obliterating the three Leman Russes to be able to kill the birds.
 

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Do you really need Prince Yriel? He reads as an extra Fire Prism to me. I'm also not so sure about Runes of Witnessing, but depending on your meta it may be a good call.
If you free up enough points, you could give the Wave Serpents Missile Launchers. Start with the Fire Dragon ones, then change the Scatter Lasers to more Missile Launchers if you have the points. That would give you a bit more anti-tank, to help deal with Vendettas and Chimeras.
 

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It came from the warp...
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458 Posts
Discussion Starter · #3 · (Edited)
I need an Autarch of some sort to use the Reserve Mech tactics, and Yriel gives the best bang for the buck, so most likely yes, he will stay. I take the runes because I don't like to take chances I can prevent, all you need is that one Doom to fail against a squad of TH+SS Terminators or other deathstar unit and your army fails to cripple it sufficiently. I was debating Missile Launchers, on the one hand they have a much better chance of penetrating armor, but on the other hand there's a 50/50 chance it will be worthless against the Valkyries/Vendettas due to the 4+ cover save of Skimmers Moving Fast, so I'll see what I can do to try a few Missile Launchers out.

==HQ==
Farseer- 105
---Doom, Runes of Warding, Runes of Witnessing
Prince Yriel - 155
==Troops==
2x 10 Dire Avengers – 152[304]
---Exarch, Dual Avenger Shuriken Catapults, Bladestorm
2x Wave Serpent – 130[260]
---Twin-Linked Missile Launcher, Spirit Stones
10 Storm Guardians – 127
---2 Flamers, Warlock, Destructor
Wave Serpent – 145
--- Twin-Linked Missile Launcher, Spirit Stones, Star Engines
==Elites==
2x 7 Fire Dragons – 112[224]
2x Wave Serpent – 145[290]
---Twin-Linked Missile Launcher, Spirit Stones, Star Engines
==Fast Attack==
6 Warp Spiders – 159
---Exarch, Dual Death Spinners, Powerblades
==Heavy Support==
2x Fire Prism – 115[230]

Total – 1999

Changes are in red.
 

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Runes of witnessing are ussualy a waste. the better chance to succseed better chance of perils. But is a matter of taste.

Anything over cannons for flat out serpents that wil take a lot of shooting like the dragons serpents also useless (inlcuding guardians one). Also cannon>missile launcher for light at purpose. With flat out, shorter range is no longer a problem.

And i rather take vectored engines over star. Most tournaments will not let you use star engines with flat out so are not really useful.

spiders are nice with the hit and run ablity.

But seems like a good list overall.
 

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It came from the warp...
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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
I've never heard of not being allowed to use Star Engines and Flat Out in the same turn. Also, on the point of Runes of Witnessing, with a 3+ Ghosthelm save and a 4+ Invuln, coupled with three wounds and sitting inside a transport unless the vehicle is blown up, I'll take my chances with perils over failing to cast my spell.

==HQ==
Farseer- 105
---Doom, Runes of Warding, Runes of Witnessing
Prince Yriel - 155
==Troops==
2x 10 Dire Avengers – 152[304]
---Exarch, Dual Avenger Shuriken Catapults, Bladestorm
2x Wave Serpent – 130[260]
---Twin-Linked Missile Launcher, Spirit Stones
10 Storm Guardians – 127
---2 Flamers, Warlock, Destructor
Wave Serpent – 125
--- Twin-Linked Shuriken Cannon, Spirit Stones, Star Engines
==Elites==
2x 7 Fire Dragons – 112[224]
2x Wave Serpent – 125[250]
---Twin-Linked Shuriken Cannon, Spirit Stones, Star Engines
==Fast Attack==
8 Warp Spiders – 218
---Exarch, Dual Death Spinners, Powerblades, Withdraw
==Heavy Support==
2x Fire Prism – 115[230]

Total – 1998
 

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my advice would be to drop the warp spiders i think a seer council would be overall better, plus yreil is kind of a waste when you can get an average autarch to save you some points and mabye get you fortune on your farseer if you do take the council?

hope my advice helps and good luck!!!
 

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It came from the warp...
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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
Well considering my local meta-game, a Seer Council is kind of a liability. We've got at least one SM player with a Terminator Librarian, and another Space Wolves player with a Rune Priest, both of these can shut down Fortune a decent amount of the time and a Seer Council without Fortune is dead in the water and a huge points sink. By average Autarch, what build are you recommending? My other Autarch, the "Spider'Tarch" is 125 points, thats 30 points less than Yriel and is a lot less "killy." If you're referring to a bare or near-bare Autarch for around 80 points that will sit in a transport all game, those points will not be used to their full potential, which is actually using the Autarch to kill something. Another note on the Seer Council is that I would have to buy a few more Jetbikes and spend countless hours modeling a Council with enough detail to put to the brush for 6-7 hours of painting each, which is my normal amount of time I spend painting my HQ units.
 

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Looks like a decent list. Although with the ap- of warp spiders I think they are kinda garbage.

You will have enough points to take another WS and 5 DA. Although that will add a KP. Most people put their lemon russes rear armor to terrain and back the board. So getting your spiders to shoot it is probably not likely.
 

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It came from the warp...
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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
Yeah, I know about the Leman Russes against the back board edge, I added Star Engines to both Fire Dragon Wave Serpents primarily for that very reason. The Warp Spiders did okay today, but the lack of AP does make them rather lackluster at actually doing anything to vehicles, their primary purpose in my list. With that said, I feel there's still some tweaking to do with the list, and I'm thinking War Walkers might fit the slot, even though it'll cost me a pretty hefty sum to acquire a set of three.
 

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Looks like a decent list. Although with the ap- of warp spiders I think they are kinda garbage.

You will have enough points to take another WS and 5 DA. Although that will add a KP. Most people put their lemon russes rear armor to terrain and back the board. So getting your spiders to shoot it is probably not likely.
I strongly dissagree. spiders are : a squadron tank nightmare (one of our few units capable to kill a 3 LR squadron in a turn and i still did not found those most people who put them with back at the wall as from such a immobile position i can dance around so easily), any 4+ infantery nightmare (3+ to shoot, 2+ to wounds, then CC with one guy with power weapon and 3+ save all over). And i`m not talking about transport killing capability and then assaulting the guys inside- bye bye company command squad. Their mobility is so great they can deliver anywhere, ussualy they can soak a lot of firepower. I use them as long range elite killers or fast reaction team to support other units.

Decent list. Hope you got luck with prisms...i have to buy more walkers as my prism pilots cannot kill almost anything. And i hope you take star engines for local tactical purpose (like disembark guys, shoot with them then park the serpent in front of them for cover and assault detterment) as i cannot find any other purpose for that upgrade.
 

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Well considering my local meta-game, a Seer Council is kind of a liability. We've got at least one SM player with a Terminator Librarian, and another Space Wolves player with a Rune Priest, both of these can shut down Fortune a decent amount of the time and a Seer Council without Fortune is dead in the water and a huge points sink. By average Autarch, what build are you recommending? My other Autarch, the "Spider'Tarch" is 125 points, thats 30 points less than Yriel and is a lot less "killy." If you're referring to a bare or near-bare Autarch for around 80 points that will sit in a transport all game, those points will not be used to their full potential, which is actually using the Autarch to kill something. Another note on the Seer Council is that I would have to buy a few more Jetbikes and spend countless hours modeling a Council with enough detail to put to the brush for 6-7 hours of painting each, which is my normal amount of time I spend painting my HQ units.
well actually i was thinking you could give the autarch a power weapon, banshee mask, and a fusion gun and stick them with the storm gaurdians. that way when you charge into cover the enemy will not be able to use any defensive grenades and you wont have to strike last. ( banshee mask) this autarch is much cheaper. however if you want a "killy" autarch yreil is the best option.
 

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It came from the warp...
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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
I actually don't charge with my Storm Guardians, ever. Setting up ideal flame templates and charging a scoring unit into something that's almost certainly way better in CC than they are is generally a difficult and not so practical way to use them in my opinion. I have however made some additional changes I wanted to try out today and they performed rather well in the two games I played.

==HQ==
Autarch – 125
---Mandiblasters, Power Weapon, Fusion Gun, Warp Jump Generator
Prince Yriel - 155
==Troops==
2x 10 Dire Avengers – 152[304]
---Exarch, Dual Avenger Shuriken Catapults, Bladestorm
2x Wave Serpent – 125[250]
---Twin-Linked Scatter Laser, Spirit Stones
10 Storm Guardians – 127
---2 Flamers, Warlock, Destructor
Wave Serpent – 110
---Twin-Linked Shuriken Cannon, Spirit Stones
==Fast Attack==
8 Warp Spiders – 218
---Exarch, Exarch Death Spinner, Powerblades, Withdraw
==Elites==
2x 7 Fire Dragons – 112[224]
2x Wave Serpent – 125[250]
---Twin-Linked Shuriken Cannon, Spirit Stones, Star Engines
==Heavy Support==
2x Fire Prism – 115[230]

Total – 1993

Swapped my Farseer out for my Spider'tarch since Doom actually isn't needed very often with the high amount of S6+ weapons in this list. The only unit that gets a substantial benefit from Doom is the Dire Avengers, and Bladestorming with two squads in unison plus their transports weapons is usually enough to destroy of severely cripple the unit they are shooting at. The +2 to reserves makes reserves almost 100% reliable, with usually 1-2 squads not arriving, but with the amount of doubling up of unit choices, this doesn't seem to hinder my game plan much.
 
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