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Son of LO
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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
1. My friend recentely pointed out that skimmers moving fast only claim their bonus when weapons BEAT their armour value. If it is equal then they don't get the rule meaning that ap 1 still gets its bonus. This is stupid as it means my Falcon fears a 2 from his railgun far more then a 6. I know this has probably been discussed several times but I can't figure out search and I thought I would just tack it on to this thread.

2. SM commanders get rites of battle, if a squad is outnumbered in cc it gets negative leadership. Does this mean they have the commanders Ld 10 or do they have his Ld 10 -1 for being outnumbered? (same for IG commanders and vox). If its the 1st one if the commander has -1 to his leadership does this mean that rites of battle has -1 Ld?

3. My friend also pointed out that fearless creatures must make an armour save if they are outnumbered in close combat. I believe him on this but I can;t find a page number if someone could please supply the page.

Thanks for any help.
 

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Too Sexy For My Whirlwind
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1,148 Posts
1. My friend recentely pointed out that skimmers moving fast only claim their bonus when weapons BEAT their armour value. If it is equal then they don't get the rule meaning that ap 1 still gets its bonus. This is stupid as it means my Falcon fears a 2 from his railgun far more then a 6. I know this has probably been discussed several times but I can't figure out search and I thought I would just tack it on to this thread.
I believe the wording in the bgb was unintentional in this matter. I'm not sure where but I did see something about how skimmers moving fast are in fact still safe against AP1 attacks, but I can't remember where.

2. SM commanders get rites of battle, if a squad is outnumbered in cc it gets negative leadership. Does this mean they have the commanders Ld 10 or do they have his Ld 10 -1 for being outnumbered? (same for IG commanders and vox). If its the 1st one if the commander has -1 to his leadership does this mean that rites of battle has -1 Ld?
Rites of Battle simply changes a marines base ld to 10. Thus if they lose a combat they still count all negative modifiers, but they start counting down from 10 instead of their customary
8. If the commander has any negative modifiers on him it won't effect the whole army. In practice you can assume that the battle is a little intense for the whole army to be monitoring the commanders constant situation.

3. My friend also pointed out that fearless creatures must make an armour save if they are outnumbered in close combat. I believe him on this but I can;t find a page number if someone could please supply the page.
Fearless creatures that lose combat and are outnumbered at least two to one are subject to No Retreat: pg 48 of the bgb, right hand column.
 

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Son of LO
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3,475 Posts
Discussion Starter · #5 ·
im really sorry to bring this post up again but no-one answered the question properly.

I KNOW that skimmer overrides ap 1 so please don't explain that. However the exact wording in the rule book is that skimmer's moving fast ONLY occurs if a weapon beats its armour value. If a weapon equals it's armour value then skimmers moving fast doesn't occur. Therefore if a weapon has AP 1 and EQUALS the skimmers armour value then it remains a penetrating hit.

I know whats common sense in this but my friend is a rules lawyer and insists on this rule. This could really screw up my new falcon against his railguns so please help me.
 

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Since you play eldar you are lucky in that regard - the Eldar FAQ explicitly states that "if a skimmer moving over 6" is hit, regardless of the source, all penetrating hits become glancing hits".

This does not discriminate between penetrating hits due to beating the armour value and those due to AP1 at all, so there can be no argument about it.
 

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No Rest For the Righteous
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Rolling enough to damage the vehicle is beating its armor, even if the damage roll is equal to their armor. If the attack isn't "beating" its armor, then the attack is doing no damage.

It just goes to show that its something that can be read two different ways. You and your friend will just have to settle it before the game. Its pretty silly to argue for ap1, even with the glancing hit skimmers are pretty fragile.
 

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Son of LO
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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
thanks for the help that was really bugging for games. He'll probably find other rules though so don't be surprised if im on here for help regualarly.

I just call him a bloody cheat for breaking "the most important rule". That is the best thing in that rulebook.8)
 

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A safe bet is to simply keep a copy of each Codex, FAQ, and Chapter Approved you can get your hand on. I play Necrons and have run into many issues like this one. Most of them can be easily remedied by displaying the official ruling. but if you don't have it handy you have no proof.
 
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