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Now with STFU flames!
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Discussion Starter · #1 · (Edited)
Please see this thread on how to participate in these games. I want to stress to everyone that the mission means everything. He who stands the best way to score Victory Points should be the winner. All missions have the Infiltration, Deep Strike, and Victory Points special rules.

Mission Type - Take and Hold

Karellian Ice Giants, Elements of the 1st and 7th Company - (2 points)
Space Wolves

Headquarters – 544 points
Company Commander Alexandrovitch Kasparov (Wolf Lord):
Space Marine Bike, Frost Blade, Bolt Pistol, Wolf Tooth Necklace, Belt of Russ, Two (2) Karellian Bear Dogs (Counts as Fenrisian Wolves)

Wolf Guard Battle Leader: Space Marine Bike, Frost Blade, Bolt Pistol, Wolf Tooth Necklace, Two (2) Karellian Bear Dogs (Counts as Fenrisian Wolves)

Space Wolf Venerable Dreadnought Grigorii Mishkiin:
Extra Armour, Assault Cannon, Heavy Flamer, Drop Pod (Space Wolves Venerable Dreadnoughts are costlier and stronger, with higher WS, BS, and Attacks.)

Elite – 170 points
Space Wolf Scouts squad – Seven (7) men
Three (3) armed with Bolt Pistol and CCW
Two (2) armed with Bolt Pistol and Power weapons
One (1) armed with Meltagun
Wolf Guard Leader: Wolf Tooth Necklace; Power Fist and Bolt Pistol

Troops – 660 points
Blood Claws Pack – Ten (10) men
Seven (7) armed with Bolt Pistol and CCW
Two (2) armed with Bolt Pistol and Power Fists
One (1) armed with flamer
Drop Pod

Blood Claws Pack – Ten (10) men
Seven (7) armed with Bolt Pistol and CCW
Two (2) armed with Bolt Pistol and Power Fists
One (1) armed with flamer
Drop Pod

10 Grey Hunters Pack – Ten (10) men
Five (5) armed with Bolt Pistol and CCW
Two (2) armed with Plasma Pistol and CCW
One (1) armed with Melta gun
Two (2) armed with Bolt Pistol and Power Fists
Drop Pod

Fast Attack – 330 points
Blood Claw Bikers Pack – Five (5) men
Two (2) armed with CCW
Two (2) armed with Power Fists
One (1) armed with Flamer
(Joined by Wolf Lord)

Blood Claw Bikers Pack – Five (5) men
Three (3) armed with CCW
Two (2) armed with Power Fists
(Joined by Wolf Guard Leader)

Heavy Support – 150 points
Whirlwind:
Vengeance Missiles

Whirlwind:
Vengeance Missiles
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Flesh Tearers - 2nd Company under the command of Chaplain Megacles - (2 points)
Blood Angels Space Marines

Headquarters – 275 points

Master of Sanctity Chaplain Megacles – Automatically leads Death Company squad.
Thunder hammer; Terminator Honours; Jump Pack; Frag Grenades

D3+3 Death company

Elites – 486 points
Terminator Assault Squad Harmodius – Six (6) men
Three (3) armed with Thunder Hammer and Storm Shield
Three (3) armed with Pair of Lightning Claws.

Dreadnought “Crushinator”:
Extra Armour; Smoke Launchers; Assault Cannon; DCCW

Dreadnought “Harvester”:
Extra Armour; Smoke Launchers; Assault Cannon; DCCW; Venerable

Troops – 764 points
Tactical Squad Alpha – Eight (8) men
Six (6) armed with Bolters
One (1) armed with Meltagun
Sergeant: Power Fist and Bolt Pistol, Terminator Honours

Tactical Squad Beta – Eight (8) men
Six (6) armed with Bolters​
One (1) armed with Meltagun​
Sergeant: Power Fist and Bolt Pistol, Terminator Honours​

Tactical Squad Gamma – Eight (8) men​
Six (6) armed with Bolters​
One (1) armed with Meltagun​
Sergeant: Power Weapon and Bolt Pistol; Terminator Honours; Frag Grenades​

Tactical Squad Delta – Eight (8) men​
Six (6) armed with Bolters​
One (1) armed with Meltagun​
Sergeant: Power Weapon and Bolt Pistol; Terminator Honours; Frag Grenades​

Scout Squad Epsilon – Eight (8) men​
Seven (7) armed with Bolt Pistol and CCW​
Sergeant: Power Weapon and Bolt Pistol; Terminator Honours; Teleport Homer; Frag Grenades​


Fast attack – 160 points
Land Speeder Squadron “Shredder” – One (1) Land Speeder​
One (1) armed with Heavy Bolter and Assault Cannon​

Land Speeder Squadron “Harpy” – One (1) Land Speeder​
One (1) armed with Heavy Bolter and Assault Cannon​


Heavy Support – 163 points
Vindicator “Inferno”​
Demolisher Cannon; Storm Bolter; Extra Armour; Power of the Machine Spirit; Smoke Launchers​

Notes:​
All non-vehicle models automatically have furious charge​
All Death Company models have Jump Packs.​

Tactics:​
Well, obviously tactics will change drastically depending on the amount of death company I get, but I’m expecting to get around seven or more death company, and I will put at least one sergeant in there to get a power fist or power weapon depending on which one suits the situation the best. The scouts will infiltrate close to the enemy, and hunker down in cover from the enemy. They’ll use their homer to draw the terminators down close, before diving forward from cover to tie up the units that could threaten the terminators – 21 strength 5 initiative 5 attacks plus 4 power weapon attacks with the same strength and initiative should do a fair amount of damage to anything that could threaten the terminators, and then they can consolidate into another unit and maybe tie that up. The terminators should hopefully be able to take some damage and then take out almost anything they run into. The death company and the chaplain will of course be another distraction to stop enemies totally annihilating the terminators when they come in, and the steamroller of the basic troops and sheer weight of meltaguns will lay the hurt down on anything with the help of blood rage. As for the dreadnoughts and the vindicator, they will lay down covering fire, the dreadnoughts advancing at the same time, taking out vehicles and heavy infantry. The LSTs will also deep strike down at some point and lay down some incredibly heavy cover fire which, when combined with the dreadnoughts, will result in a withering hail of assault cannon fire which can kill vehicles and infantry. The weapons being so versatile means they can turn their hands to either killing vehicles or infantry, and the sheer combat ability of everything means that they will be able to run up shooting and then charge to deliver the final deathblow.​
 

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Well, I'll get my vote in early to avoid the Christmas rush.

The hth capabilities of both armies are pretty close, but I think the advantage(slight though it is) will lie with the SWs since the BAs furious charge being countered by the greater number of power fists in the SW list and the fact that half of the BA army is armed with bolt guns.

The Death Company as always will be extremely dangerous, but I think again this is countered by the greater number of ICs on the SW side with very dangerous wargear.


The firepower between the two lists is weighted with the advantage to the BAs for the greater number of assault cannons for the BAs outweighing the usefulness of Whirlwinds versus power armour and bolters being better for shooting than bolt pistols.

However since the mission is take and hold and the SWs are all on bikes or in Drop pods, I believe that they can get to the objective first.

Pretty much every objective I've ever seen consists of some sort of terrain, they should be able to use that cover and their own slightly better hth capabilities to keep the BAs off of it.

In addition I believe that since the BA player has paid the points for PFs and PWs on their veteran sergeans, they will either:

A) Take the veteran sergeant for the Death company and essentially throw away points.

B) Take a regular trooper, who not being armed with a PF or PW will be ultimately, ground down through attrition by all the PFs on the SW side.

I'm going to have to vote for the Ice Giants for the mission, mainly due to their greater mobility. Not really a great surprise I suppose.
 

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I agree with Grey on about everything he says here and have several things to add.

The BC bike packs with attached ICs will probably each steamroller over at least 1 BA Tactical or Scout squad. That will give a lot of points.

The BA DC and Terminators are quite dangerous. But the Terminators will have to face down quite some powerfists, plus they will prolly be assaulting objectives held by the SW, an advantage for the fist bearing SW.
Then the DC, these guys indeed either waste effectivity or points. As described in the tactics, they will strike a balance, as a result of which they're just a quite dangerous assault squad instead of a monster.

I vote for the Space Wolves.

Finally I want to add my compliments to the BA player for not min-maxing his army for maximum cheese. A very original list this is.


Tai'shar
 

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Although drop poding against a combat list isnt always the brightenst move I believe that this SW lsit is superior in that pretty much all of its squads outclass the BA Tacticals, especialy with the plethora of Bikes.

Melta's and Bikes can deal with the Vindicators/Dreadnoughts.

SW

However I think I can be easily swayed.
 

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I would really like to see this fight in RL, I think it would be fun to watch. . . But who would win?
Blood Angles, but not very solidly.

Here is why I supect they would win. The objective is take and hold, so the blood angles are going to know where to set up to concentrate their firepower. As the wolfs come in piecemail, the blood angels have the firepower to outshoot them. If they get out of the drop pod then they will be outshot and downed to mass firepower. If they stay in the bloodangles have the ability to destroy the drop pod entangling them, then gunning them down next turn.

This shooting isn't the final solution (aka wolf wipeout), but will hurt them enough to give blood angles the edge. I see entangled blood claws getting charged by death company and loosing (blood claws are only half as scary if they can't charge, and considering how they come in (can't charge that turn) and the mobility of death company it isn't a hard to see them being the ones charged.

It should be an interesting bloodbath, but at least for now I see blood angles comming out on top.
 

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i vote space wolves
-the drop pods make them more mobile for the mission, and they have better CC abilities, with the bikers, powerfists, and characters.
 

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Ghost of LO
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Blood angles will totally hammer this space wolve list with shooting.

The death company will be large, and frightening.

the vindicators will annihlate drop pods.

All it needs to do is pop smoke the turn before the first wave of drop pods come

A) space wolves get first turn, so smoke is poped first turn

B) Blood angles get first turn, so smoke is popped second turn

Eitherway, the vindi is gonna be a huge treat.

Remember, it can still shoot with power of the machine spirt, on anything but a 6. It has a great chance of removing Lots of models.

The assault termintors with support fire from landspeeders

Assault cannon: 8 shots, 5 hits, 5 wounds, 2 dead space wolves.

Heavy bolter, 6 shots, 4 hits, 3 wound, 1 dead space wolve.

can also rampage through a squad of blood claws once they land, furious charge, with 3 Lightening claw termintators: 12 attacks, 8 hits, 7 wounds.

So they are dead before they can strike.

Death company can run through another unit:
Death company average: 3 models + 2 models. From squads: 6 sqauds, so another 3 models.

Death company total: 8 + chaplain, 2 powerweapon, 1 powerfist.
All death company get feel no pain, and + 1 attack, chaplain does normal chaplain bonus.

So they assault blood claws:

Chaplain: 6 attacks, 5 hits, 3 wounds.

2 powerweapons: 8 attacks, 7 hits, 4 wounds.

5 normal death company 18 hits, 12 wounds, 4 dead.

So the blood claws wont strike against them either.

If they assault the grey hunter, they will kill them 2, but they need the pistols to do it. (that is before they can strike back)

Remember theres still a powerfist.

Blood Angles win.
 

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Those who voted for the BA seem to forget the BC Bikers. By the time the Drop pods start arriving the BA will have lost at least 2 of their troop squads to the Bikers, which prolly almost annihilate a squad per turn.
If they do manage to annihilate a squad on the charge they can consolidate into the next, if they don't they're protected from shooting. Either way they will cost the BA big.

And then hte pods still have to arrive. Not to forget that if the pods arrive at the same time and early in the game the BA will have it really hard.


Tai'shar
 

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Slave to the flesh
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Space Wolves

The Blood claws assaults will be far superior to any assaults the BA start. Combine this with the CC monster that is the wolf lord and the OBEL scouts the BA are in for a rough time.
 

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Blood Angels

The objective is half way between the deployment zones, no? The Blood Angels have plenty of time to take it. Also, consider this:

Drop Pods are unreliable, who knows how many could drop down a turn? The Blood Angels have 4 Assault Cannons and countless Bolter shots. They can more than easily gun down a unit a turn, to death if not to crippled. The Space Wolf player is at a huge disadvantage sending his troops down like this. They don't have enough special weapons to make a difference.

Bikes? Meet Assault Cannons and Dreadnoughts. Powerfists in Close Combat aren't that great, and by no means are successful.

The Space Wolves would have it if it was ALL Deep Striking, or NONE of it was. Not half and half.
 

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The deep down truth
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Silver Wings said:
Although drop poding against a combat list isnt always the brightenst move I believe that this SW lsit is superior in that pretty much all of its squads outclass the BA Tacticals, especialy with the plethora of Bikes.

Melta's and Bikes can deal with the Vindicators/Dreadnoughts.

SW

However I think I can be easily swayed.
Think I will have to go with the SW on this one, the BA just dont have enough to overwhelm the ultra CC Wolves, yes the DC is dangerous but it relies on a good roll to get the numbers up, and the SW lords are really tough (I use bike mounted lords myself) they have the mobility to get to the tactical squads of the BA's and they will tear through them with the BC bikers as back up. Shoot the DA first for as long as possible and wipe up whats left with the lords and bikes

Also the master has a big disadvantage he takes a thunder hammer so his int advantage has gone, the SW lords will be hitting him with S5 power weapon attacks hitting on 3+ nasty.
The Ven dread is an awesome model and with his BS will be a major threat to the 2 LS and the vindicator and he is a swine to kill, and that Vindicator is really vulnerable to the bike packs and Scouts (Wolves scouts excel at this), they get to the rear armour they will pop it.

The Drop pods actually work in the Wolves favour on this mission, they effectivelly mean the bulk of the Wolves are safe for a few turns and they can be dropped close to the objective, with the bikes and the dread close to distract fire and CC they should be able to deploy in relative safety and the next Wolves turn they can either dig in and hold the center or go on the CC rampage either way they will be effective.
Even if they get charged space wolves are best in CC whatever the circumstances.
The Scouts are also usefull if they get close to the vindicator or dreads they have a good chance of destroying them.

The Whirlwinds will probaly be ignored until they start hurting tactical squads and other soft targets.

The BA's are relying on the DA and the Wolves have the means to take them out, even a few shots from that BS5 Ven will hurt em, The LST are to few in number and fragile.
The only real fly in the ointment could be the termi assault squad DSing on the centre and holding it they could be tough to shift.

But overall I think the Wolves have the edge on CC and the drop pods work well in this scenario. So Wolves but it will be a tough close battle
 
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