[Supernobbs]

right, hi all. i'll say it now so you understand: im a bit of a noob!

i just recently decided to start collecting 40k and Daemonhunters were my choice of army. i used to collect LOTR but it seemed to me that bows were starting to bore me to near death, and so i thought id collect 40k. i went for this army as i just loove the Grey Knights. my army is yet to be complete, and i just have a few questions...

1) how do i get a Grey Knight Grand Master, and if so, Cud i make my Captain Stern a grand master?

2) is there a limit to how many points your army may be?

3) is it a difficult army to play?

i have a few more questions, but it all depends on how these ones are anwsered. cheers in advance guys

 

[Dreachon]

1. there is currently no dedicated model for a GK grand master, BC stern makes for a good alternatieve but any GK in terminator armour would, off course you might want to make him look a bit more special, if you want to use Stern that is fully legal.

2. No, your army can be a big as you want it, however if you play a game with a person both of you must agree on a fixed points battle and you must adhere to that for the battle.
So no 5000pts army that goes against a 1500pts army, if you want to collect a larger army that is entirely up to you, larger armies have some advantages over smaller in that they allow you have more choice in terms of what to field.

3. A pure GK army is indeed very hard to play with, not only are you models very expensieve, you'll always be outnumbered and your models are still just as fragile as normal space marines, you'll also lack severly in the anti-tank department.

Hope this helps

 

[Inquisitor Solexus]

Questions 1 and 2 got answered as well as they can, so I'll go with a little more on #3.

Take a good long look at the army list. The only unit choices in the base DH list that can take dedicated anti-tank weapons are all in the Heavy Support section, and they all are Vehicles, and they all cost a bunch of points! Not only that, but two of them are Land Raider variations and you're likely going to spend a few turns moving them at high speed to get your Grey Knights into combat range, which means you can't shoot until they're dropped off.

Your other options are meltagun-toting Stormtroopers and Inquisitor Retinues, but they have to take transports as well and suffer almost the same problem: they can't shoot until they're dropped off in range of the enemy. However, don't ignore the little sidebar at the bottom of pages 30-31: it makes your army list practically twice as big! Remember that you have access to these choices as well, and consider them once you've played a few games and decided what your army is lacking.

If the gamers in your area don't tend to play much armor, you're probably set. If they do, though, take the time to invest in Dreadnoughts or Inducted Imperial Guard to increase your AT potential. Guard Iron Fist squads can take an upgrade to let you re-roll Reserves rolls as well...perfect if you like Deep Strikers and that wonderful Callidus Assassin.

Welcome to the Inquisition.

 

[Wraith]

Solexus covered our lack of tank busting firepower well, but there is a silver lining there...

Every Grey Knight who isn't wasting his time lugging around an Incinerator can kill a light or medium tank. They've even got a chance against heavy tanks with the exception of Land Raiders and Monoliths. All GK's are S6 in combat or carry a S6 Psycannon, making any tank with an Armor value of 12 or less a viable target! Still not ideal, but it means that you've always got at least one option for hurting a tank.

As for everything else, the army is extremely powerful if it's well played. We've got Power Armour, all the stats of a Marine and more, and we're better equipped for all phases of combat than almost any other troops out there. We can't stand up to combat specialists in assault, and we can't outshoot shooting specialists - but we'll outfight the shooters, outshoot the fighters, and just plain beat up other generalists. Combine this with the rest of the GK's special rules and you've got a very scary force when Lady Luck's on your side... But when things go bad on you, we're ultimately just pricey Marines when it comes to killing us.

So a pure GK force is a real gamble - either great success, or crushing failure... They don't tend to do anything in between. But with all the options you can field as allies from the Marine, Guard and Witchhunters codexes, there's almost nothing an Inquisitorial army can't do if it's set up right.

 

[Supernobbs]

well, im currently sitting on:

HQ:

Grand Master (cheers for the help) brother captain stern and a 3 man guard all coming to 634 points

lord inquisitor Coteaz and his retinue all coming to 395 points

Elites:

Two six Man squads of terminators coming to 756 points a unit

a vindicare assassin coming to 110 (i think)

Troops:

Two six man squads of grey knights coming to 580 points each

im currently stacked up to 3811 points, and i still need fast attack and heavy support, so here are 2 more questions:

1) would i be able to buy a space marine assault squad but glue the jetpacks to a unit of grey knights, ultimately making a fast attack?

2) what tanks would be good to convert (and this is gonna sound dumb) but i really want a baneblade

ty in advance

 

[number6]

well, im currently sitting on:
HQ:

Grand Master (cheers for the help) brother captain stern and a 3 man guard all coming to 634 points

lord inquisitor Coteaz and his retinue all coming to 395 points

Elites:

Two six Man squads of terminators coming to 756 points a unit

a vindicare assassin coming to 110 (i think)

Troops:

Two six man squads of grey knights coming to 580 points each

im currently stacked up to 3811 points, and i still need fast attack and heavy support, so here are 2 more questions:

1) would i be able to buy a space marine assault squad but glue the jetpacks to a unit of grey knights, ultimately making a fast attack?

2) what tanks would be good to convert (and this is gonna sound dumb) but i really want a baneblade

ty in advance

Do you even have a codex?

For starters, your points are WAY inflated. It is flatly impossible for even the most impressively equipped GM + Stern + 3 GKTs to cost 634 pts. A 6-man GKT squad cannot possibly cost 756 pts. You don't appear to be certain of the Assassins' cost. A 6-man GK squad cannot possibly cost 580 pts. (Two 6-man GK squads cannot possibly cost 580 pts.)

Secondly, you don't appear to know what the force organization chart options even are. Hint: Grey Knights never have jump packs. And Grey Knights don't have a choice of tanks, plural, unless you count two Land Raider variants. Baneblades aren't available except in games of Apocalypse, which is an optional expansion rules-set for giant-sized, non-competitive, all-day games. Baneblades are not in any 40K army's codex or army list (though they are specific to the Imperial Guard, not the Space Marines, Inquisition, or Grey Knights, for what it's worth).

I suggest that the first thing you do is buy the codex and read it thoroughly. Then consider starting out with an army sized between 750 pts and 1000 pts, which will give you a chance to learn how the DH army functions, what units you like the best and that mesh well with your playstyle. Post example lists in the army list subforum above and you'll get sound advice. That way you won't waste your time or your money on something you may ultimately not be satisfied with. The DH is very much a niche force, one that responds well to a tactically sharp general but which crumples quickly and easily in inexperienced or impatient hands. The upside is that success with the army is considerably more rewarding than that with armies with obvious power combinations or shallow point-and-click tactics.

 

[Supernobbs]

lol, i own the codex. truth is, as i said, ima noobie to 40k. i only just started collecting DH, and grey knights were my choice....

and in my codex it says that GKT are 46 points each. and some dude said i had to add up all the gear they have aswell, which puts them up to 116 points a model.....well i think so anyway. im only doing what im told. lol. as i said, im a nab, so any help on this points malarky will help me greatly

 

[Technique13]

some dude was wrong, you pay the price in the pts/model section and you recieve the model with the wargear as listed on the profile... if a model has access to the armoury then you can buy additional items from the armoury for the model to use... a base terminator is not 116 points

 

[Supernobbs]

i mean, terminator= 46 points plus his gear (i think)
and the gear is storm bolter: 10 points
termintor armour= 20 points
force weapon: 40 points

which make 116 points.... is this right, or am i doing summit wrong. bear in mind im only doing as i was told....

 

[Supernobbs]

are you sure? i mean, the guy who said i shud add up all their gear was this bloke called ben who works in games workshop near to where i live. thats the only reason i thought so....

 

[Draago]

are you sure? i mean, the guy who said i shud add up all their gear was this bloke called ben who works in games workshop near to where i live. thats the only reason i thought so....

For normal troops, all their wargear is already costed out for you in their profile cost (it is also detailed what equipment they have basic in their profile) for instance:::


Grey Knight termaintators and X points, this already includes their Storm Botlers and Nemesis Force Weapons


however if the Grey Knight Termainator at 50 points wished to have a Psycannon for instance (an upgrade your allowed because it says so in their list entry) then you have to pay for the basic Terminator and then for the upgrade (so 50 + 20 = 70points for that Terminator)

**NOTE**the points above are fictional so not to jeperdise copy right laws ;-)

If you read all of the unit entries, you will see what equipment they come with as standard, and what upgrades they will have, and if allowed to what part of the armoury they have access to (be it the Armoury as a whole or just the wargear section)
-- Its a little hard to explain considering that your not allowed to

 

[Supernobbs]

so does this sound more realistic then: my terminator unis now cost (taking into account what you've all said) 316 points each..... better?

and what about heroes? like Stern or Cortez? do i have to add on their gear?

 

[Draago]

No as mentioned before they have their own entry detailing what they already have in their base cost

 

[Supernobbs]

right so what i have now is:

HQ::

Corteaz and Retinue: 185 pts

Brother Captain Stern with a 4 man terminator guard, one with psycannon: 350 pts

ELITES::

2 Squads of Grey Knight Terminators with one psycannon in each, coming to 316 pts per squad

vindicare assassin at 110 pts

TROOPS::

2 Squads of Grey Knights with one psycannon in each coming to 200 pts per unit


have'nt really thought about Fast attack or heavy support yet, so im open to ideas. but adding up what i have so far, it comes to:: 1677 pts

im guessing i shud aim for a 2000 pts army now i have about 300pts to spend on Heavy support and fast attack....but yer as i said, im open to advice for fast attack and heavy support. thanks in advance, and cheers for the help peeps

 

[Dreachon]

BC stern and Coteaz are special characters, they have a fixed point costs and for that price you get all the stuff listed in their profiles.

Personally this bloke has been pulling your leg, I don't know if he did it intentionally or not so you best reference with us here the next time he tells you something to make sure others aren't trying to abuse your status as a beginner.

 

[Supernobbs]

BC stern and Coteaz are special characters, they have a fixed point costs and for that price you get all the stuff listed in their profiles.

Personally this bloke has been pulling your leg, I don't know if he did it intentionally or not so you best reference with us here the next time he tells you something to make sure others aren't trying to abuse your status as a beginner.

yer i know. i was a hardcore LOTR collector, but ive been meaning to collect DH for ages, just because i love the grey knights so much. whether they'll win me games or not doesn't bother me. i just want to play with them....

anyway, fast attack and heavy support? i still think it wud be cool to convert a grey knight squad and give them jump packs off of a Space Marines assault squad

but seriously im open to advice. bear in mind i only have about 320pts though

 

[Izzinatah]

If it's listed in the entry as "Example Unit xpts/model" then has "Equipment: Example Unit has a force weapon and a bolt pistol", then Example Unit comes with a force weapon and a bolt pistol, the points are included in the "xpts/model" and you do not have to pay any more points to equip it with a force weapon and a bolt pistol.

Additionally if it then says "model may purchase additional equipment from the Example Army armoury at the points cost indicated" you may give the model, for example, Terminator Honours at the points cost listed in the armoury section of your codex, any weapons/armour you purchase will override the basic equipment for the model - for example, equipping a storm bolter to a model with a bolt gun and a close combat weapon will replace the bolt gun, as bolt guns and storm bolters are both two-handed weapons. You may have one two-handed weapon and a one handed weapon or two one handed weapons.

I hope that helped - basically if it says "at the points cost indicated" or "for xpts", you pay extra - if not, it comes with the model and you don't have to pay squat.

 

[Supernobbs]

please forgive my noobiness (lol, im going to a noobie day at GW today)

in the codex it says the unit name, and stats blah blah blah

then its got equipment: NFW and Storm bolter

then options

so the *equipment* is already on the unit, and doesnt have to be payed for?

 

[Technique13]

yes thats exactly correct.... also, the points costs in the armoury are for independent characters etc... thats why they cost more....

 

[SGluciousa]

Also, how many Grey Knights do you have in each squad? This way we can check your points.

You don't need fast attack or heavy support. Nor do you need eletes but you have them. I would skip in general because you have a fair amount of gk. I think you should get 2-3 Dreadnoughts. Give them Twin Linked Lascannons and Missile launchers. This should put you in the 2000 point region.

I hope this helped!