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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
PLease do not flame me or call this a stupid idea because its not my idea. It is a friends idea but he doesn't want to register for the forums. HE wants to field a large Infantry force of Guard mainly pumped up for hand to hand and close range shooting. He says he is doing it as a theme for his army and has fluff made up for it. IS he completely mad or do you think he could pull it off and have a semi effective hand to hand/close range shooting guard army. I believe he will rely on outnumbering his opponents in hand to hand at all times by keeping his infantry units close together at all times and fielding a 50 man conscript unit. HE also would feild 3 6 man units of ogryns in chimeras.

The doctrines he planned on using are: Close Order Drill, Hardened Fighters, Iron Discipline, conscripts(maybe carapace amor instead), and Ogryns.
 

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i dont think he is mad...he should put his squads about 4 " away from each toher tho so if u lose ombat they enemy is foprced to sweep and thatrmeans u can shoo the ***** out of them. he should still have the basilisk and lemun russ tho, just for fire support. i think if done rihgt it can be effective.
 

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Sounds like an awesome idea... though I don't know if it would work out right :)

I kind of took my army (Death Korps) along a HtH style, it's good to hear that more guard players don't bother to play their army the way it was meant to be played. I heard rumors of warrior weapons guard (don't know if it is true) but it was supposed to give them all pistol + ccw. If that was the case, you could make a butt kicking guard army out of a bunch of guys with that doctrine.

Mostly, for my army, I weigh down the enemy by numbers in close combat, and outfit all my officers with power weapons/fists to really make them do some damage. My thinking on power fists was always: I strike last in hand to hand combat anyway, might as well kill a few people if I'm still standing!

Tell your friend he's not completely crazy (in my mind), I think it sounds like a great idea. I was just thinking about a tallarn kind of fremen guard army, not that I would make one.
 

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you could go two units of conscripts with warrior weapons ( 4 doctrine points ) and unit of ten ogryns ( 30 wounds, 30 S6 attacks on the charge )

This is what I've been thinking of doing, however I realy want to include engineseers
 

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Son of LO
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I just don't understand people who go buy an IG army and then the first thing they try to do with it is get in to HtH.
Hey, when your friend gets tired of getting his butt mopped up after attempting to HtH anything resembling Space Marines, Eldar, Dark Eldar, Tyranids, Orks and Necrons, ask him if he'll sell his army to me. (That only leaves other guard armies and Tau...)
If he still insists on this course of action at least tell him to fill ALL his elites slots with as many Ogryn as the new codex allows and attach a tooled up Commissar to each unit. Only then can I see guard doing well in HtH.
I have the highest win record at my store out of 20 people with my IG army and it sure as heck isn't from getting into HtH with them.
 

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Son of LO
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Balance is the key, you can't have too much of any one thing for IG to work well.

1) You need no more than one tank for every 500 points for starters and the first tank that every IG army should have is a Basilisk the second should be a leman russ and the third tank, if you play 1500 and up armies, should either be a Demolisher or Exterminator (Yes you can still use it).
2) If you have a group of soldiers on the table, other than Ogryn, then they need a heavy weapon and their full compliment of assault weapons. period.
Your command squad is only their to keep the rest of your squads from running away.
3) Don't waste points on tooling up your colonel; just take him, a comm link and a banner and sit behind your troops providing morale and an extra heavy weapon.

I have other points that I would make, but the new IG dex may override those points so I'll save them until I read it. But these are the basics and should be followed no matter what.
 

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Personally i don't see the use of a Close Combat guard army. The guard are a shooty army that pummel others into submition with laserlights (lasguns) and artillery. Then if the odds are in their favor or the enemy has taken heavy casualties they will use close combat to destroy them.

Sure the new rules allow for improved Close Combat but i find that it defeats the purpose of collecting a guard army. If you want close combat go orks or nids. The guard are for shooting.
 

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he should put his squads about 4 " away from each toher tho so if u lose ombat they enemy is foprced to sweep and thatrmeans u can shoo the ***** out of them.
Hey, can so explain that to me ?
I've already heard of the 4" distance between troops, but I don't understand why the enemy is forced to sweep and not assault you.

Thanks for lighting my torch.

Kryss
 

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Son of LO
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Ummm, there is no more sweeping advance now. The enemy only gets to consolidate 3" after winning in CC. This means that if you keep all of your squads more than 4" apart, then soldiers with normal sized bases will not be able to get into close combat again. This means you can shoot the crap out of whatever just won in CC.

I personally put the front row of my guardsmen about 6 1/2" away from the back row. I don't worry about the 4" rule past the first row, cause if they survive your turn of free shooting at them, then it's kinda too late for you by then.
 

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I also plan to modify my Guard force from being shooty to being shooty and stabby. Ogryns with Commisars are a good start. I also plan on getting a Sanctioned Psyker with Honorifica Imperialis and a Force Weapon. Toss him in with the Command Group and go pick a fight with something big (but now too big, S3 can't hurt too much!). And since Power Weapons cost only 5 points, making a stabby Guard army might not cost much more than the standard shooty force.
 

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Son of LO
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If you are planning on playing a stabby IG army then follow this three step program:

1) stand in front of wall
2) bang head against wall
3) repeat ad infinitum

That's how frustrated you'll be. Sorry.
 

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Son of LO
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Str 3 aint that bad?! It means that powerfists are a waste of points on IG armies, you might as well take power weapons cause you aint instakilling much with Str 6, and the things that you CAN instakill, should have been flash lighted to death by that point.
Nids! If you want mass amounts of troops with stabby things, then buy Nids. You can be stabby all day with Nids and the best part is that you will win in HtH with them without just getting lucky.
 

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Discussion Starter · #15 ·
Ok my freind decided he isnt going to do a HTH army, but he wants to make a themed army built around the idea that his guys are half ogryn half human( i dont know why he likes that theme). Does anyone have any modeling tips on how he should make them look more ogryn like. He will be using the plastic cadians as a base. I was thinkign he could use ork heads on the cadian bodies and just paint the ork head like a normal human head. would this work?
 

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Son of LO
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No kidding, there are like 6 or more different army styles for IG armies, If you can't find something that you like, such as the new cadians, then you must be pretty jaded.
I know that some models are not in production anymore, but you can pick up just about anything on Ebay. I've started a Mordian army just off of ebay and the funny thing is that I've actually payed less so far than the pieces would have cost me new. :)
 

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aww, don't bash a HtH guard army, it might actually be fun.

Of course powerfists are good for guard. They wound most grunts on a 2+. It isn't about insta-killing, it's about wounding. You attack last in HtH anyway (almost guaranteed), you might as well kill somebody when you hit em. You can either 5+ to wound with a power weapon on almost everything, or 2+ with a power fist.

Your friend's idea about the ogryn thing is not a bad idea, it would just be hard to model, and you couldn't accurately represent the fact that your men are ogryns (there are no additional toughness/wounds doctrines, unfortunately :) ), so the rules would be rather bland for them.
 

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There is nothing wrong with a HTH IG force...
In fact it could be very deadly.
I have seen a guy only using regular IG troops in his army, then in the first round they just rush forward and in time crush against the enemy.
Normally this is a very unnatural thing for an IG army to do... and that's the good thing about it.
People woulden't expect it until they fought you a couble of times, and then they still have the problem with that massive amount of models rushing towards them... there is a good chance that they won't be able to cope with a HTH with so many wounds...

That might just give you the win...
 

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I think it sounds like a blast to try and its not like it would be set in stone if you did that.
You'd make your H2H army and get some extra troops so if you feel you know, those two Russ's and some heavy weapons would be good you can just toss em in and BANG, you've got yourself the 'standard' IG army.

I'd love to do it, but IG are after SOBs and I collect my armies really slowly...
 
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