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Sir Proofreader
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Discussion Starter · #1 · (Edited)
So, I'm guessing from the mere fact that you are reading this post that you have some interest in Vampire Counts.

I don't know what set my curiosity off, though I'm attributing it to Dragorakiba's post. Dragorakiba mentioned the fact that Undead held some appeal, leading to a decision to start Vampire Counts. Fairly easy, straightforward stuff.

And yet... what about Tomb Kings? Are they not Undead too? In fact, weren't the two armies represented by one single Army Book back in the day? A united force of Undead, or something like that.

So, I guess what I'm angling for here are the answers to two questions;

1) How many Vampire Counts players also have a Tomb Kings army?
2) Do Tomb Kings hold any appeal for you whatsoever?


For me, I have to say that I don't have a Tomb Kings army. I did buy a Temple Guard Blister (at least I think it was Temple Guard) but that was only because I wanted to nick one of their swords for a conversion. And a shield later, just because it was lying around.

And personally, I see no attraction from Tomb Kings. I don't particularly dislike them, but... it's just a bunch of skeletons to me. I know all my infantry in my Vampire Counts armies are Skeletons, but somehow this is different!

It makes no sense to me that I can really like one Undead army, even aiming to build it up influenced by the ranks-upon-ranks of Skeleton warriors as similar to a Tomb Kings army, and yet be thoroughly disinterested in Tomb Kings themselves!

So, is it the same for you? Or do you fawn over all manner of undead beasties, no matter their origins? Enlighten me, fellow forumers!

Cheers,
Deadstar_MRC
 

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The main reason I "started" (I collect and rarely play, you should see my display case[Im actually looking to sell some]) Vampire Counts is just that. For the vampires.

The main reason I dont collect or play Tomb Kings is because they dont have vampires, and that the only then TK have are skeletons, at least the VC have zombies and ghouls.

Dont get me wrong, I though about having both once, but it just never caught on with me.
 

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That is a good point actually. Both armies did appeal to me because they are undead but the vampires counts have the ability to summon more undead models. I don't know if it is because I have not looked into it enough but I don't think the tomb kings can. The only upside to the tomb kings is that they get catapults, archers, and other shooting units while the vampires have none. (greedy tomb kings)
 

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I feel like the Vampire counts are darker more evil undead then the tomb kings [if thats possible] I was first drawn by the tomb kings because of my huge interest in egyptian history but was quickly put off by TK rules characters etc. I think its that the two armies while both being undead do not share the same feel when playing, painting, etc where as vampire counts are about expendable troops a vampires will TK are an ancient army serving their master after death and tend to be a brighter more unified army. Don't get me wrong i plan to play TK after i finish building my Vamps army
 

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When I first started VC, TK wasn't even out, I don't know which I would of chosen if they were. So good question....
But when TK came and I fliped through it's codex I came to the conclusion that its just like VC except
A) My lords were better
B ) My magic is less complicated (however i was jeaouse they could summon back wight alikes aka tomb guard)
C) They shoot...needing 5s to hit ROFL

Then somehow a friend of mine was convinced to collect them by some other buddies and we had a few 2v2s and we always ended up as enemies...in the end didn't go too well for him thanks to my vampires :D
Now he wants to go back to skaven and in exchange for getting him some skaven models he will give me his TK...I have no use for them but since the models are so similar, I could definitly convert most of them to fit a VC theme. However if the 7th for them draws my interest, I might play a TK army for fun.
Cheers :D
 

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Sir Proofreader
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Discussion Starter · #6 · (Edited)
I collect and rarely play, you should see my display case
Ah, a bit like me in that respect!
The main reason I don't collect or play Tomb Kings is because they don't have vampires
I can certainly agree with you here. It's the Vampires that make this army (quite literally, in fact)
The only upside to the tomb kings is that they get catapults, archers, and other shooting units while the vampires have none.
Actually, now that you raise this, it's silly. How do Tomb Kings mover their heavy artillery in a place filled with sand? At least it makes the armies stand out, and play quite differently, from one another.
I feel like the Vampire counts are darker more evil undead then the tomb kings [if that's possible]
I definietly agree. I don't quite know what it is but there is a certain malevolance implied with Vampire Counts. Tomb Kings (despite being undead abonimations) just don't seem so nasty.
...I came to the conclusion that its just like VC except
A) My lords were better
B) My magic is less complicated (however I was jealous they could summon back wight alikes aka tomb guard)
C) They shoot...needing 5s to hit ROFL
I guess this harks back to what Malacoda said - we're all in it for the Vampires!

Interesting points of view thus far! Thanks to all contributors!
Deadstar_MRC
 

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The only upside to the tomb kings is that they get catapults, archers, and other shooting units while the vampires have none. (greedy tomb kings)
This raises another point to why I like Counts more. I dont like the thought of archers raining feathery death down on the ranks of the enemy. If you think about it in real life terms, granted it is safer to be an archer, but if your like me, youll want to be on the frontlines hacking and slashing your way through the enemy army, people will have a better chance of remembering your name and what you did. Im all of the books Ive read, its always been Sir So-and-So, a swords/pike/spear-man of the kings army, never So-and-So, bow-man of the kings army.

As for the war machines, there are a rare few that I actually like, mainly the Dark Elf Reaper Bolt Thrower. Ive come up against these before and for some reason, it rarely ends well.
 

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Benevolent Dictator
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I play for two reasons. The lesser of the two reasons is their competitiveness. The TK are not. As far as my gaming circle and I are concerned, VC are the premiere army by which we judge all others. The VC have excellent magic, and represent the most important facets of hand to hand (combat resolution and/or ability to kill hordes), and shooting as well, as an enemy which is successful firing against VC will be hugely successful firing against most enemies. If an army can stand against our VC, or defeat our VC, we see it as a solid, valid tournament army.

The first and foremost reason that I play VC however, is for their fluff. The location of the TombKings means that they really play very little role in the affairs of the Old World. They are also 'softer' vampires. I could imagine a 10 year old picking up the army and playing a true-to-fluff, well envisioned force without his parents batting an eye. Sure, they're undead just like VC, but they against the vampire, and only fight in the defense of their land.
Vampires are a darker, more mature army. They play against a lot of human ideals. Vampires are a disgusting creature, and their armies are unstoppable waves that are fueled by the Vampires sheer hatred of the living. Their goal in multi-national, they seek to enslave the world.

The Vampire has persisted in pop culture. The Goth scene proves that it's a powerful image. Books and movies still forward it as the most common beast of Monster Horror. Mummies were just a theme dredged from antiquities and were only popular while we were making discoveries in egypt. Even 'The Mummy' movies are set in that time period, whereas Vampire movies stay current, stay "fresh", and continue to engage the populace.
 

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I've got a bit bored of my VC at the moment, but I'm not getting rid of them. Just concentrating on my brets which are prooving very fun. The thing is VC don't have and shooting, or artillerly like tomb kings which is all good fun.

Saying that though VC have far better looking characters and thats why I collect VC because I like Vampires (not in a weird way), and mummys just don't do anything for me (also not in a weird way).
 

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Sir Proofreader
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Discussion Starter · #10 · (Edited)
...you'll want to be on the frontlines hacking and slashing your way through the enemy army, people will have a better chance of remembering your name and what you did...
Another good point; the Vampires aren't just in this for fun - There's infamy on the line here!
Vampires are a darker, more mature army... The Vampire has persisted in pop culture.
Again, couldn't agree more. There's that much darker, insidious edge to Vampires, and that comes across in GW's incarnation as well. Interesting though that, while Pop Culture Vampires seem to be getting all soft and sparkly, GW has gone back to the brutal, bestial Vampire. A step in the right direction, I feel. (Here's to GW! :drink:)
...VC have far better looking characters and that's why I collect them, because I like Vampires (not in a weird way), and mummys just don't do anything for me (also not in a weird way).
Not in a weird way, eh? You just keep telling yourself that :p
But you've hit on something else - no doubt the recent update made VC more popular. Who's to say Tomb Kings won't get the same appeal when (if?) they are redone? I think the lack of attention Tomb Kings receive is also a contributing factor to the apathy surrounding them. (Boo, GW! :thunder:)
 

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Benevolent Dictator
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You're right, Deadstar- I'm VERy happy that GW is maintaining the beastial nature of the vampire. However, they haven't got much choice, since turning them 'sparkly' would utterly eradicate their player base.
Sparkly Vampires are actually a depressing sign of the times. Popular vampires (Carmilla, Dracula and after) have always been representations of excess. They are often wealthy, arrogantly contemptuous, perversely sexual, anti-christlike figures. As villains they appealed to people's darkest most secret desires, things that they as mortals could not indulge in or were forbidden to do. Initially, their actions were 'distasteful' and people loathed them. In our modern world though, much of what they do is seen as common place. We deify the wealthy and beautiful people, even when they're undeserving. Our culture has a more open sexuality now, many of the subtle hints of the vampire have been replaced by strip clubs and music videos. Our culture has lost it's unshakeable faith, and is no longer thrown into hysteria at the thought of an antichrist.
In Pop Culture, the only memorable things about the vampires is their stunning beauty, and what was meant to be shocking sexuality, is just appealing now. This is causing a shift of interest, and writers like Anne Rice and more recently Stephanie Meyer (scourge that she is) have capitalized on this to create a 'Vampire Romance'. Or, we see them as "not so bad" and get heroes like Blade, Blood Rayne, or the vamps in Underworld.

I like the violent background. I have no problem with a vampire being turned in a tragic way, but i don't hold back in the fluff that I write, or the Gothic Horror that I read. My vampire general butchers and crucifies a one-time-comrade's family in order to recruit him, he lies, backstabs, plots and murders, he takes whom he pleases and kills the rest, madness is a close friend to immortality. That is what a vampire should be, and I've vowed to write a modern vampire story that will represent this. We've lost touch with true fear, and the vampire is the monster to bring that kind of terror back.
 

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I have a cunning plan
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I own some Tomb Kings models since what draws me to the undead is the legions of skeletons which both armies have. I have only played a couple of games with Tomb Kings as I prefer the way Vampire Counts play but it's nice to spice things up and switch to the other undead every now and then. I like the Vampires, it's just I like the idea of legions of skeletons and undead more which is probably why I like both VC and TK.
 

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I hate to be the mr.know it all, but Tomb King and Vampire counts were never the same army. They have always been 2 different armies and were introduced at the same time around 2-3 edition rules.

But, when creating my first fantasy army, being an undead lover at heart and as a righter and old school video game player, i have always loved armies that one guy is the master and everyone else follows his every waking desire.

I did for a second want to start Tomb king but was quickly removed when i found out VC were twice as good at raising their dead. Plus the idea of vampires were just too cool to pass up, i mean who wants skeletons raising skeletons when you can have all mighty vamps raising the dead.

The last thing that made up my mind was later my friend started tomb kings and playing him i see why i started VC. The fact is simple that the tomb kings have crazy models like the bone giant, these anubis warrors, and basically our guys but better. During 6th addition the tomb kings were a far supperor army because not only did it have the VC units, but stupid crazy units that would run my poor guys over. The idea to me of "Powerful" undead units and having such a "diversity" between undead units sounded lame.

I love my VC because it's Zombie, Skeleton, Or buffer Skeleton with a better weapon, or if you want to be more adventures, buffer skelton with better weapon on a horse! When it came down to i wanted a legion of dead guys being controlled by some badass vampires, and not a bunch of misfit TK that look some lame, in my option on the table top.
 

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Um we only every need fives to hit no matter what and my king has stomped more than his fair share of vampires. Plus our magic is the most reliable in the game.
 

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For me it was because the art work on the front of the old skeleton warrior and zombie boxed sets was cool then the art work on the tomb kings boxed sets it was just that simple for the same reason I collected all of my armies bar 1 which was orcs and goblins
 
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