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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
The thought of building my guard army back up it is still hovering around in my head, and I don't really feel like doing a massed swarm of infantry, but also don't really want to do mechanised with lots of normal troops in transports. I'm just not keen on the way that transports play.

So is an army with barbone HQ and troops (or possibly a few more troops at higher points cost) mounted in a couple of chimera's supported by as many leman russes and sentinals/hellhounds as possible a viable army list? I know for objective stuff I'll have to guard the troops well, otherwise all my opponent has to do is pop a couple of chimeras and my job will become alot harder.

Any hints of what works well with this type of army? Should I have my russ's equiped for anti infantry with sentinals and possibly a devil dog or two dealing with enemy armour or the other way round? What about artillery? Or just leave it up to the impaccable advance of the lumbering behemoth that is the russ.

Thanks in advance for any help/tips.
 

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it can work well, but be warned youre toying with russ squadrons etc... which means less targets for you and your enemy, of course 3 russes will obliterate most things they fire at, but couple of meltas and your in for trouble. my main concern is the lack of troops, its really hard to protect targets in the 40st millenium what with space marines falling from the sky and such.. i think if you run this sort of army you should still invest in a platoon for your home objective and 2 squads in chimeras for capturing.. but once thats fulfilled, i say bring on the russes.
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
Well at 1k points I could have 3 mounted veteran squads, independant char HQ, 3 russes and something in a fast attack. i geuss much above 1k and I'll have to start putting them in squads.

If I'm going to have lots of tanks, even though I don't want a typical mechanized army, I'd still rather not have any foot soldiers.
 

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The Mechanized lists work well if you reconsider certain aspects. Forget platoons as you are paying out the nose for transports that can't be used to their fullest extent. Use veterans. You can field 4-5 squads of them at 1500 points. You can give each squad 3 melta at BS 4 which can be fired from inside the chimeras. 12-15 mobile melta shots is enough to worry anyone. Also remember that you need not disembark to hold an objective. Commmand squads work in a simialar way, except you can pack on a another special weapon. A lot of people like plasma to deal with TEQ but I like flamers to mow down hoards with the help of the multi-laser and a hull mounted heavy flamer. Which brings me to my next point. Get the heavy flamers on the chimeras, they are free and because you want to be up in the enemies face are a better choice.

I like russes but don't squandron them. I know this seems lame as you can't field too many of them but its worth it. At 1500 points a demolisher and a regular russ are the way to go. The demolisher will likely make it because of the amount of tank targets on the field or it will absorb all the fire and allow you to get everything else into position. For fast attack its a bit more an odd choice. I personally like sentinels, armored or regular, dosen't matter to me. I like them for transport hunting and tar-pitting dangerous assault troops. Alot of other people swear by Valks/Vendettas. Ultimately its a matter of personal preference.
 

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So is an army with barbone HQ and troops (or possibly a few more troops at higher points cost) mounted in a couple of chimera's supported by as many leman russes and sentinals/hellhounds as possible a viable army list? I know for objective stuff I'll have to guard the troops well, otherwise all my opponent has to do is pop a couple of chimeras and my job will become alot harder.
Sorry, but no. Russ-heavy lists just don't work well. The problem being that the Russ isn't really a proper main battle tank. It's an anti-infantry support tank with some (not great) ability to pop AV11/12 transports. Two Russes would fire at each other all day without doing much, as the main gun on a Vanilla Russ can only glance AV14, and a hull lascannon only has a 3% chance to kill it. Even a Demolisher or a Vanquisher wouldn't up the odds all that much. Because even if they hit and penetrate, it's only a single roll on the vehicle damage chart. Which is essentially a 3+ save.

I know this game-reality doesn't mesh well with current armored warfare tactics/doctrine, but it is the the far future. :)

(The only army with a proper MBT BTW, is the Tau, as their Hammerheads can fire either a high-str AT shot or a lower-str anti-infantry round.)

So that means that you have to depend on meltas to kill heavy armor, of which the best delivery system is a mounted Vet Squad with 3 meltas or a mounted PCS squad with 4 meltas. So a properly balanced 1500 pt (Valk-less) mech army will have 5 Chimeras (1 CCS and 4 Vets), 2 or so Russes, some Sentinels or Hydras for killing transports, and a Hellhound or two for killing hoards. Skimp on the troops and you'll lose 2/3rds of all your games.
 

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In my opinion, the chimera has pretty good fire power for it's points on its own. As a dedicated transport you can have lots of them, so i'd follow the other posters advice and suggest some mounted up veteran squads.

With all the mechanised lists driving around nowadays, it semms to be a good idea to get some stuff that can kill transports (av 11-12) at long range. Autocannon armoured sentinels come to mind. You could also give your vets in chimeras some autocannons they can fire from the vehicles top hatch to kill incoming transports. once the enemies transports are dead, your russes should be able to kill his infantry pretty quick. Normal russes are just not good at killing transports so you need some additional can openers.
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
I know what a normal mechanized list looks like but please read the OP, I don't want that sort of list.

Thanks for the more constructive stuff in pointing out flaws in how a russ heavy list works though. So basically the main area a russ army fails in is killing other tanks? I said in my OP that I'd have fast attack tanks as well so what about devil dogs of las cannon sentinals? At least from 3 sentinals that's a 9% chance to kill AV14. Considering thats the toughest armour around, and I'm only likely to be shooting at it with sentinals if it's a LR or monolith doesn't seem too bad. Something I've learnt playing necrons is tanks rarely NEED to be destroyed anyway.

If I'm going to be leaving anti tank largely up to other stuff how should I equip my russes for such a list?
 

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Oh, you can go with other AT choices than meltas in Chimeras. But you're fighting gravity. The next best thing would be stormtroopers with meltas deep-striking. But they're not very practical in games of 1500 pts or less.
 

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Fitting up those sentinals with some heavy firepower and having them flank during a game would be a good idea, since not all tanks have 14 armour all around and it'll save those sentinals from being picked off right at the start of the game.
 

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I like the idea of using mechanised artillery for anti-tank. The Manticore looks to be a complete beast with its ST10 missiles and multiple blasts. I saw a down and dirty conversion using spare hunter-killer missiles from chimera sprues, that may prove to be a cheap option if you want to experiment with one. It does mean giving up 3 Russes though.

There's the Medusa but it needs direct line of sight which is a bit riskey. The Bassilisk can attack from behind cover and hit across the map but then you are down to St9, A pack of 3 Devil Dogs looks to be pretty serviceable AT, especially if you put multi-meltas on their hulls, the issue there is survivability. At least with melta squads they are unlikely to be lost if their Chimera blows up. The Manticore is the only viable option to try in my opinion. You loose 3 russes but it can attack from behind cover and its strike is really overwhelming. That plus some HK missiles on your sentinels and you could do a lot worse.
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
Well although it has it's downsides it doesn't seem like it would be an absolute complete flop. I'll come up with an army list and post it in the right section, see what people say.

To me the chances of destroying varios AV values with sentinals seems reasonable, maybe that's just due to the armys I'm used to play.
 

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This is relevant but in the wrong forum; sort of

I was looking at the old (pre 5th ed) Armoured company list and thinking about revising it for 5th ed.
In light of some of the apocolypse rules the following seemed reasonable:
So its sort of house rules to allow an armoured company but your friends may let you?
Definitely NOT tourny legal though

Armoured company HQ:
  • Allows controlling player to take 0-3 Russ squadrons as troop choices.
  • Allows controlling player to take Tank aces as elite choices.
Composition: Single Russ standard or variant for normal cost +100pts.
Unit type: Vehicle (tank).
Wargear: Standard.
Options: Standard; Comm-link = Astropath relay for +20pts.
Special rules: Lumbering Behemoth, BS4, Crack shot, All tanks within 12” of command tank ignore ‘crew shaken’ damage results.

Tank ace (elite):
Composition: Single Russ standard or variant for normal cost +50pts or a ‘Destroyer tank hunter’ for 220pts total.
Unit type: Vehicle (tank).
Wargear: Standard.
Options: Standard
Special rules: Lumbering Behemoth, BS4, Crack shot, (Vanquisher or Destroyer tank hunter aces also receive the ‘tank hunters’ universal special rule).

Also did similar for Artillery company, Rider regimants & Sentinel HQ (very Avatar inspired).
 

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Actually, Imperial Armor updated their Armored Company rules. It's up on their website for a free download, as I recall. Still not tournament legal, but it's the closest you get.

Personally, I'd house rule their Vanquisher to be able to use HE shells again, to make it worth taking. Maybe a points increase to go along with it though.
 

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Fitting up those sentinals with some heavy firepower and having them flank during a game would be a good idea, since not all tanks have 14 armour all around and it'll save those sentinals from being picked off right at the start of the game.
I've used Sentinels a lot, and what I've found works best is not to outflank them, but to deploy them in cover with the rest of your army. Their move through cover rule means that they can be deployed and move in spots that your tanks don't like to go, keeping them out of the way. But still allowing them to pop light armor on the first 2 turns when you need that the most. If you put the Sentinels in your center they can even run interference on enemy assaulters in the mid-game. Particularly if they didn't bring Powerfists along.
 
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