[Nerdynick]

Yeah, pretty much, I have 5 man squads of both and I got a box of assault marines for christmas and I was wondering if I should add them to my normal Assault Squad or my Vanguard Veterans

 

[Rabbit]

Please remember to include a close date on all polls.

*date added*

 

[Dark Trainer]

I voted regular assault marines simply because I like how they can be CHEAPER and the sergeant can shred stuff up. Plus the shear number of attacks is nice. I agree they don't all carry meltas, can't have multiple storm shields, multiple power weapons, etc...however for the cost points wise...it's allows me to throw in ALOT of other things instead of a single 400-600 point squad.

I wish Vanguard would HIDE IC's too like a command squad. They'd be devastating...

 

[==Me==]

Is neither an option?

Jump pack marines not in a Blood Angels army kinda suck. They're either too expensive (Vanguard) or too ineffectual (Assault Marines), die as easily as normal marines and have no protection from a Rhino to keep them alive.

 

[Sancraer]

It won't let me vote but I say assualt marines. Vanguard are just too expensive.
Remember that you can give flamers to assualt marines which can improve them a lot.
Also you can take their jump packs off and put them in a rhino makng them less vulnerable. However this also makes them slower-no run (and no charge if the rhino moves).

Howver, Vanguard are viable if you are running a deep strike army as the drop pod locator beacon means that they're going to kill one squad and wil probably draw fire (or kill something else next turn).

 

[SirBludgen]

Is neither an option?

Jump pack marines not in a Blood Angels army kinda suck. They're either too expensive (Vanguard) or too ineffectual (Assault Marines), die as easily as normal marines and have no protection from a Rhino to keep them alive.

I disagree, Vanguard can come without jump packs and can deliver more of a punch than anything I've seen on the table top if given a chaplain. The squad I run with a chaplain has the veteran sergeant with dual powerfists and two other veterans with powerfists, as well as three veterans with power weapons, two with stormshields, and one with a ccw and bolt pistol. This may be a bit point heavy but trust me, it is well worth the points. I normally put them in a rhino and they are fairly safe in the way I run them, and once they get into combat...only the strongest characters and squads can take this on when they charge. and they are relatively hard to kill with the armor and invulnerable saves.

 

[Swamp_slug]

I voted Assault Marines. Vanguard are a very expensive unit, especially if you give them jump packs. Kitting them up can also make them too effective leaving you in the open during your opponent's turn.

A unit of 10 Vanguard Veterans that get the charge are very likely to wipe out their target. A unit of 5 costs significantly less (can be in the region of a 10 man Assault Marine squad depending on equipment) and are more likely to stay locked in combat for your opponents turn.
A 5 man Assault Marine squad on the other hand has too little punch while a 10 man squad with a pair of flamers can soften up the target and then charge in.

 

[==Me==]

I disagree, Vanguard can come without jump packs and can deliver more of a punch than anything I've seen on the table top if given a chaplain. The squad I run with a chaplain has the veteran sergeant with dual powerfists and two other veterans with powerfists, as well as three veterans with power weapons, two with stormshields, and one with a ccw and bolt pistol. This may be a bit point heavy but trust me, it is well worth the points. I normally put them in a rhino and they are fairly safe in the way I run them, and once they get into combat...only the strongest characters and squads can take this on when they charge. and they are relatively hard to kill with the armor and invulnerable saves.

Assault troops in a Rhino is a bad idea since you can't hop out and charge. Just like jump pack Vanguard, they're too expensive and die as easily as normal marines.

I'll take 5 Assault Termies in a LRR any day, cheaper and better in every way.

 

[Dark Trainer]

Assault troops in a Rhino is a bad idea since you can't hop out and charge. Just like jump pack Vanguard, they're too expensive and die as easily as normal marines.

I'll take 5 Assault Termies in a LRR any day, cheaper and better in every way.

Assault troops CAN hop out and assault. before movement, disembark, MOVE 6" and assault 6" (also you can move the transport after they disembark, can we say 'Block Line of Sight'). Basically get your rhino within 14" and whammo.

I assume assault termies would be the same way, am I missing how you'd do it differently. Or can Termies move right into their line and assault?

 

[And Justice For All]

Went with assault marines as they will get more use in games. I've got 10 Vanguard made from plastic sets and they look good (for table top at least) but only get used in bigger games. I'm talking 2k upwards.

Assault marines with a flamer, plas pistol and power fist has done me proud for years.

 

[==Me==]

Assault troops CAN hop out and assault. before movement, disembark, MOVE 6" and assault 6" (also you can move the transport after they disembark, can we say 'Block Line of Sight'). Basically get your rhino within 14" and whammo.

I assume assault termies would be the same way, am I missing how you'd do it differently. Or can Termies move right into their line and assault?

So you're defeating the entire purpose of having a transport. Who's going to sit within 14" and let you assault them since it'll take an extra turn? Land Raiders have the assault ramp, so anything jumping out can charge right after. Superior.

 

[Nerdynick]

With Assault Squads, is it better to give them plasma pistols or flamers?

 

[Willance]

===Me===, How you charge out of a transport and have them still in charge range is park he Rhino right in front of the unit. Not all units come with Melta Guns or powerfists so getting right in their face is no harm to you. Also, no infantry unit can more more then 6 inches, so your going to catch them. I've used these tactic with Eldar and Space Marines. It works quite well.

Also, I vote Assult Marines. Terminators are cheaper and more durable, not to mention more intimidating.

 

[And Justice For All]

With Assault Squads, is it better to give them plasma pistols or flamers?

Flamers in most cases. Two templates plus 8 bolt pistols is alot of wounds on soft to medium toughness units. 5 man terminator squads would loose something to that alone, nevermind the 30ish attacks on the charge straight after.

 

[Dark Trainer]

So you're defeating the entire purpose of having a transport. Who's going to sit within 14" and let you assault them since it'll take an extra turn? Land Raiders have the assault ramp, so anything jumping out can charge right after. Superior.

No I'm saying charge their lines and get within 8" really, meaning they can only move MAX of 6" away, meaning even if they moved the full 12" away I can still do assaulting out of a transport too. Not saying it's better than the land raider assault ramp, just much cheaper

 

[Nerdynick]

Thanks for the tips

For the record, 4 of my 5 opponents play Space Marines (one also plays necrons half the time). The last plays tau (which are going to get ate up in melee no matter what units I use).

 

[Chirality]

With Assault Squads, is it better to give them plasma pistols or flamers?

I'd definitely recommend flamers if you use an Assault squad. They've served me very well.

 

[Xpyre35]

I find that if you can "safely" park your Rhino 8-14" away from a target unit, then that unit shouldn't even be the target of Vanguard Assault Marines. It would be a ridiculous waste of their killing capabilities. Meaning a large squad of light infantry, its not worth sending the vanguard. Their primary targets are going to be enemy HQs, or Medium-Heavy Infantry. All of those types of targets would decimate a Rhino's Armor, and nullify a Vanguards threat.

Any true target of the Vanguard within in that range of the transport, should be immediately popped open by a ranged shot (a tank, or some other heavy weapon in the Commander's arsenal, then charged.

 

[Dark Trainer]

So I'm ALMOST tempted to change my answer to Vanguard. I haven't really used them because when you Tool them out hardcore yes they're expensive...however if you keep it SIMPLE and just hide a powerfist on the serg, maybe 1 more power weapon...then 3 storm shields on CRAP guys just to at least save all that no save CRAP people throw at you and then fodder normal guys. You're looking at a squad around 290pts (ish). That's NOT BAD compared to my standard 225 assault marines to gain another power weapon and 3 storm shields for durability. Throw in Shrike and you've got a powerhouse under 500 points. But even without Shrike I'd say that additional 65 points seems well spent?

Even without Shrike it's not much more points to gain durability.

 

[==Me==]

Infiltrating, Fleet TH/SS Termies are superior.