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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I dunno if this has been done before, but i couldnt see anything.

Basically, i'm looking for any advice on the use of the brrodlord, as i have one in my army, but the gaes ive played so far, he's always my first casualty. I play him as he comes, but i am tempted to add an extended carapace.

Anyone else had this problem but overcame it?

Thanks
 

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Could you describe more about how you played him and the circumstances in which he died? What biomorphs did you give him and what was his retinue like? What exactly was it that killed him?
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
i infiltrated him, through cover and straight into the enemy, after he and his retinue (6 stealers with ST and EC) destroyed that group, he gets all focus on him and he dies.

I assume he gets picked out above the retinue when they get shot at...if not, then thats the problem as well as bad dice luck.

Is he really worth the points if he just acts as a diversion while the rest of my nids come at the enemy?

Oh, and as i said, i'm playing him as he comes, without any biomorphs.

Maybe what i'm looking for is tactics for hmi, as opposed to is he worth it or not...
 

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A Broodlord inevitably has Toxin Sacs and perhaps a few other Biomorphs to make it a close combat machine (Adrenal Glands are a waste of points as few things will strike before something as fast as that. Basically, this is why people fear the Broodlord - it is a Close Combat machine and will kill anything it comes into contact with, especially Necrons (who are pathetic in Close Combat). Unless the entire army infiltrates, prepare to have your Broodlord die a lot. It draws the most hate as it is usually alone (barring its retinue) on the battlefield so people take a maxed out retinue to absorb wounds. You're not using it the wrong way, it's just that anything will wither under heavy fire, even something as dangerous as a Broodlord.

That's why many Nid lists nowadays take both a Broodlord and a Carnifex, I suppose - people don't know which one to deal with first.
 

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Insanelicense said:
i infiltrated him, through cover and straight into the enemy, after he and his retinue (6 stealers with ST and EC) destroyed that group, he gets all focus on him and he dies.
Well, the problem there is that he had little support, apart from his own retinue. He's tough, but definitely needs more help. Some fast units such as those with wings, Hormagaunts, or Raveners could probably do well.

I assume he gets picked out above the retinue when they get shot at...if not, then thats the problem as well as bad dice luck.
Looks like it's a problem. ;) He's an independant character and not monstrous. When he's joined to a squad (such as his retinue), he can't picked out. He's just like any independant character in any other army.

Is he really worth the points if he just acts as a diversion while the rest of my nids come at the enemy?
He'd probably need a fairly large retinue to do that particularily well. Either that or some really good cover.

Oh, and as i said, i'm playing him as he comes, without any biomorphs.
His default configuration is pretty decent. Most people seem to play him rather light. Extended Carapace or Toxin Sacs are common, perhaps with Flesh Hooks.

Maybe what i'm looking for is tactics for hmi, as opposed to is he worth it or not...
I'm really not sure on good tactics for him. I don't have a Broodlord, yet (I'm trying to figure out a good conversion, since I hate the default pose), so what I've said is more of general tactics. There's definitely others with more experience on this subject, though.
 

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Infiltrate & Retuine

The only way my broodlord has survived with any ability is to get into combat quickly. I typically try to infiltrate into cover, if at all possible. Overall though, I have to agree, the brood lord will tend to die pretty quickly. Your only hope is to rush him into combat and then hopefully get your points worth out of him.

Also, always take extended caprice when using a retuine. If not, IIRC, he can get the short end of the stick during the shooting age. I think that since he has the same save as the stealers, wounds can be shared around. I'm not terribly clear on that though, I've always used caprice.

Good luck and good hunting.
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
Thanks for the help.

So what's a decent size squad to go with him?

i've managed to free up a few points from ym original list, but the stealers i use are 24 points each
 

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Im use my Broodlord as an assassin. i give him extended carapace, toxin sacs, implant attack and flesh hooks. I keep him in cover and let him loose when I know he will reach assault and then consolidate back into cover or another unit. I take small retinues ( its hard to hide biggewr ones). In all I spend around 200 points on the Lord and retinue. If he manages to just take out a character or havoc squad I'm happy as that means my carnis and other stealers have likely made it down table. What kills me is Vindicare assassins who take him down first - well you can't have everything.
 

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Ostsol said:
Well, the problem there is that he had little support, apart from his own retinue. He's tough, but definitely needs more help. Some fast units such as those with wings, Hormagaunts, or Raveners could probably do well.


Looks like it's a problem. ;) He's an independant character and not monstrous. When he's joined to a squad (such as his retinue), he can't picked out. He's just like any independant character in any other army.


He'd probably need a fairly large retinue to do that particularily well. Either that or some really good cover.


His default configuration is pretty decent. Most people seem to play him rather light. Extended Carapace or Toxin Sacs are common, perhaps with Flesh Hooks.


I'm really not sure on good tactics for him. I don't have a Broodlord, yet (I'm trying to figure out a good conversion, since I hate the default pose), so what I've said is more of general tactics. There's definitely others with more experience on this subject, though.
I find the key to using a Broodlord is plenty of fast support, basically throw everything at the opponent fast and while they are dealing with that lot sneak up with the Broodlord, I never infiltrate I know this sounds odd but I found out through bitter experience that it just does not work, opponents know how strong he is and if he is close they will target it with everything.
I set the Broodlord up behind cover if possible at least 24" away and wait till the opponent is tied up in CC then I move him up in relative safety, I also give him an 8 strong retinue perfect size to use cover but good in CC.

My list is fast though with 32 stealers all with scuttle and ext cara and 30 Hormies (fleet) 6 winged Warriors and a winged Tyrant (+1 carnie and he is being replaced by 3 lictors) so it is fast and distract nicely.
I have converted my Broodlord, there are pictures in the tyranid gallery (picture a bit dark but you can get the idea) he is very heavily converted and is a lot more dynamic than the stupidly posed GW model. check it out if you need advice on how I converted it and parts etc I will be more than happy to answer any questions
 

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i think hes great
 

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Ostsol said:
Well, the problem there is that he had little support, apart from his own retinue. He's tough, but definitely needs more help. Some fast units such as those with wings, Hormagaunts, or Raveners could probably do well.


Looks like it's a problem. ;) He's an independant character and not monstrous. When he's joined to a squad (such as his retinue), he can't picked out. He's just like any independant character in any other army.


He'd probably need a fairly large retinue to do that particularily well. Either that or some really good cover.


His default configuration is pretty decent. Most people seem to play him rather light. Extended Carapace or Toxin Sacs are common, perhaps with Flesh Hooks.


I'm really not sure on good tactics for him. I don't have a Broodlord, yet (I'm trying to figure out a good conversion, since I hate the default pose), so what I've said is more of general tactics. There's definitely others with more experience on this subject, though.
I always take Flesh Hooks on my bigger more important models....it's only 1 point.
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
actually, for the broodlord and tyrant, its a few more than 1 point :p

but im seriously considering the extended carapace...

Oh, and just as a note, i converted my Broodlord from the old tyrant guard model...it looks better than the actual model in my opinion.
 

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Insanelicense said:
Oh, and just as a note, i converted my Broodlord from the old tyrant guard model...it looks better than the actual model in my opinion.
Yeah, that's one of the things I was considering. Either that or I go through alot of slicing and bending to drop the normal Broodlord model into more of a crouching pose. I also want to move the Rending Claws to the lower arm sockets.
 

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My brood lord rarely make his points back but few units do, and thats all you need to win.

I use TS, Implant and F/hooks. With 8 G/Stealers w/ EC, ST and F/hooks. Total around 300 but worth it as....

1. Alway use the infiltrate, if not to get closer, just to place last and choose what it will fight. If your opponant is chaos with a demon prince then it will move to the closest unit, if it is a brood lord then it is a little dead!

2. If you have buchered someone with it before they WILL shoot the living bejebus out of it, so stick it in good cover and watch all his shooting come to naught, while the rest of the horde can run in the open.

3. A hulking carnifex will cause division of fire and allow both to survive.

4. Even if only once in 10 games it makes the enemys lines without losing too much retine, the look of terror on the other players face makes as squad after squad fall.

A lictor or two to provide a turn of CC cover helps alot.
 

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Here's how I use my Broodlord, when I actually do use him. I prefer two Tyrants, but sometimes I like the feel of the Broodlord.

Just a few quick points that should be common to all tactics -
*The Broodlord should have Toxin Sacs and Extended Carapace. One helps him kill things (and keeps him from being tied up by swarms), while the other keeps him alive longer. Anything else is icing. I sometimes like Implant Attack, as it makes him a very strong character killer.

*The Retinue should always have Extended Carapace and nothing else. Their job is to die in place of the Broodlord - nothing more. Scything Talons are a waste of points on regular Genestealers, and even more so on a Broodlord Retinue as they'll take even more firepower than normal.

*You should probably always try to Infiltrate the Broodlord. He is slow and needs all the help he can get to close combat.

Here are a couple of nasty tricks I've learned -

*Flesh Hooks on the Broodlord and Genestealers. People commonly think that all Flesh Hooks are good for is assaulting cover. Put the entire unit behind a cliff or something that would take a normal unit three turns to walk around. On turn one, point out that your unit can traverse impassable terrain and moves into spitting distance of that lovely Devestator squad that was camped out on top.

*Bait. This is how I often use my Broodlord. He's a bit expensive as bait, but experienced opponents will freak at the sight of a Broodlord near his lines. If he wastes an entire turning trying to kill him, then that means your main body of troops has a free turn to reach his lines. If the Broodlord manages to reach Close Combat, he'll still cleave through troops. It is a win/win situation.

*The Synapse rush. Dangerous tactic, but works great when it works. Basically, you have the Broodlord as your one and only Synapse in the list and run a few units of Hormagaunts. First turn your Gaunts will fail their movement test and fall towards him 3d6 inches, straight towards the enemy lines. Next turn they automatically rally and assault the enemy. It's a huge gamble though - having only a single Synapse leaves you open to massive fleeing when he dies, and quite often the 3d6 fall back move will net you less movement than you would've gained by moving normally.
 

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That is excellent advice. I use my Broodlord as a character assassin, btw. I fit him exactly as listed for that role and he rarely disappoints. I use the all genestealer troop list so I feel I should have a BL. I add flesh hooks when points allow - quite often they do.

Things worth remembering:

I love when my opponent uses a Vindicare. They shoot the BL and my retinue gets FoC and charge the nearest unit. Wish more people would use them.

I have seen lists with large retinues - not always smart. You need to hide these guys and its hard hiding units with more than eight members - I actually go retinue of six or seven depending on my points.

You cannot get a first turn charge out of a BL. So keep these guys hugging cover.
If you use a genestealer list you should take fexes and lictors. I also take a Flyrant at times as a second HQ ( this at 1500 points ). If you take too few MCs your opponent will just shoot whatever is closest - so keep the BL back 18" - 20''. Try and get all your troops attacking turn two or three together and let the heavy support follow.
 

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the broodlord doesnt get FoC. Which renders him too slow to be useful.
Last battle (rescue) he got to the enemy line by turn 5... And if he infiltrates he get pwned before he can say hello. How do you people actually use him? The only idea I have is to use him as untouchable (as long as he's alone) synapse...
 

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You hear this alot - 'he doesn't make his points back'

Guess what - a lot of units do not make their points back. However, they mess with the opponents' tactics, they p[ossib;y provide a diversion, they are still a scoring unit or they can take table quarters.

Any opponent has to look at the BL as a serious threat. If he hits the opponents lines there will be some damage. Give him flesh hooks, keep him behind cover, and wait for your Lictors to provide some support. If your opponent decides to go after him
a) get within charge range
b) attempt to finish him in cover
your BL has done its job.

If they target the BL that means your other stealers and fexes and winged tyrant are just getting closer unmolested. If they move up to get in better position within charge range of your Lictor or BL they will be very unhappy with the results.

No, the BL does not have FoC ( that's why
I love it if they use a sniper on him - gives his retinue the chance to charge )
but we do need game balance. An FoCing BL is just unbalanced with a first turn charge.
Reminds me of LotD when I could apparition two Dreads in my opponents zone at start of game and a squad of plasma toting tacs. Jeez, you think the rule was experimental for as reason?

I personally like an HQ of a BL and Flyrant but then I play a genestealer list that is kind of a hybrid 'Zilla in tactics - smaller games its less of a 'Zilla list. Maybe we can get someone to write up a BL tactica with some stats and recommendations.
 

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Yoohrand said:
FIrst turn charge? How the hell do you manage that? I mean, even with hormagaunts its still 19-24" charge range, in a lot of battles you begin further away from each other... am I missin' something?
He's saying that Fleet of Claw on a Broodlord would be unbalanced as it would allow a first turn charge (which is funny, since there are a few Chaos units that can Infiltrate and assault on the first turn, including HQs).
 
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