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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I was wondering how many people actually want to see this.
I'm sick of the scouts sucking in the Codex Marines, so I started a codex, but I won't post it until I get a few responses, I had a few neat ideas I thought. The more broken it sounds you still have to remember, the best armor save or invulnerable save is 4+ in the codex I made. tell me if it's alright to post it and I will :)
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 · (Edited)

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Discussion Starter · #4 · (Edited)
This is the big bad boy for the Codex, he may look pretty brutal, but I think that is kinda the point there...lol

Scout Lord “Cerberus” 250
WS/BS/S/T/W/I/A/LD/Sv
6/6/4/5/4/6/4/10/4+,4++

Wargear:
Improved Scout Armor
Improved Refractor Field
Improved Cerberus Bolt Pistol
Improved Cerberus Bolter
Improved Cerberus Sniper Rifle
Master Crafted Mithril Blade
Flame Shield
Camo Cloak
Frag and Krak Grenades

Special Rules:
Inspiring
Feel No Pain
Rites of Battle
Combat Tactics
Scout
Infiltrate
Fleet of Foot
Relentless
Hit and Run

Improved Scout armor : May always take his 4+ armor save from ranged attacks even if normally denied because of AP value or any other reason.
Mithril Blade : Power weapon that adds +2 to the bearer’s strength

May take a retinue of Veteran Scouts
One Squad of Veteran Scouts may count as scoring

May take one of these options to replace combat tactics for added points cost(Applies to entire army)
-Counter Attack.....20 points
-Fleet.................30 points
-Hit and Run.........40 points
-Stubborn............50 points

For all wargear not posted look at above post for the reference link.
 

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Sweet, ive got an all scout army and i'll see if i can try out your rules.

The Emperor Protects
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
good idea, I'm in need of some ideas for a heavy support selection though...I want to make a fluffy codex as well as a competitive codex...so something that moves fast, if a vehicle has low armor, but still can pack a punch.
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 · (Edited)
I noticed, I never said I was done with him, I fixed him up, depending on the weapon setup you take depends on which of the special rules you can take.

Depending on which weapon he comes into play with determines his Special rules that are in play
Cerberus Bolter - Fleet of Foot, Hit and Run
Cerberus Bolt Pistol and Mithril Sword - Feel No Pain, Eternal Warrior
Cerberus Sniper Rifle - Relentless, Marksman
Cerberus Shotgun - Furious Charge

So wargear setup can be one of these four:

Bolt Pistol & Mithril Sword:
Improved Scout Armor
Improved Refractor Field
Improved Cerberus Bolt Pistol
Master Crafted Mithril Blade
Camo Cloak
Flame Shield
Frag and Krak Grenades

Bolter:
Improved Scout Armor
Improved Refractor Field
Improved Cerberus Bolter
Master Crafted Obsidian Weapon
Camo Cloak
Flame Shield
Frag and Krak Grenades

Sniper:
Improved Scout Armor
Improved Refractor Field
Improved Cerberus Sniper Rifle
Master Crafted Obsidian Weapon
Camo Cloak
Flame Shield
Frag and Krak Grenades

Shotgun:
Improved Scout Armor
Improved Refractor Field
Improved Cerberus Shotgun
Master Crafted Mithril Blade
Camo Cloak
Flame Shield
Frag and Krak Grenades

As for the skills to replace combat tactics here they are now:

May take one of these options to replace combat tactics for added points cost(Applies to entire army)
-Counter Attack 20 points
-Fleet 30 points
-Stubborn 30 points
-Furious Charge 40 points
-Hit and Run 40 points

I changed his armor to this too:
Improved Scout armor : May always take a 4+ armor save from ranged attacks unless it doubles the model‘s toughness and AP denies an armor save or is AP1.

Remember that even though he seems totally wicked he only has a 4 plus save on anything, the Flame shield give as 4+ invulnerable in close combat only(Like the old storm shields) just making it so he can take a 4 plus save no matter what is the only way to make up for his armor. After all he is the main special character for this codex. But I think with what I did to him I balanced him out, I was thinking of away
to make it not only fluffy but also able to be competitive against Space Marines, IG, Space Wolves, and Tyranids when they come out.

I think that for overall these points fit, I was trying to find a way to balance him out last night and this is what I came up with, tell me if this helps a bit :)
 

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LO's Shadow Captain
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Remember that even though he seems totally wicked he only has a 4 plus save on anything, the Flame shield give as 4+ invulnerable in close combat only(Like the old storm shields) just making it so he can take a 4 plus save no matter what is the only way to make up for his armor.
No. Simply... no. Not wanting to sound too critical, but there's no way that a Space Marine character of any type, especially one that is not a Chapter Master, will have the profile you've given this guy. Giving him a slightly worse armour save than a regular Space Marine doesn't balance the fact that his statline is completely out of the 'zone' for a Space Marine. If you're going to make this a Scout codex, you need to use Codex: Space Marines as a guide for what the stats should and shouldn't look like. Otherwise, it's Scouts in name, but whatever you feel like in the rules, and that's not how you make a well balanced codex.

I'm afraid to look at the rest of the list, to be honest; this guy needs a major overhaul.



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I've taken a look through the codex and i have a few comments.

1) Every company of space marines is lead by a captain and command squad, in power armour, (although the captain may have artifesur armour). This includes the 10th company, maybe you could put in the normal captain and command squad in HQ and give them the option to take camo cloaks or a drop pod.

2) Scouts aren't typically trained with melta or plasma weapons. They are bulky, low on ammunition, and require constant maitinance to work properly, LS storms can take them but they are there to get scouts in and out quickly, not into a prolonged fight.

3) You still have some options for heavy support, scouts would often be able to request artillary strikes and orbital bombardments, (especially if there is a full fleged captain leading them). Sp why not take advantage of this? You could put in whirlwind barrages, lance strikes, IG artillary support...

The Emperor Protects
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 · (Edited)
I've taken a look through the codex and i have a few comments.

1) Every company of space marines is lead by a captain and command squad, in power armour, (although the captain may have artifesur armour). This includes the 10th company, maybe you could put in the normal captain and command squad in HQ and give them the option to take camo cloaks or a drop pod.

2) Scouts aren't typically trained with melta or plasma weapons. They are bulky, low on ammunition, and require constant maitinance to work properly, LS storms can take them but they are there to get scouts in and out quickly, not into a prolonged fight.

3) You still have some options for heavy support, scouts would often be able to request artillary strikes and orbital bombardments, (especially if there is a full fleged captain leading them). Sp why not take advantage of this? You could put in whirlwind barrages, lance strikes, IG artillary support...

The Emperor Protects
In reference to number 1, I never liked how that was set up, thus the reason for the scout captain, I'll give him the ability to take power armor, but if he takes it he loses his scout ability. I made the captain the way I did so that it was a little more, fluffy, for a lack of a better word. This way he can keep up with the rest of the army.

In reference to number 2, this I understand and agree with, I'll drop it from the troops section, as for the elites though I'm leaving it because they need some sort of tank busting ability, I started working more on it last night and think you might like the new update.

In reference to number 3, I hadn't thought about that, but it would be a good add in. Thank you for that idea. I do have a scout version of a devastator squad however, and I think it's pretty balanced. As for the dreadnoughts however I think I'll add them to heavy support section, since I got the idea off of the penitent engines and that's where those are in the witch hunters codex

Other than that do you have any other ideas that would seem to go well with this?
And I'm not trying to be rude at all, if I seem to come of as such I apologize.
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 · (Edited)
Scout Lord “Cerberus” 225 points
Ws/Bs/S/T/W/I/A/Ld/Sv
6/5/4/4/3/5/4/10/4+,5++

Wargear:
Scout Armor
Refractor Field
Camo Cloak
Flame Shield
Frag and Krak Grenades
Mithril Sword
Improved Cerberus Bolt Pistol

Special Rules:
Combat Tactics
Scout
Infiltrate
Eternal Warrior

Mithril Sword - a master crafted relic blade (Refer to Codex: Space Marines)

May take a retinue of Veteran Scouts

Replace Combat Tactics with Hit and Run

This is the new statline for said character, I see where I bumped it up by accident on here for the toughness I hit the 5 instead of 4, the statline was pretty messed up I'll agree, the rest of the scouts aren't so bad, but that's why I'm posting here to begin with to try and get this balanced out. And the reason his stats are still decent is because he is the Special Character HQ for this codex, where Space Marines have Calgar, Scouts have this guy

I made a few changes to the codex to try and make it a little better here's the link
http://www.megaupload.com/?d=47J9F33O
and for .doc http://www.megaupload.com/?d=7QEIBMHA
 

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Calgar is one in a billion in the fluff, though. He also happens to be the Chapter Master of the most popular chapter in the 40k universe. You should not be comparing this character to Calgar; think more realistic, for example Shrike or another Captain. What's the fluff behind this guy? Where'd he get the sword? Why's he got a higher WS than a Chapter Master? Why does he have more wounds than said Master? These are all things to take into consideration, you should not be making an uber character just because other codices have them. He needs to make sense, and while this version is better, he's still not quite there.



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Discussion Starter · #14 · (Edited)
I'm not trying to make an uber character, my friends and I all have the opinion that special characters and indeed most HQ choices, such as captains should be able to take eternal warrior, I have factored that in already and gave him back the adimantium mantle only modded a bit, he has the stat line of a captain, which he is. I left rites of battle on there by accident so I'll take it off, as for stubborn that's wrong I meant to leave hit and run, it sounds fluffy for the scouts.

His fluff is that his company was on a mission and got cut off from all reinforcements for almost a century, during that time he and his troops fought and modified their weapons to fight xenos and any traitors to humanity. They performed operations to cripple their enemies until the rest of the chapter finally was able to come look for them. He took many wounds through out his fights and still lived on because the chapter needed him.

Thus the eternal warrior and hit and run, as for the bolt pistol and mithril sword I thought it would be good to give it to him, after all marines can give relic blades to their captains. I think I'll just make it a master crafted relic blade so he can't get the off hand and can use the flame shield in close combat.
 

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Wouldn't a master of a scout army look something like this?

Scouts Master.........................50 pts
WS6 BS5 S4 T4 W3 I5 A3 Ld10 Sv4+

Unit Composition:
• 1 Scouts Master

Unit Type:
• Infantry

Wargear:
• Scout Armor
• Bolt Pistol
• Boltgun
• Frag and krak grenades

Special Rules:
• And They Shall Know No Fear
• Combat Tactics
• Infiltrate
• Move Through Cover
• Scouts
• Independent Character
• Master of Stealth (gains an additional +1 to cover saves)

Options:
• Replace boltgun with:
- shotgun, combat knife, or sniper rifle............free
- combi-melta/plasma/flamer....................+XX pts
- plasma pistol.........................................+XX pts
- power weapon.......................................+XX pts
- power fist..............................................+XX pts
- relic blade.............................................+XX pts
- thunder hammer....................................+XX pts
• Take camo cloak......................................+X pts
• Take refractor field...................................+X pts
• Take bionics............................................+X pts
• Take melta bombs.................................. +X pts
• Take locator beacon...............................+XX pts
• Take Orbital Bombardment.....................+XX pts
• Take Space Marine bike..........................+XX pts
Not particularly flashy, but his Master of Stealth rule gives him a very nice 2+ cover save w/ a camo cloak (or boosting on a bike). He's only got a 5++ in close combat with the refractor field, but he's also only 50 pts to start.
 

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Probably the most absurd character ever...

Balance him more. Make him Support Primary or CC Primary, not both.

Revision is a lil bit better... still need to change the stats...

I would go with BS 7 or 8 (reroll 1s and then hit on X) and drop the WS to 4, and give him a special sniper rifle with X shots with a special rule.
 

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I agree, this is grossly overpowered. When making a Scout special character, I would seriously look to Telion for inspiration. This guy is meant to be the best of the absolute best the 10th Company has to offer. You say you want to 'stay fluffy'. Well, the 10th Company Captain has Power Armour and a Command Squad. It's right there in the Codex. He should be equipped and statted like a Captain.

Mithril Sword? Flame Shield? Oh please...
 
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