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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Hey guys, just wondered if someone would mind giving my army list a look over.

Lord - Morathi, Hag Sorceress 470

Hero - Assassin, Hand Weapon, Manbane(psn), Web of Shadows 179

Core - 10 Corsairs, Full Command, Slaughter Standard 160

- 5 Dark Riders, Crossbows, Standard, Champion 118

- 5 Dark Riders, Crossbows, Standard, Champion 118

Special - 10 Executioners, Full command, Banner of Murder 185

- 1 Cold One Chariot, Spears, Crossbows 107

- 5 Cold One Knights, Full command 190

Rare - 2 Reaper Bolt Throwers 200

- 10 Black Guard, Full command, Dread Banner 270





Ok, thats it. I was aiming for a varied army which would llok really great. My last army was a 2000 pt empire ranged army, so i really wanted something different. Cheers
 

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IMO you need a lot more blocks of infantry. because while we are fast we will not always get the charge, so you want to have some units that can take that charge. The executioners are good, I might enlarge the corsairs a little, but I don't really like black guard. ACtually, I don't like them at all. You don't need the ability to reroll to hits, and with their low armor save I think it is better to take the (more powerful on he charge) witch elves instead.

also, whatever unit you put the assasin into should be large so that it doesn't get wiped off the board. I'm not sure what you are trying to do with the web of shadows, is it for calling out other heros and killing them? if you had planned on using it against normal enemies, I wouldn't bother, it's not that good unless you can pop it on a hero or something.
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
Hmmm, ok cheers. So i'll dump the 5 cold one riders and black guard. What do you reckon to some executioners then...
 

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I think you should drop the Chariot, not the CoK's. Altough the modle looks cool, CoKs will get you a lot further in battle, and the chariot is a impact troop only, if it goes stupid and gets charged your likely to loose it. The CoK unit have better armour, better Ld, a standard: its much more likely to win combat. CoK's are also impact troops, but with the better armour, greater numbers, command and Ld they'll recive a charge better then a chariot would.

Also get rid of the Standard of Slaughter, it costs a bit and is one-use-only. Also its random, for less points you could get the War Banner which will last for the whole game and it isnt random, so it'll do better then the Standard of Slaughter at the end of the game.
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
ok, lose the chariot and black guard and the slaughter standard. That would give me anothe 12 cold ones. Or should I make a unit of 10 cold ones and use the other points for a nice big block of warriors?
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
Ok, i've re-arranged some stuff.

Lords - Morathi, Hag Sorceress 470

Hero - Assassin, Hand Weapon, Manbane(psn), Web Of Shadows 179

Core - 5 Dark Riders, Crossbows, Standard, Champion 118

- 5 Dark Riders, Crossbows, Standard, Champion 118

- 10 Corsairs, Full Command, War Banner 150

- 16 Warrioirs, Full Command, Shields 153

Special - 10 Executioners, Full Command, Banner Of Murder 185

- 10 Cold One Knights, Full Command 335

- 6 Shades, Light Armour 90

Rare - 2 Reaper Bolt Throwers 200


Total 1998





I would also like to hear some suggestions for the assassin's magic selection....... thanks guys
 

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I find that the Rune of Khaine when matched up with Manbane and 2hand weapons is good because then your Assassin has around 5 attacks that will usually wound on a 3+. He's then a good mage killer, hero level character killer and usefull against enemy infanrty units. However, if your facing enemy who have T3 troops (ie other elves) then dont take Manbane because it wont give him any bonuses.
 

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I like executioners in group of 12... that'll make a nice block of 4x3, and banner of murder isn't really necessary if your executioners are flankers... it's better to give it to one of your cold one knights.
Also IMO heavy cavs shouldn't be bigger than 5 per unit in battles of less than 3kpts. You'll get lost of kights that just sits in the second rank and doesn't do anything... better to spit into two 5 man team.
Also you got your pts on dark riders wrong, 5 Dark Riders + Crossbows + Standard + Champion = 148pts, I'd advice on removing the standard and champion... as they shouldn't reach CC (they'll be slaughtered trust me) and the standard will only give the enemy lots of VPs... champion gets only a smal boost of BS... witch isn't worth the pts IMO. I'd give them musician as they should act as baiters.
I think you've too many specials... I'd advice on reducing your cold one knights to 5 and fill out your warriors to 20 and take another warrior unit of 12 with crossbows and shields.
 

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Ok. I wouldn't suggest taking morathi or the assain.

For about the same amount of points you can get a lvl 4 sorceress on a dark pegasus with the wand of kharaidon, the heart stone of darkness and the tome of furion backed up by a lvl 2 sorceress on a dark steed with the darkstar cloak and seal of ghrond.

This will mean: 9 power dice, 6 dispell dice, a nice bound spell, a ward save for your lord and the pegasus to get her anywhere very quickly.
(this is usually what i take straight away in a dark elven army)

That's personel opinion but if you do insist on taking a special character may i say that points cost vs effectiveness morathi is the best choice of the three characters you can take.

Regards
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
Ok, thanks for the feedback. Just in the process fo re-writing so i'll post the new improved list soon. Cheers guys
 

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tus666 said:
Ok, thanks for the feedback. Just in the process fo re-writing so i'll post the new improved list soon. Cheers guys
Yep, theyve pretty much summed it all up.. Youve got some great advice there, you would do well to take it :)
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
Right ho, new list

Lord - High Sorceress, Level 4, Tome of Furion, Darkstar Cloak, Seal of Ghrond, 315

Heros - Assassin, Hand Weapon, 129

- Beastmaster, Hand Weapon, Light Armour, S.D. Cloak, Manticore, 242

Core - 14 Dark Elf Warriors, Crossbows, Shields, 196

- 5 Dark Riders, Crossbows, 120

- 5 Dark Riders, Crossbows, 120

Special - 10 Witch Elves, Full Command, 160

- 10 Executioners, Full Command, 140

- 5 Cold One Knights, Full Command, 190

- 5 Cold One Knights, Full Command, 190

Rare Units - 2 Reapeter Bolt Throwers, 200

7PD 4DD

1972 Points

O.K, so the manticore is probably a bit OTT, but the model is sooo damn cool, and a fliying, terror causing beast is pretty sweet.

Once again, thanks for all you guys input.
 

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Lord - High Sorceress, Level 4, Tome of Furion, Darkstar Cloak, Seal of Ghrond, 315
Good. But i would drop the assasain and take a second sorceress (lvl 2) then give this one's seal of ghrond to the lvl 2 & take a dark steed for the lvl 4. (12pts for extra insurance that she wont be run down & charged by faster things)

Heros - Assassin, Hand Weapon, 129
As above. drop him. (you seem reluctant to take advice on dropping things, would i be right in assuming this is bcoz your list isnt 'proposed', & that you already have these things bought/built/painted and dont want to drop them (understandable). If thats the case then let ppl know it when you post a list so they know not to go too voerboard on the changes.

- Beastmaster, Hand Weapon, Light Armour, S.D. Cloak, Manticore, 242
With the Lvl 4 sorceress you simply cant afford to have a second expensive unit like this. Drop him.

Core - 14 Dark Elf Warriors, Crossbows, Shields, 196
I would make this a 10 man squad, and maybe drop the shields, but thats optional. Basically 14 is too many to have in a single row so they must be in 2 rows, which means you have 7 warriors doing nothing. better to have a single row of 10.
take a second squad like this. (10 man RxB)

- 5 Dark Riders, Crossbows, 120
- 5 Dark Riders, Crossbows, 120
Theres nothing wrong with taking 2 squads like these, bcoz they are good, the only problem is that you are seriously lacking troop numbers. make one of these squads 6 man with musician and drop the second squad, we will later use the points to boost your numbers.

Special - 10 Witch Elves, Full Command, 160
- 10 Executioners, Full Command, 140
- 5 Cold One Knights, Full Command, 190
- 5 Cold One Knights, Full Command, 190
Too many specials. Theyre all good squads but having so many of them means you have 680 points tied up in only 30 models.. When you take really expensive units like Dragons or Lvl 4 mages then you MUST fill out the rest of your list with troop numbers. SO that if the the expensive unit dies, you arent left with like 30 guys, as with this list.

Rare Units - 2 Reapeter Bolt Throwers, 200
Good!

heres how i think it should look:

Lvl 4 sorceress. Darkstar cloak, tome of furion, dark steed - roughly 330
Lvl 2 sorceress. Seal of ghrond. (optional - another item of your choice, dispel scroll?)

15 corsairs, musician & standard - ?
20 warriors with shields & musician - 165
10 warriors with RxB - 110
10 warriros with RxB - 110
5-6 dark riders, crossbows, musician - 127-151

6 CoK's, standard bearer - roughly 190
12 or 15 executioners, musician & banner - ?
Cold one Chariot, spears - 96

2 Reaper Bolt throwers - 200

I dont have my codex right now but im sure that wont total 2000, we'll have room for some more later when i work out the total. If you still want some fliers i would suggest 6-8 harpies (i know i know, they look terrible) but they'll do their job (taking out seige weapons, cannons etc)

Anyway, This gives you a solid core of troops (~60 guys) plus some real hard hitters like the Lvl 4 & the specials. backed up by some nasty RBT fire. The troops arent as effective as specials but if your oppenent ignores them to go after the bigger things then it wont matter how weak they are, they will still cause him headaches, in other words, he cant IGNORE them (suicide), and he'll have trouble actually killing them all when he DOES go after them. All the while your hard hitters are kicking butt. it also means that if he DOES target your elite things, and succeeds, then your troops have enough bulk to continue the fight without them.
A good thing to ask yourself when making lists is 'if 'this' dies, what will i have left? and how will it affect the army as a whole?' For example, taking a 500 point dragon rider in 2000 points means if he dies youve lost a 1/4 of your army and WILL lose the battle regardless of what else you have, hence filling out the rest of the list with high numbers in case of this. Etc etc.
 

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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
wow, thats great. no, i don't have any DE units yet, just got the codex and saw the model for the assassin, he looked sooo damn cool i though he must be good...

ok, the points valuse of the proposed list is...

Lvl 4 sorceress. Darkstar cloak, tome of furion, dark steed, 318
Lvl 2 sorceress. Seal of ghrond, dispel scroll, 150

15 corsairs, musician & standard, 165
20 warriors with shields & musician, 165
10 warriors with RxB, 110
10 warriros with RxB - 110
5 dark riders, crossbows, musician, 127

6 CoK's, standard bearer, 192
15 executioners, musician & banner, 183
Cold one Chariot, spears, 97

2 Reaper Bolt throwers - 200

Total - 1817

which is pretty good for what i'm getting, size wise.

could get 10 harpies for 130 points, would still ahve some points left to add banners and champs to units, what do yuo reckon???
 

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a level 2 src with seal of Ghrond and dispel scroll is more like 170/175. not 150, unless you meant 150 with EITHER of those items, not both.
Just take the seal, you'll need the points elsewhere.

as for the rest of the spare points. Either take 10 harpies, as you said.
OR
if you really like the assasain, then take him. its that simple. I think he could actually work quiet well.. Im not sure but i THINK how it works is he joins a squad of infantry like corsairs or warriors etc, then when they fight in Close combat, his 'hidden' rule means he can strike but not be trageted directly as he is using his speed/cunning/skill etc to strike then hide among the troops. So basically he wont die until the troops are slain.
So if you put him with corsairs who have +1 save in CC, they will live longer than warriors. then you get 3 attacks from the assasain that only need 2+ to hit. And if you give him the upgrade of 'manbane' poison, then his strenght is always considered to be 1 point higher than his targets toughness when rolling to wound, meaning you will only need 3+ to wound. And with initiative 10 he will always get those attacks before anything else. I think he would kill 1-2 every turn. The enemies high toughness would actually work against them, bcoz T4 would mean he gets S5, which is -2 to armour saves.
AWESOME :w00t:
You might want to double check with a more senior player about how "hidden" works.

People would argue that he is pretty awesome BUT wouldnt earn all his points back, bcoz he would need to kill about 10 infantry to do that. But not every unit in your army has to earn its points back.. do you think malekith at 950 points would ever do that? No.. but he still mops the floor with anyone and wins games.

Try this, Assasain: Manbane poison, 2nd hand weapon, = 154

If you have any spare points after taking him or the harpies, then spend it on boosting the number of executions. they dish out alot of damage but cant take it, 6+ save vs strenght 1-3 attacks, and no save vs strength 4+ attacks. So more of them would be the answer. They need to annihilate the unit on the charge (which, with killing blow, they can do) or they are at serious risk of being crushed over the next turns of normal fighting.

EDIT: good news for you lol. Under the new revision that GW released for the dark elf codex, executioners now have heavy armour instead of light armour, at no extra cost ;). So its 5+ save vs strenght 1-3. 6+ vs S4. no save vs S5+
i would still invest in afew more though as i said before.
 

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i usually go with 8 cold on knights for the unit str and a rank bonus. esp if im running up on someone that has lots of mean shooters.

and ive had bad experiences with assassins since they have no armor and standard T. i like noble with draich of dark power mounted on a dark pegasus... works wonders for picking off the stand-alone magers
 
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