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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I was thinking about Chaos and before i get started i need to know of a viable way to kill super falcons (tis a shame you can't lash them into terrain)

right now my best thought is 3 maxed lascannon squads but that just doesn't cut it
12 shots
8 hits
6 glances
1/6 chance to kill a falcon(holofields + vectored)

Melee is even worse with 6's to hit, max is a glance and holofields still work. So anyway, is it possible for chaos to fight these broken monstrosities. (i myself am guilty of using fireprisms with holofields and spirit stones but as it never shoots all game i doubt thats considered broken)
 

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I've found a few tricks that work...

1. Monstrous Creatures, I only need 1 roll of 6 to bring that sucker down.

2. Kharn. He only needs to roll a 2 to hit, even against skimmers.

3. Melta bombs on Champions.

But if you're looking for range; that's an entirely different story.

1. Missle Launchers. I get krak against tanks; thought about this for a while now, 9s Vs 8s isn't to big of a difference against light armored vehicles. Plus I can use Frag to toast his infantry.

In all honesty though, all of these are viable, but we're still at the mercy of the die rolls. The problem with Eldar is they usually have a few back up rolls in case the first few don't work. I think you'll find few people that don't think Eldar are cheesy generally speaking.
 

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I've found that "super-falcons" get their points back in what they soak up rather than what they dish out, and as a consequence I generally content myself to shake or stun them, and then deal with them accordingly after that. Looking to destroy a falcon that's gotten a full move in is not a very good use of your resources imo. Ding it, be wary of what's inside it, and don't forget about the rest of the board!
 

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What Fuhrik said.

Once shaken or stunned, unless there's no other important targets to shoot at, I ignore them. Sure, I've been lucky before and rolled 2 6's, or a 4/5 and a 6 etc, but in general, I've seen people waste so much firepower at them when there was more important things to take out.
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
Thanks for all of the advice. I'm not sure how a monsterous creature would do any better in destroying the falcon but it is true for the most part you can ignore them. even 6 harlequins would be hard pressed to fight chaos in melee.
 

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well flying fast only makes shooting hits glance, not close combat ones, doesn't it? aint sure at the moment...
when my guess is right a monstrous creature will just need a 6 to hit, then str+2d6 pen should suffice for a penetrating hit and then all you've got to roll is two 3+ (skimmers die when immobilised and moved over 6"

so with a warp time winged prince fly there when it gets close to unload its harlies throw 5 dice throw all non-6es again and ten penetrate the damn thing with his str+2d6 armor pen and roll two 3+ on the damage table. then watch the fireworks, the harlies are entangled and will die to some bolter marines
 

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well flying fast only makes shooting hits glance, not close combat ones, doesn't it? aint sure at the moment...
Unfortunately no, it's all penetrating hits become glances on skimmers that moved fast, not just shooting hits. Unfortunately :/.

Personally i'd agree with most in this thread, you are better off going for the shaken result, once you get it just ignore it and shoot something like to do more damage. Like the incoming wraithlords or dire avenger spam.

With each shot against a falcon with spirit stones/holo fields you have something like a 75% chance to shake it, 13.9% chance to destroy a weapon, 8.3% chance to immobilise it (with vectored engines this isn't a kill unfortunately) and a 2.8% chance of killing it. You are so much better off shaking it then shooting something else then concentrating fire on something with a tiny percentage of actually killing it.
 

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well then, i'D say yes, go for shaken. if he transports harlies and let them in the falcon for one turn to ge to charge next turn without exposing them to bolter death always remember you can park something in front of the exit like an empty rhino or some raptors or another fast unit, forcing him to move away next round instead of unloading some angry space clowns
 

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From my experance, it is not what inside them that counts, it that fact that it is 2 scoring units.
I often used to face 2 falcons that had banshess and fire dragons inside. The squads never did anything over the top, but what would happen was in the last turn 4 scoring units land on the object, Game lost.
You need to force around 9 glances to take on down. There is two simple ways to achive that.
first, get a unit behind it and unload on the rear armour, Deep strinking terminators with combi plasmas and reeper autocannons will work nicely, shame about the cost

The other way is the large numbers of autocannons. In my new army I put out 20 S7 shots per turn with 3 lazcannons to bost. wieght of numbers will bring them down given time.
 

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From my experance, it is not what inside them that counts, it that fact that it is 2 scoring units.
I often used to face 2 falcons that had banshess and fire dragons inside. The squads never did anything over the top, but what would happen was in the last turn 4 scoring units land on the object, Game lost.
This is exactly my issue with them (even down to the same two units). His Fire Dragons toast one of my units on the turn they get out, but I can cope with that as I'll destroy them come my turn. But having 2+ scoring units being so hard to take out is a game winner for him.

I find it hard to concentrate enough fire power to force the number of rolls realistically required to bring them down. One Falcon maybe, but two - very very hard. I think the deepstriking terminator option is going to be my next attempt!
 

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well then, i'D say yes, go for shaken. if he transports harlies and let them in the falcon for one turn to ge to charge next turn without exposing them to bolter death always remember you can park something in front of the exit like an empty rhino or some raptors or another fast unit, forcing him to move away next round instead of unloading some angry space clowns
Well can't he just take his free 'pivot' and then drop them out and move?
 

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Well can't he just take his free 'pivot' and then drop them out and move?
No, the free "pivot" is used in the shooting phase, not the movement phase. The unit inside must disembark in the movement phase. So if you pivot in the movement phase, then disembark, the falcon counts as having moved, and the disembarking unit may not move or assault that turn.

I am a Mech Eldar player, so let me just say that I agree with the majority of folks in here that the way to deal with Falcons is to be content with having them shaken all game. I am always delighted when my opponent pours dozens of shots into my Falcons trying to take them down. Also, realize that a Falcon is a gunship - good mech Eldar players will usually have their Falcons hang out in the back and take long range shots at units. In this case, if you manage to shake it, it will simply hide during the next turn so you do not shake it again. This is the main reason why it is usually sub optimal to load a unit of Fire Dragons in a Falcon. Also remember that the Falcon does not have a great Ballistic Skill, so while the guns may look scary, they miss a lot.

If the Falcon is carrying a unit of Harlequins, it may try to get a ltitle closer (although it probably will not if you are already advancing towards it yourself). There are a couple of things you can do about this:

1. As mentioned previously, you can try to block the rear access point. This may seem like a good idea at first, but is not a serious threat to a Mech Eldar player who knows what he or she is doing. To realize why, you must understand that the reason Mech Eldar is such a good army is its mobility. A good player who knows what he or she is doing is well aware that you may move to block the access hatch. If you can do this, it is likely that he or she intended for you to be able to do so. The major benefit of the mobility is that the good Eldar player always has his or her units where he or she wants them to be. What comes with that is the power to make you move where he or she wants you to be. If you move a unit out of your way to try to block an access hatch, you may well be playing into the Eldar player's hands, breaking up your formation in such a way that he or she desires. In other words, an unguarded access hatch may be a ruse in order to get you to move a unit where the Eldar player wants it. Such is the win-win nature of the Mech Eldar.

2. Keep your units that are near the Falcon in cover. The only way for Harlequins to get plasma grenades is through the Shadowseer. Harlequins are fantastic in close combat, but for a specific reason. They often destroy everything in their kill zone before anyone gets to strike back. Harlequins have one huge flaw, however: if they get hit back, they drop like flies. If you are in cover and there is no Shadowseer in the unit, your unit will strike first and almost certainly cause a lot of damage. Against the Falcon's AP2 weaponry, while in cover you will also get a cover save.

3. The minute that the Harlequins are in cover, assault them. Any unit with frag grenades will do. You may not be able to shoot them if they have a Shadowseer, but charging in with frag grenades ensures that you will strike simultaneously. Again, the idea here is not to conserve your own force, but to destroy the Harlequins. Striking simultaneously will cause a lot of damage to them.

Anyhow, I hope I have helped some.
 
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