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Fav Artillery piece

  • Bolt Thrower

    Votes: 15 50.0%
  • Grudge Thrower

    Votes: 8 26.7%
  • Cannon

    Votes: 7 23.3%
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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
if I was to take 2 dwarf artillery pieces what would you recommend..... my army consists of:

1 lord

2 warrior squads

1 longbeard squad

1 ironbreaker

1 quarreler

1 thunderer

1 slayer

ill probly end up getting a Grudgethrower so what else
 

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My option isn't there, bolt thrower with a rune of penetrating and an engineer.
 

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A bit of alright.
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What of organ guns, they're lovely after all. I do like bolt throwers, +1S and they mash chariots, monsters and units.
 

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The Pacifist Wargamer
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Organ Guns, in my experience, have been unreliable.

Each of the machines approaches its effectiveness from a different aspect of killitude.

Grudgethrowers kills large masses.
Organ Guns kill medium, but stronger masses.
Cannons kill big nasties.
Bolt Throwers kill smaller nasties.

If you were to get a Grudgethrower, I would complement it with either a Cannon or a Bolt Thrower, depending on points. Since the Grudgethrower isn't a guaranteed hit, I would be more apt to go with a Bolt Thrower than a Cannon, just to avoid the possibility of losing two machines due to misfire.

Plus, if you get a Bolt Thrower and turn the Thunderers into more Quarrellers, then you have a black-powder-free army! :)
 

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LO Zealot
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You should get 2 bolt throwers with rune of penetration, 1 w/ flaming and both with engineers. They are both more reliable than cannons. Organ Guns are also reliable (with engineer you can re-roll) Cannons are more expensive and just don't do the trick unless bolstered to the d6 wound variety and then they are too expensive.
 

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The Pacifist Wargamer
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Organ guns don't get engineers. Buying a Master Engineer just for an Organ Gun is hardly worth the points. The Organ Gun is already pretty expensive.

Cannons are more expensive, yes, but they really don't need engineers, just the R.Forging.

Depending on your strategic situation, it may very well be that two Bolt Throwers are your best choice, particularly if you want those Special slots for excellent Dwarf Special Infantry.
 

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The bolt thrower doesn't blow up, but it doesn't hit all the time either. Usually 3+ and 4+, which compared to the 1/6 chance of blowing up a cannon or something, is a pretty bad chance of doing what it is supposed to do. In skilled hands, the cannon and the grudge thrower is pretty nasty if it doesn't misfire, that is.

I'm a big fan of the BT'ers; always bring 2 (but not more...). But i'm starting to think I've been seduced by their safety and not their effectivity compared to the grudge throwers, cannons and organ guns.
 

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Bearded Ninja
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i'd have to say that i'm not too fond of bolt throwers. they may be more reliable but its marginal. they are generally speaking the least accurate of the special warmachines.

cannons with a good guess will hit the enemy every time and with the rune of forging only have a 1/36 chance of misfire

grudge throwers are phenominally accurate if you have rune of accuracy giving them a 5/9 chance of a direct hit and if you throw in the master engineer (best warmachine for him by far) you get to re-roll the artillery dice to. this puts the grudge thrower top of the league table as far as dwarven warmachines go in my opinion. its only real flaw is its minimum range. if the enemy get too close then its useless. (thats what organ guns and flame cannons are for though :p )

bolt throwers are your "basic option" they are ok at everything but don't really butcher swaths of troops the same way that cannons or grudge throwers can.
 

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bolt throwers are your "basic option" they are ok at everything but don't really butcher swaths of troops the same way that cannons or grudge throwers can.
When it comes down to it though you're always better off having a mix of warmachines, I don't think I know anyone who still plays using only one type?
 

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Bearded Ninja
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natch has hit the goblin on the head. versitilty is the best way to play dwarves. we rarely get to choose our fights so its best to prepare for all situations and go for the full range of options.

i myself currently run 2 bolt throwers, a grudge thrower and a flame cannon. i'll be replacing those bolt throwers with a cannon soon enough though ;)
 

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natch has hit the goblin on the head. versitilty is the best way to play dwarves. we rarely get to choose our fights so its best to prepare for all situations and go for the full range of options.

i myself currently run 2 bolt throwers, a grudge thrower and a flame cannon. i'll be replacing those bolt throwers with a cannon soon enough though ;)
Natch?! lol

II currently run in my balanced list 2 bolt throwers, a cannon and then either a organ or flame cannon, I don't even own a grudge thrower and I'm begining to feel left out! Hitting goblins on the head is always good, I can imagine doing it with a big rock is even more fun!
 

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That is your balanced lists? I get sour faces at my local group whenever I'm bringing more than 2 BT'ers, cause that's a gunline according to them. Weird how the different groups have different ideas of the right way to do gaming. But I agree with you guys that a dwarf army should be able to field that much firepower and still count as balanced. I don't see no non-dwarf player complaining during the magic-phase. If the point is for both players to have fun, shouldn't the dwarf player be able to make up for his lacking magic phase in the shooting phase? And it's not like elf and empire players bring less shooting (though inferior, of course) in addition to their magic. Sorry to go on and on, but it has been a frustration to never being able to field a fair amount of firepower without falling in the cheesy gunline-category.

Moving on: I'm thinking of fielding a flame cannon or organ gun, and i'm starting to feel the flame cannon is the best, considering you can controll it's effectivity better and it causes panic easier. I mean, the organ gun hits from 0 - 10, which is quite a good spread, while the flame cannon is more dependent on your guessing, which I feel is at a level where I can always be assured to hit something? Anyone having experience or reflections on that idea?
 

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I have played Dwarfs for 16 odd years and I never use a Bolt Thrower. Most people swear by them, but I just think they stink. They simply dont kill enough. I also dont like cannon as they are too limited in value. They are really only worth their points with something big to splatter. I hate wasting a cannon shot on a unit of goblins, men, or elves. The only special war machine I like is the Grudge Thrower. It can do some real damage to tough monsters and take out a fair amount of massed units as well, even knights. They are flexible, and I like that. As Alton Brown says, "no uni-taskers in my kitchen". So, of your options, I chose it.

Now what I really love are the Organ Gun and the Flame Cannon. The Flame Cannon is ideal for causing those hordes to burn and flee by the score. But my personal favorite is the Organ Gun. It is good at killing most of the units in the game, has a great range, and even witht the misfire chance, has rarely failed to do its job. But its most important use is not in direct damage at all, its the sheer psychological power it holds over the battlefield. No one wants to charge straight in the face of an organ gun. Even chosen knights will waste an extra turn of movement to avoid its field of fire. You can make the enemy move where you want him to, bringing him directly to the great melee elite the Dwarfs have, and for once setting the terms of the fight. I use an Organ Gun even in a 500 point battle, as it can obliterate a unit in one shot at that level (or at least make it so small that it cant fight anything you have).
 

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I personally like the cannon w/ the rune of forging since it will probably never misfire, (unless you're good at rolling horribly...) and it: kills big monsters, chariots, tough units, and those horde units of goblins or skeletons get horribly mauled. Even if the only units you have to shoot at are Gobbos, making the unit flee is just as good as killing it. I always take it in any list I play if it is 500pts or higher. Plus, it's not like the cannon doesn't have psychological powers too. If I had a giant, putting it in line with a cannon is stupid.
 

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Well, to a lesser degre, that is true. But there is no light infantry unit that I would fear putting in front of a cannon. The cannon is not likely to cause enough casualties for awhile to cause a break test. That is why light infantry is called cannon fodder after all. And a cannon can only kill one knight or Ogre at a time in most cases. So it doesnt have quite the same impact.

No doubt a cannon is decent, especially in the hands of a proper Dwarf. And Im glad you have luck with it. One thing about Dwarfs in the last two editions is that there is nothing in the list that just stinks, and players can make vastly different lists from one another without fear of losing if they dont have the one "super" list that works.
 

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Bearded Ninja
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Natch?! lol
awww, it wasn't THAT bad a typo ;) (serves me right for posting while half asleep)
 

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That is your balanced lists? I get sour faces at my local group whenever I'm bringing more than 2 BT'ers, cause that's a gunline according to them. Weird how the different groups have different ideas of the right way to do gaming. But I agree with you guys that a dwarf army should be able to field that much firepower and still count as balanced. I don't see no non-dwarf player complaining during the magic-phase. If the point is for both players to have fun, shouldn't the dwarf player be able to make up for his lacking magic phase in the shooting phase? And it's not like elf and empire players bring less shooting (though inferior, of course) in addition to their magic. Sorry to go on and on, but it has been a frustration to never being able to field a fair amount of firepower without falling in the cheesy gunline-category.

Moving on: I'm thinking of fielding a flame cannon or organ gun, and i'm starting to feel the flame cannon is the best, considering you can controll it's effectivity better and it causes panic easier. I mean, the organ gun hits from 0 - 10, which is quite a good spread, while the flame cannon is more dependent on your guessing, which I feel is at a level where I can always be assured to hit something? Anyone having experience or reflections on that idea?
Nah, I can play a whole lot worse than that, a gunline from me (which to my defence I have only played twice and that was due to someone complaining that what I played normally was a gunline) Consists of a pair of Bolt throwers, pair of cannons, Grudge Thrower (borrowed), organ gun, flame cannon and 2 blocks of 18 thunderers on hills (one unit borrowed with hill kindly placed by my gm to prove to this whingy so and so that dwarves can be a lot worse). Needless to say the khornate forces didn't fare none too well that day, but gods I was bored. 4 War machines / units of thunderers I don't think are too bad, from my view, as long as less than a quarter of your armies points are in war machines its not ott. If your game group thinks 3 or 4 machines is a gunline, take one with 7 to prove a point.

The organ gun / flame cannon is interesting both are fairly accurate, with the organ gun being the only point and shoot war engine left in whfb, and the flame cannon being horriblly effective against low LD enemys. If you're playing against large blocks I'd take the flame cannon. Small number of cc elites (particularly cavalry) - organ gun.
 

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I field 2x BTs, Cannon, Organ Gun and Flame Cannon :| but only 10 Quarrellers. I'd say this was a borderline gunline.
All the Dwarven war machines have uses. The Cannon is probably the one I'd miss most. The BTs I generally use to add reliability (one has +1str, one is flaming), they allow me to deal with things like Chariot heavy lists, 2 Giant O&G lists etc.

The Organ Gun and the Flame Cannon are just plain brilliant, although I misfire something chronic.
 

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I'm playing always with a cannon, organ gun en 12 thunderers. And it is a nice combo.
because I'm a dwarf player, and dwarfs heav black powder. and that is one of the great thing from the dwarfs
 
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