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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
So a bit of clarification please.

Eldar Mind War allows a specific target within a unit to be singled out "The Eldar player may choose any unengaged model within 18" of the Farseer and within his line of sight.." (codex p28)

The Tyranid Codex states (under Tyrant Guard) "A Hive Tyrant with Tyrant Guard may not be picked out as a separate target from it's unit despite the fact it is a monstrous creature." (codex p36)

So while the answer may seem obvious, I feel that the intent of the Tyranid wording is due to the model size and being a monstrous creature. Whereas Mind War is attacking the mind of an individual and therefor should be able to single out the Tyrant.

I also realize that there is a new Tyranid codex coming out soon, but I will certainly have some battles before then.

Anyway, any/all opinions are welcomed.

-John
 

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Hive Fleet Pandora
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Shieldwall just makes the tyrant and its guards a unit insofar as shooting/assault is concerned. Thus you can't target the tyrant specifically with a shooting attack or in cc. Special powers which allow you to select a model as its target such as Mind War, Jaws of the World Wolf, or the targeting of a a Vindicare will still work normally.
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
certainly makes sense. But the wording doesn't specify shooting attacks. I'll be playing in some tournaments soon that are known for their rules lawyers and I want to be prepared.
 

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Advocatus Diaboli
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The shield wall rule overrides the monstrous creature rule which would mean it could be picked out regardless of the firer. Mind War etc. allows you to pick a model, regardless of whether you could or not (sergeants, for example). A shield walled tyrant is still fair game for this because you're not picking it out because it is a monstrous creature - you're picking it out because mind war allows you to.
 

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Hive Fleet Pandora
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It's not so much that shieldwall doesn't specify shooting or assault or whatever, it's more so that those other powers (Mind War, Vindicare) explicitly state that they affect individual models (or models in the unit) and not the whole unit.

But here is a simpler solution - check out the Tyranid FAQ. Under the question "Is the Hive Tyrant an IC?", it explains that the Tyrant and its guards follow the rules for retinues.
 
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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
Thank you all for clearing this up.
So while we're on the subject of Tyrant Guard and Eldar...
D-Cannon: So if I roll a 6 to wound which inflicts instant death (and lets say only one model is touched by the template). Actual template position is irrelevant since wounds can be placed anywhere within unit. Then the Tyranid's option would be 1) take 1 wound on the Hive Tyrant as he's immune to instant death. 2) take the wound on a Tyrant Guard, thus it suffers instant death and is removed.

Pardon if my questions seem basic, but I have been on a 40k break since 3rd edition (started playing in '89) and am getting used to the new rules and such.

-John
 

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Hive Fleet Pandora
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Any tyranid within range of a synapse creature (12") would also be immune to Instant Death. The tyrant guards, being in a unit with the Tyrant, definitely qualifies as being within synaptic range and thusly would be immune to ID.
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 · (Edited)
Ahh, indeed I missed that little part. Although the Tyranid codex states on pg28, "Tyranids within Synapse range...are immune to the effects of Instant Death caused by weapons with a Strength double the creature's Toughness."

So this seems to me that they are only immune if the ID rule is applied due to the weapon's strength being double toughness and since that is not the case with D-Cannons and wraith cannons as it is a special rule for those weapons...that they would still suffer Instant Death.
After all,l D-Cannons are actually opening a rift in normal space, not just blasting with a high powered beam.

While this is clearly a rule wording argument, it does seem correct that they would still suffer instant death.

Im not so concerned about this issue, unless the new codex is worded the same way.
 

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So this seems to me that they are only immune if the ID rule is applied due to the weapon's strength being double toughness and since that is not the case with D-Cannons and wraith cannons as it is a special rule for those weapons...that they would still suffer Instant Death.
It's kind of a moot point with the new dex so close, but check the Tyranid FAQ. The errata changes it so that synapse provides a blanket immunity to Instant Death.
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
Gosh darnnit!! Stoopid me for not reading the ENTIRE FAQ!!
+rep to both of you.
 
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