[Wakkawakka]

Yet another question.

I really want to take Eldrad as a unit that can tie up other units, and as a cannon foddering unit. But the one problem i see is the psychic powers ( want to cast fortune in CC)

Are eldar farseers allowed to cast psychic powers in CC? the rule book says (dont know abbr) that psychic powers are just like shooting, need line of sight ect. While the eldar codex says, Cast at the begging of the eldar players turn (therefore before moving) and does not need like of sight (so can work over combat, of course excluding the powers that replace shooting)

So is it a yes to cast or no?

 

[Exarch Thomo]

It's a no. Psychic powers, unless specifically mentioned in the power, aren't allowed to be cast in close combat.
Another thing though: you plan to use Eldrad as cannon fodder!? What the?

 

[Wakkawakka]

3+ invul save really helps for cannon fodder, plus everyone i know is afraid of him. Would rather us a regular seer for that, but he would get instant deathed to often becuase i play alot agianst str 6 weapons. Fortune is the key.

Oh well, may as well waste a farseer for the job, save the points.

 

[Rork]

You can cast fortune in combat. The only time you can't use a psychic power in combat if it is a shooting attack. Fortune, guide and doom are not shooting attacks, they're used at the start of the turn.

 

[Exarch Thomo]

Really? Where does it say that they can be used in cc? Why is it different to being transported? A model in close combat doesn't exactly have LoS to anything - the combat blocks it - and units in combat can't be targeted.

 

[stayscrunchyinmilk]

Really? Where does it say that they can be used in cc? Why is it different to being transported? A model in close combat doesn't exactly have LoS to anything - the combat blocks it - and units in combat can't be targeted.

I think it says something about it in Eldrads 'spear' boxed text - "unless in combat"

 

[Rork]

Really? Where does it say that they can be used in cc? Why is it different to being transported? A model in close combat doesn't exactly have LoS to anything - the combat blocks it - and units in combat can't be targeted.

Those psychic powers aren't shooting attacks for several reasons:

1. They target friendly models
2. They don't need LoS
3. They don't take place in the shooting phase or follow any of those rules
4. They don't replace the use of a weapon (like Mind War or Eldritch Storm)

So fortune, doom and guide (as well as the warlock powers enhance and embolden and technically conceal) can all be cast while the farseer is in combat. The core psychic rules also say "While most psychic powers are used instead of shooting, there are a number of abilities that may take effect in other phases."

The Staff of Ulthamar can't be used to recast a power if Eldrad is in combat, as has been stated.

 

[tarzen]

I know this is a sore point for Rork, but by the rules, Exarch T, you are right, you can't use powers in CC unless specified.

 

[xrix1]

What about targeting multiple units?

AKA Eldad guiding A, fortuneing B, and mind waring C?

Or Eldritch Storm A, Mind War B, and Mind War C?

 

[tarzen]

Again, from a strictly RAW point of view, it's a no go.

That said, very few people play that way, even though it is the rules.

 

[Platypus]

Yup, once again Tarzan has it right on the nose...Psychic powers must follow all the normal rules for shooting except where explicitly stated otherwise. Eldar Psychic powers are allowed to ignore the rules for shooting in the shooting phase (uses psychic powers during the beginning of their turn), LOS (They don’t require LOS to use their Psychic powers), & firing multiple weapons in one turn (with a spirit stone they can use two psychic powers in one turn). Other then those they must follow all other normal shooting rules.

 

[Rork]

Just as a follow up,

http://warhammerworld.typepad.com/warhammer_world_news/files/40k_gt_faq_3.9.pdf

is the FAQ for GTs this year. Granted, they are not 'official', but can be seen as a useful guide for rules such as this.

But given the way GW is being rather blasé with FAQs right now, I take 'em where I can get 'em (even if a few of the answers need rewriting).

 

[Ebon Hand]

On a similar topic, I was wondering if fortune even affects invulnerable or cover saves. I thought that fortune allowed only rerolls of armor saves? It doesn't seem right that Pathfinders could get rerolls on 2+ cover saves or a farseer a reroll on his invulnerable.

 

[Rork]

On a similar topic, I was wondering if fortune even affects invulnerable or cover saves. I thought that fortune allowed only rerolls of armor saves? It doesn't seem right that Pathfinders could get rerolls on 2+ cover saves or a farseer a reroll on his invulnerable.

Fortune is reroll saves - that's any save. It doesn't specify armour alone.

 

[Platypus]

Yup, Rork has it right...the codex dose indeed say save, and there is no current FAQ to dispute this.

 

[Splata]

and you can be fortuotous about that branch blocking the lascannon shot....

 

[Ebon Hand]

and you can be fortuotous about that branch blocking the lascannon shot....

Sorcery like this is exactly why witches like the Eldar need to be burned, drowned, then burned again. arty:

 

[kamikazebomba]

I believe you can

Actually I believe you can use psychic powers like doom, fortune, and guide in CC and the reason I believe this is because of the new precedent GW has set with the ork codex. Take a look at the weirdboy it says that if it gets a 1-3 for it's power when it is in cc then it counts as having a power weapon, however if you couldn't take a psychic test in CC then they wouldn't need to specify this as it would be impossible for the weirdboy to use his psychic power in CC as there is no rule anywhere in his description allowing him to. Only psychic powers that follow rules for shooting cannot be used in CC as you are not allowed to shoot while in CC.

Another example of this is in Eldrad's description where it says he can use an extra psychic power if not in CC, again, why would they specify this if you aren't allowed to use any psychic powers in CC. It wouldn't matter how many extras you have if it wasn't allowed period so they wouldn't bother mentioning it.

I think both these examples offer a fairly good precedent to believe that non-shooting psychic powers can be used in CC. I will admit there still is no hard and fast rule written anywhere that says they can but there still isn't one saying they can't and these character descriptions seem to imply that it is allowed.

Just my 2 cents there.
-Kamikazebomba

 

[tarzen]

from the straight intent of what's been released so far, GW is indeed headed into allowing psykic powers in a more general way, but as it sits in fourth edition, it isn't allowed. Plain and simple, as stated before, and in the rules book, powers follow the rules for shooting, unless SPECIFIED. This would be like Eldars powers not requiring LOS in general, as stated. As to orks, the newish marine codex, and to some degree the eldar codex, these were written with some 5th edition rules in mind.

Again, play how you wish, but from a strict rules point of view, no powers in CC unless stated otherwise.

 

[KhlauKolash]

Sorry Chuck, gotta go with Rork with this one. I think he is correct about Eldrad/Eldar Farseers and CC casting. I believe that this is an exception to the rules, but not completely. Several of the powers replace the shooting phase action and therefore... nix. But doom and fortune to name two do not seem to fall into that category as per the codex.