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Gladewalker
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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
My friend (orks) and I are going to be playing a few campaign games with cities of death rules, so I'm exploring the potential of guard in such environments. I know we can excel at this but it's not a matter of certainty. I'd like to tailor some lists for the city but not necessarily specifically for orks.

My army is a ordo xenos requisitioned regiment. List themes tend toward hybrid vehicle/infantry with a high number of veteran and penal legion ('vet scouts') squads though a platoon is always present. I own tons of infantry and HWSs, 2 chimeras, 2 valkyries, 2 armored sentinels with autocannons, a hell hound, and a standard russ with 3 heavy bolters. Games will likely be 1500-2000pts.

Any suggestions based on this rough outline of units? Have you had trouble with HWS bases in city terrain?

What have your experiences been with 5th ed city fights? What units / options do you consider indispensable?

We are creating a strategem or two for our own armies. I was thinking about creating one for shotguns like the 'master snipers' to allow them to ignore cover.

Do you have any statagem favorites or ideas for new ones? GW has a few new ones in an online article that are good.

This is a broad topic, but I'm keen to hear what you have to say. Thanks for reading.
 

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Gladewalker
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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
"Four-flamer drive-by"

I know the chimera profile says 5 firing points but it also stipulates that several would be using the mounted lasguns. Why don't more people consider multiple special weapons firing out to be against the spirit of the rules? IMHO one or two people firing out of the hatch perfectly reasonable.
 

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I'm kind of fond of pairing a Hellhound with a Leman Russ Eradicator. The hound is fast and accurate, while the Eradicator can sit back and pummel infantry at 36". Both are S6, AP4 and ignore cover saves.

I played Nids on a city board this weekend during a local tourney and these just 2 units just hosed my opponent's Gaunts and Gargoyles. Pics on my blog.

Then in the next game versus IG I would pop his transports and then pummel the guys that tried to hide behind the wreckage. Lovely! :)
 

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"Four-flamer drive-by"

I know the chimera profile says 5 firing points but it also stipulates that several would be using the mounted lasguns. Why don't more people consider multiple special weapons firing out to be against the spirit of the rules? IMHO one or two people firing out of the hatch perfectly reasonable.
Thats not how it works. There is no model in the game that provides a weapon for another model to use (except artillery). There are no rules provided to explain how that would work. A fire point allows one model inside the transport to fire one of his own weapons. The part about the lasgun emplacements is purely fluff and has no impact on the game. If it was against the spirit of the rules, GW would have clarified it in the FAQ a long time ago.
 

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Thats not how it works. There is no model in the game that provides a weapon for another model to use (except artillery). There are no rules provided to explain how that would work. A fire point allows one model inside the transport to fire one of his own weapons. The part about the lasgun emplacements is purely fluff and has no impact on the game. If it was against the spirit of the rules, GW would have clarified it in the FAQ a long time ago.
Agreed.

There used to be rules about which of the mounted lasguns could see where, and how many models could fire out of the top at the cost of the Chimera becoming open-topped for that turn. These were confusing and caused nothing but arguments if you actually tried to fire the lasguns, so most people never bothered.

The new firepoints rule overides all of this and makes LOS/measurement very simple by just using the top hatch as a reference point. Much better.

Of course the Chimera is a very old model and the design team hasn't caught up with the new rules yet. But you can adapt the model easily enough by just leaving the lasguns off. Or you can do what I did and model them properly as small hatches.
 

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In dense terrain boards, remember, quantity > quality. Chimeras are awesome of course, with a multilaser and heavy flamer. In side it you either want (as was mentioned) flamers, but also consider meltas. They'll be even more important since you wont have any reliable long range anti tank (even against transports), due to all the cover saves.

Banewolves would be able to do some excellent damage, and help to repel MEQ that will be able to get close to you (cover saves protecting them).

I prefer LRDemolishers (w/ no sponsons and a HHF) for city fights.

The Colossus is also something you should consider, great for popping hard shooty targets.
 

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Gladewalker
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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
Agreed.

There used to be rules about which of the mounted lasguns could see where, and how many models could fire out of the top at the cost of the Chimera becoming open-topped for that turn. These were confusing and caused nothing but arguments if you actually tried to fire the lasguns, so most people never bothered.

The new firepoints rule overides all of this and makes LOS/measurement very simple by just using the top hatch as a reference point. Much better.

Of course the Chimera is a very old model and the design team hasn't caught up with the new rules yet. But you can adapt the model easily enough by just leaving the lasguns off. Or you can do what I did and model them properly as small hatches.
I know it is legal to fire anything out of the chimera and you're right about the old model not having caught up, but it still feels wrong to ignore the fluff of the emplacements. I'm just stubborn.

Hatches would look cooler and make more sense for this edition, so that's what I might do when my 2nd chimera arrives.

As for the other comments. Demolishers, eradicators, and colossus' would all be great. How do you use your infantry, especially nonmounted units?
 

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So you play fully mechanised in the Cities of Death?

By the way, I really like what you did with your chimera models. And when I saw your 2nd ed Sentinels I remembered my old one and made new design myself. Thank you for your inspiration:)
 

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Thanks for the praise. :)

I play fully mechanized in regular 40K games that we play on a very nice city table. But no, I haven't played Cities of Death specifically.
 

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Believe it or not ive found mortars to actually be quite a good weapon in city fight games (not neccesarily city fight rules but a city or heavy building table) for the following reasons:

*48 inch range, means you can do what guard does best, hit the enemy from far away!

*Ignore cover thanks to it being a barrage weapon

*Can get lots of them for cheap number of points (example 5 teams of 3 or 15 mortars for 300 points). Thats alot of blast templates falling down on enemy especially in the packed confines of city buildings and/or streets.

*Can cause pinning to enable another turn of mortar fire.

*They are very fluffy as Imperial Guard are the only army that get them and just because they are way cool in my opinion.
 

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Gladewalker
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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
Believe it or not ive found mortars to actually be quite a good weapon in city fight games (not neccesarily city fight rules but a city or heavy building table) for the following reasons:

*48 inch range, means you can do what guard does best, hit the enemy from far away!

*Ignore cover thanks to it being a barrage weapon

*Can get lots of them for cheap number of points (example 5 teams of 3 or 15 mortars for 300 points). Thats alot of blast templates falling down on enemy especially in the packed confines of city buildings and/or streets.

*Can cause pinning to enable another turn of mortar fire.

*They are very fluffy as Imperial Guard are the only army that get them and just because they are way cool in my opinion.
I'm on the same page. There are three mortars in my list. Unfortunately, that's all I own. You're right, they are fluffy and can really thrive in this environment. However, I don't believe they ignore cover from area terrain which is plentiful in city fights.
 

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A good stradegem would be maybe something like "Abandoned Manufactoria" where you get to re roll hte scatter dice for one Ordnace battery within 12"
 

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Yes 10 vets with 3 plasmas and a heavy bolter holed up in a building allowing them to reroll hits (and therefore overheats). Give them cammo cloacks and defensive grenades and they are trickky to shift.

Valkyries could be quite fun in city terrain. Able to hide behind buildings and use their fast speed and defensive rocket pods to hunt orks in the streets.
 

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Gladewalker
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Discussion Starter · #18 ·
Mad Cat & Hallmaris:
Good point with the reroll key building. I'll try that out. My CCS with plasma guns uses 'bring it down' for killing monsters and light vehicles, but it would be better if it worked against infantry.

I did manage to hide a valkyrie in a recent city fight. What a boon for any already great unit.

tyland13:
There is an even better stratagem available from a online GW article. It allows units with a vox to act as spotters conferring a reroll of scatter. You'd have to buy voxes, but I like the fluff and concept.
 

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Master of Ordnance, Leman Russ Battle Tank, Thunderer siege tank, Destroyer Tank Hunter. Thats 4 anti-tank pie plates per round. Next key part. Hellhound. Did anyone say BBQ. 3 man Mortar team. Good way to hit with 3 blast per round and pin him. Next use tons of foot slogging guardsmen. Mix Grenade Launchers, Missile Launchers, Flamers, and very few plasma guns and melta guns in to the mix. Gear up your commanders with power weapons. I will say this list will throw him a beating he will never forget. I just built a list based on this idea. 2 round KQ vs Tau without going into assault. So if you do it right and roll good. Well he will get pwned.
 

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Drill Sergeant
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Here's a wee list i wrote for City fight. It's only 1000pts but I quite like it.

CCS: 3 Meltaguns, Chimera - 135pts
VETs: 3 Melta guns, Chimera - 155pts

PCS: Autocannon -40pts
INF: Autocannon, Flamer -65pts
INF: Autocannon, Flamer -65pts

Bane Wolf, Hull H-Flamer -130pts
Bane Wolf, Hull H-Flamer -130pts

Colossus: Hull H-Flamer - 140pts
Colossus: Hull H-Flamer - 140pts


Taking the old Medic strategum and sticking a combined squad in the building and it gets a bit silly. Led buy a commissar you've got a stubborn Feel No pain Guard squad o doom. Try shifting that!
 
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