[Farseer of Ylfieroth]

Howdy fellas/fellaresses,

As I'm a complete and utter eldar/40k virgin, and i fear my question will increase this image, but i am wanting some guardian squads for my Ulthwe army/strike force/etc. And i was wandering what the roles of the bright lance, starcannon, eldar missile launcher, shuriken cannon and scatter laser, i.e. what are they good for? (absolutely nothing!) And also, if it's not too much bother, what are good options for close combat wraithlords?

Ta,

Ps. i currently have a Farseer and warlock bodyguard and a squad of dire avengers with one exarch with dual shuriken catapults.

 

[rafis117]

Howdy fellas/fellaresses,

Hi.

Ps. i currently have a Farseer and warlock bodyguard and a squad of dire avengers with one exarch with dual shuriken catapults.

Good starting point. The farseer does a lot of useful stuff (especially with meatshields), and the DA are a very strong anti-infantry unit.

As I'm a complete and utter eldar/40k virgin, and i fear my question will increase this image, but i am wanting some guardian squads for my Ulthwe army/strike force/etc. And i was wandering what the roles of the bright lance, starcannon, eldar missile launcher, shuriken cannon and scatter laser, i.e. what are they good for? (absolutely nothing!) And also, if it's not too much bother, what are good options for close combat wraithlords?

Brightlance - Good against high AV due to the "Lance" rule
EML - Multi-role - alternatively good against TEQs (Terminator EQuivalents), MEQs (Marine EQuivalnets) and low AV or good against hordes, especially GEQs (Guardsmen EQuivalents). Choose your shots wisely.
Starcannon - Anti heavy infantry, powerful against TEQs, instagibs MEQs, denies Necron plebes the WBB role, decent against low AV in a pinch, overkill on GEQs
Shuricannon - Good against MEQs and very light armor. Decent against TEQs, mild overkill on GEQs
Scatter Laser - Dedicated anti-infantry gun. Amazing against GEQs, decent against MEQs

The real question is why you are running mobs of Guardians instead of mobs of Warlocks. The Guardians, even with weapon platforms, are simply not worth the points, especially given the terribly short range of their main weapon and inaccuracy with heavies.

As for Wraithlords, there is only one CC option, and that is the Wraithsword, which replaces one of the two standard power fists. It's nice if you REALLY want to be sure that you hit that annoying special character, but so are the EML, Brightlance, and Starcannon.

They way that most people run their Wraithlords is some combination of two heavy weapons (EMLs/Brightlances for anti-armor, Starcannons/Shuricannons/Scatter Lasers for anti-infantry) and the two flamers, which for some (joyful, obviously important and universe-justifying... ) reason do not twin-link, but instead get two templates, have effectively the same range as the shuricats, and are far more killy. (With your Wraithlords, always remember to keep them near a friendly psyker to prevent Wraithsight tests!)


Good luck with your Eldar!

 

[Archon Charybdis]

Howdy fellas/fellaresses,

As I'm a complete and utter eldar/40k virgin, and i fear my question will increase this image, but i am wanting some guardian squads for my Ulthwe army/strike force/etc. And i was wandering what the roles of the bright lance, starcannon, eldar missile launcher, shuriken cannon and scatter laser, i.e. what are they good for? (absolutely nothing!) And also, if it's not too much bother, what are good options for close combat wraithlords?

While they are fluffy for Ulthwe, unfortunately Guardians are pretty sub-par compared to Avengers. With BS3, and being twice as expensive as guardsman, they're also a pretty unreliable heavy weapon platform. If you're set on taking some though for fluff reasons though, here's what I'd recommend as far as heavy weapons

Bright Lance - Wouldn't even touch it. It's only one shot, and it's way too expensive to trust in the hands of a BS3 model.

Starcannon - Same problems as the BL really. It's a lot of points for an average of one hit. Plus, it's paying what I like to call the 4th ed "AP 2 tax." The proliferation of cover saves in 5th ed significantly reduces it's effectiveness as well. Just not worth it.

Eldar Missile Launcher - This one's not bad actually, it's cheaper than a BL, it's got a longer range allowing the Guardians to sit back and camp a home objective, while still being able to reach out and touch someone. Using it as a blast negates most of the drawbacks of BS3, but it's also got the versatility of firing the Krak missile if you really need to try and bring a tank down.

Scatter Laser- 4 Shots, good S, and you're not paying the AP 2 tax. Solid option if you need a little more anti-infantry, and the high number of shots helps make up for BS3.

Shuricannon - Bargain version of the scatter laser, if you want to field a really cheap objective camping unit.

My recommendation if you want to field the Black Guardians of Ulthwe; just use Guardian models with Dire Avenger rules. It's much more competitive and it's such a simple conversion/counts as most people would be happy to go along with it.

As far as Wraithlord's I'll back up Rafis, always go for the 2 flamers, it's just way better. And he's right on about the Wraithsword being the only real CC option. Firing off both flamers before charging into CC can do some pretty solid damage. And depending on your firepower in the rest of your army, you might put another gun on him as well so he has something to do while advancing, possibly an EML or a Scatter laser.

 

[eris]

For the 2nd CC wraithlord weapon i'd always take a ShuriCannon.

a) having a gun means the wlord isnt utterly useless if it's just chasing to get into CC, it can still shoot and make the opponent roll saves
b) minimum points spent,
c) 3/4 of hte shots of a scatter laser for 1/2 the price,
d) you wont notice the reduced range vs a scatter laser as you'll always be close with this wraithlord. you're trying to get it into CC after all.

other than that, the flamer advice is good.

 

[akaean]

I was wondering, if you take a warlock, because he counts as a "upgrade characther" what is the particular reason that HE can't fire the weapon platform at bs4.

I assume he can't, otherwise guardian heavy weapons would be significantly better, and I know he can fire a d-cannon, etc at BS4.

I think its because the guardian support weapon "counts as" a heavy weapon upgrade on a guardian... but man, it would be nice if the warlock could man the guns.


More on topic, if you want a fluffy ultwe list, and don't want to deal with counts as black guardians which = dire avengers, just use storm guardians. They are cheaper than dire avengers and better in all ways than Defenders. Flamers don't need to roll to hit. You just need alot of tanks to run storm guardians successfully... so don't touch em if wave serpents aren't your thing.

 

[eris]

the unit uses the majority balistic skill.

so since you have 10 models with bs3 and 1 with bs4, you'll be using the 3. since the HW needs 2 guardians to fire it, they'll always outnumber your warlock, so the only way to get it up to bs4 would be to kill off 8 guardians and join the squad with a bs4 IC.. of which we dont have any.. oh dear.. BS3 it is then.

 

[Farseer of Ylfieroth]

Thanks to all your speedy replies but i think i'm going to go for EML and Scatter Laser against my friend's less tanky IG and Scatter Laser and Starcannon with more tanks.

 

[eris]

fair enough, i'd definitely advise having your anti-mech on BS4 tho. taking down or at least shaking enemy armour is something you want to do reliably and having 1 shot with BS3 immediately hurts your chance of succeeding at that.

 

[rafis117]

I was wondering, if you take a warlock, because he counts as a "upgrade characther" what is the particular reason that HE can't fire the weapon platform at bs4.

Incorrect. The Warlock accompanies the Guardian Defender squad, and the codex says specifically that the weapon is manned by two Guardians.

 

[Archon Charybdis]

I was wondering, if you take a warlock, because he counts as a "upgrade characther" what is the particular reason that HE can't fire the weapon platform at bs4.

I assume he can't, otherwise guardian heavy weapons would be significantly better, and I know he can fire a d-cannon, etc at BS4.

The reason is the Support Weapons are artillery, and the rules for artillery allow upgrade characters (but not ICs) to fire the gun. The Guardian Heavy Weapon Platform is a Guardian special rule, and only allows for the two crewmen to fire.