Librarium Online Forums banner
1 - 20 of 33 Posts

·
Thinks he's a big deal
Joined
·
1,233 Posts
A Chaos Daemon is an over-generalization. It can apply to something smaller than a human fist to several stories tall.

Chaos Daemons are generally very resilient, and in the TT a Bolter-grade weapon at least would be recommended to take one down. In fluff however (thank you Dan Abnett!!!), even a Lasgun can take down just about anything that doesn't have an armor value.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
961 Posts
Sufficient lasgun fire, anyway. A Greater Daemon falls in the Cain novels after taking several melta shots and the lasgun fire of an entire platoon, and even then, she was under the weakening effects of a blank. Also used is an artillery barrage for a Daemonhost, which levels the entire area, to say nothing of the Daemonhost.

As for chaos champions, it largely depends on what their mutations are - if they have armored scales covering their bodies, it'll be much harder than if their mutation is several extra tentacles.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,884 Posts
In fluff however (thank you Dan Abnett!!!), even a Lasgun can take down just about anything that doesn't have an armor value.
I think someone's forgetting a certain Tanith scout leader.

Also it is impossiblle to "kill" a daemon. When they are destroyed in the 40k universe they are actually banished back to the warp, when they are destroyed in the warp they are sent back to their master (khorne, nurgle...)

The Emperor Protects
 

·
Thinks he's a big deal
Joined
·
1,233 Posts
I think someone's forgetting a certain Tanith scout leader.

Also it is impossiblle to "kill" a daemon. When they are destroyed in the 40k universe they are actually banished back to the warp, when they are destroyed in the warp they are sent back to their master (khorne, nurgle...)

The Emperor Protects
Yeah, well, theoretically, a lasgun could do kill most models in TT terms, but the odds are astronomically against it. However, there is literally no way for lasgun fire to pierce a vehicle. (A Long-Las on the other hand...sweet, sweet rending goodness.)
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
961 Posts
Anything of sufficient toughness (wraithlords, some fexes, talos, most (all?) gargantuan creatures) are also immune to lasgun fire on TT, but fluffwise a freakishly lucky shot or sheer weight of fire might bring one down, simply by eroding their armor/carapace/whatever away. To get reliable kills you need heavy weaponry, a heavy bolter at the least, assault cannons and autocannons are even better. Psycannons will rip through daemons like nothing else.
 

·
Thinks he's a big deal
Joined
·
1,233 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
961 Posts
Exactly my point :sinister:. Although I think some khornate daemons have armors saves that their AP value doesn't beat. Ah well.
 

·
Thinks he's a big deal
Joined
·
1,233 Posts
But, if they appear in a Dan Abnett novel, the guardsmen w/ lasgun can kill them! (Unless it has an AV in which case an autocannon or Leman Russ will appear via Creed's Tactical Genius CREEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEED- and obliterate the offending tank/walker)
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
961 Posts
Your telling me nobody in the Tanith First has a grenade launcher or melta? I'd like to see them beat Ghargatuloth or An'ggrath anyway. (And we should probably avoid /tg/ references B))
 

·
Thinks he's a big deal
Joined
·
1,233 Posts
Tanith, if I remember correctly, uses lasguns, long-las's, autocannons, and flamers, and their "straight silver" bayonets, plasma pistols for officers, and Gaunt's power sword. Pretty much nothing else (exception(s) include the xenos melta-like weapon in Only In Death).

EDIT: Oh yeah, the /tg/ stuff... probably...
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,884 Posts
Tanith, if I remember correctly, uses lasguns, long-las's, autocannons, and flamers, and their "straight silver" bayonets, plasma pistols for officers, and Gaunt's power sword. Pretty much nothing else (exception(s) include the xenos melta-like weapon in Only In Death)
I thought those were wraithcannons, or whatever weapon Eldar wraithguard are armed with during their war with the necrons millions of years ago. We are thinking of the same book right? The one where they were defending the giant house-fortress.
They also had heavy bolters, their det tape, tube charges, tank fethers (rocket launchers), I think there was a platoon with mortars in the 1st book with the Belladon...

Bragg has carried just about every weapon in the 40k universe; an assasult cannon, an autocannon, 2 autocannons tied togeather, heavy bolters...

But no meltaguns and grenade launchers.

The Emperor Protects
 

·
Son of LO
Joined
·
3,930 Posts
Daemons are all highly resilient to material weaponry, represented on the tabletop by their invulnerable save. If you're asking how hard it is to kill one, the answer is "mostly impossible." A daemon in the material world is only a manifestation of a warp spirit, and the spirit itself can't be harmed by bolts. But the daemon isn't particularly long-lived, nor is it very stable, since it requires a mortal psyker to act as a bridge. "Killing" a daemon in the material world mostly involves beating it up enough that it loses coherency and dissolves back into the Warp. This doesn't actually kill it: the daemon is just banished until such a time as it can manifest again.

I understand that the more powerful the daemon is, the longer it takes to manifest, which is the reason why the very rare greater daemons get banished for 666 years but the little ones can be resummoned en masse with a little effort.

Actually killing a daemon permanently is something that has to happen in the Warp, and since all daemons are to a greater or lesser extent composed of their patron God, when destroyed they are absorbed back into him (or it, thank you Slaanesh.)

As far as the Imperium is concerned, killing a Bloodthirster, for example, involves pumping him full of bolts until his manifestation gives up and goes kaput. Then it's X number of years until it can recover and re-manifest, so the Imperium is safe for now. The heavier the weaponry the better, but anything can really do it in enough numbers.
 

·
Son of LO
Joined
·
4,529 Posts
In terms of 'fluff tough' an invulnerable save generally > an armour save. Think about it even in game terms.. direct hit from an earthshaker - no effect.

Another thing that hasn't been mentioned though.. Faith makes a big difference against daemons. Consecrated ammunition and annointed weaponry can turn the tide far more than just really big guns. Fighting daemons should be as much a moral experience as a physical one.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,965 Posts
Which is why Grey Knights are so effective against them. It's not the psyker abilities, or the Nemesis weapons, or the armour and the (allegedly) Emperor's geneseed. It's the fact that their souls are so unbelievably pure that their very presence burns the daemon's essence. Which is why 300 can cleanse an entire planet of daemons (that's a number from the first Grey Knight book, and I'm going from memory, so I could be wrong, but its close).
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
961 Posts
They didn't cleanse the planet, they banished the Daemon in charge. What happened afterwards isn't explained, but all the Grey Knights died - of course, so would have anyone else, and they did manage to achieve their objective. Which others almost certainly wouldn't have, due to lacking the Grey Knight's unbreakable core of faith (and the fact that the planet had millions of manifested Daemons of all sizes on it). Blessed weapons are much better when it comes to killing daemons as the faith imbued in them disrupts their presence more than just shooting them does.

Invulnerable saves also represent things like force fields, improbable dodging capability, and sheer luck, but in the case of Daemons it represents their unnatural toughness.
 

·
Son of LO
Joined
·
3,930 Posts
Which is why 300 can cleanse an entire planet of daemons (that's a number from the first Grey Knight book, and I'm going from memory, so I could be wrong, but its close).
Three hundred Grey Knights is a lot of Grey Knights. Most daemon incursions get a squad or two. They're given a large fleet of super-fast strike cruisers specifically so they can be dispersed around the galaxy in such a manner.
 

·
A legend in my own mind.
Joined
·
1,480 Posts
Techincally you can't "kill" a Daemon as they are made from the warp. The best you can do is destroy their corperal form and send them back. But that really shouldn't be that hard, in False gods, the luna wolves on the swamp moon of Davin fight plaguebearers and they are able to kill them off. The greater Daemons and Daemons princes, you would need entire armies to kill them.
 
1 - 20 of 33 Posts
This is an older thread, you may not receive a response, and could be reviving an old thread. Please consider creating a new thread.
Top