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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
My local GW release store copy recently, I quickly took a few glances and here's some first impression.

Vampire got tons of upgrades and magic wargears in different catagories, It would be fun to develope deadly combos when the book is offically release and able to read more on them. However, with the fixed stat of vampire count, it wont be easy to create combat monster like blood dragon lord in old army book can.

Bat swarms, dire wolf and the new orpse cart are core choice that does not count as core in force organization structure, so in a 2k game a mix of 3 blocks of skeleton, ghouls and zombies will be unavoidable. No more dirt cheap 50 pt dire wolf core fillers.

Undead's heal spell only heal 1 wound per spell reguardless on 5+ version or 12+ version on units that with the rule vampire. (vampire heros, blood knight, vangulf) I guess grave guard, black knights and banshees will receive the most benefits form the new healing ability.

I have little idea how to use new necromancers effectively, lv 1 wizard that cant be upgrade to lv 2... I rather spend 100 pt more to use vampire with upgrade to lv 2 wizard that have good attact stat. Necormances may be more useful in 1k game or less?

Zombie cant chase, instead do d6 str 2 hits to the escape unit for each rank zombie have... Which is werid. I guess skeleton/ghouls will still be arround in my new vampire list just because the chase reaction,

Corpse cart is not a chariot but a monster, with a movement of 4 that do 2d6 str 2 attack in CC... Not sure is it worth it to get 2 for 200ish points just for the aura/bounce spell support zombies and skeleton.

Spirit hosts is a must buy beside zombies for you also create them as the byproduct of the 5th spell...

Flying nightmare is cheap and str 4, too bad hero only, Dont know where to use it if not join the flying hero with fel bat squards to flank.

Remarch spell only work once per unit each turn, oh well.

New rares already got another post already, so no comment. I still think the only one that is good is blood keep knights though.
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
Really? Dragon got improveed? I feel it is more like nerfed:

In old codex, if you combine with blood dragon Vampire count/lord + cursed book on dragon, you are almost untouchable!! -2 to hit roll!!, hence 5+ to hit the dragon, 6+ to hit the lord!)

You cant pull such combo anymore, and compare with most dragon's 3+ sv, it still only got 5+ sv.... care to explain where's the improvement at?
 

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The improved WS means that it's hit on 4's, and it still has cloud of flies, right (or is my brain backwards already?) making it hit on 5's just like before. The vamp riding it will be hit on 6's against anything with WS 3 or 5's otherwise.

Plus, the dragon might actually wound something now that it should land more than half its attacks.

And I'm not going to complain about its armor when it can be healed.



 

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I had my first look through the new book today, and contemplated getting a vampire BSB. The store owner, a friend of mine, mentioned something about vampires only being able to regain 1 wound pr. invocation, and that this would transfer to any unit the vampire joins. I found the thing about vampires only gaining 1 wound, but couldn't see anywhere why that would affect the unit (if non-vampire), but I only looked through the book once.

So just to make sure: a vampire joining GG wouldn't affect the ability to reraise the GG, would he? I'm pretty sure, but as mentioned I've only just seen the book.
 

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I had my first look through the new book today, and contemplated getting a vampire BSB. The store owner, a friend of mine, mentioned something about vampires only being able to regain 1 wound pr. invocation, and that this would transfer to any unit the vampire joins. I found the thing about vampires only gaining 1 wound, but couldn't see anywhere why that would affect the unit (if non-vampire), but I only looked through the book once.

So just to make sure: a vampire joining GG wouldn't affect the ability to reraise the GG, would he? I'm pretty sure, but as mentioned I've only just seen the book.
The rules for invocation are as such:

________________________________________

1) You may choose 1 unit or character to regain wounds.

2) Characters, units with vampire rule, ethereal or any other non-infantry unit only ever gain 1 wound

3) Infantry units mentioned above gain D6 wounds

4) Characters riding monsters must choose if the character of monster will gain the wound when attempting to casti invocation.

5) Units must first regain command models, then can regain rank-and-file.

______________________________________


So having a character jopin Grave guard won't effect how many GG are raised, I think either you mis-understood the store owner or he didn't read the rules carefully.
 

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I'm sure I didn't misunderstand him, I asked twice in disbelief...;)

But in his defence he only got the book yesterday, so hadn't read it in depth yet.

And yes, that's how I understood invocation to work, just wanted to hear if I was the crazy one. Thanks for your answer.
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
So Zombie dragon is ws 6 finally? Didnt know that, sweet.

About the healing, you can still heal multiple wounds if you cast it with a corpse cart near, the lode stone upgrade heal a wound also for each wound you healed, so you still heal 2 or more wounds on vampires depends on how much corpse cart is near the unit received healing.

Also, Wight king dont have the vampire rule, so can he can be healed multiple wounds on a single cast?
 

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So Zombie dragon is ws 6 finally? Didnt know that, sweet.

About the healing, you can still heal multiple wounds if you cast it with a corpse cart near, the lode stone upgrade heal a wound also for each wound you healed, so you still heal 2 or more wounds on vampires depends on how much corpse cart is near the unit received healing.

Also, Wight king dont have the vampire rule, so can he can be healed multiple wounds on a single cast?
The corpse cart's lodestone is an added effect upon the normal invocation, so yes if you would normally only be able to add 1 wound it would increase to 2 wounds. Only problem is at movement of 4" it'll be left behind if you actually want your fast units that only regain 1 wound each time to use the benefit.

Wight King is a character and characters only regain 1 wound each time.
 

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I love the new book °__°

I've been playing VCs for several months and had a lot of fun with it.
The new book is simply amazing.

You can go character heavy and spend nearly 1000pts on characters without dragons or monstruos things, like most Chaos builds. Or you can rely on cheaper things, play some necromancers and 100 zombies for...well,posting point costs would violate the copyright , let's say it's a lot below 500pts.

Varghulf....lol...compare it to Dark Elves hydra (sorry id I mispelled it) and laugh.
And the new Wraiths unit is incredible, even though it's expensive.

Vampire powers are insane, not only for their strenght. They allow people to customize every single hero in the army as much as they want to.
No more restrictions such as:"You want infinite hatred on a Blood Dragon? Uh sorry,you can't...". Now every single vampire in the army gets any power you want, this is exactly the most wonderful thing in the game: customizing YOUR OWN army.
In the end some build will be definitely considered the most effectives, but there are some many viable & competitive choices....endless combinations.

I consider the book extremely competitive, but even if it will result beeing a complete crap it will be my favourite fantasy book, due to the amounts of different builds available.
 

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The corpse cart's lodestone is an added effect upon the normal invocation, so yes if you would normally only be able to add 1 wound it would increase to 2 wounds. Only problem is at movement of 4" it'll be left behind if you actually want your fast units that only regain 1 wound each time to use the benefit.

Wight King is a character and characters only regain 1 wound each time.
But it can march! So with a 6" range and an 8" march, you've got an effective range of 14", which isn't bad, once you consider that Invocation of Nehek has a fairly short range itself, if I recall, and you still need someone to cast it. (Although the Necromancer on the back of the Corpse Cart makes a good canidate for that...)

Also, the Wight King has 2 wounds, right? So regaining multiple wounds is kinda pointless for him, one way or the other, as you can't bring characters back from the dead.
 

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Just a reminder: Be wary discussing new rules. Make sure that you're not revealing point costs, casting values, or things that could give away specifics someone would otherwise need the book for.

GW has better lawyers than LO.
That's just plain silly, GW won't sue some random owner of an open forum because the users happen to discuss relative points cost and rules from published books.

GW won't let you discuss it on their forums (because they can erase it), but you can do whatever you want on your own.

As long as you are not publishing entire books and selling them or publishing them as if they were your own work you're fine. Discussing the contents of a book is not illegal or immoral in any way (even if GW finds it easier to control their purchasing population if we do believe this).

Name any other book in which you cannot openly select quotes from and post them and discuss them.... there is no such thing, just don't publish a whole book (such as making a PDF document, that is a copy of the book, available for viewers to download) and your fine.

Now if LO wishes to keep said quotations from GW's books a secret then that's your choice, but don't pretend they care enough to sue anyone!
 

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That's just plain silly, GW won't sue some random owner of an open forum because the users happen to discuss relative points cost and rules from published books.

GW won't let you discuss it on their forums (because they can erase it), but you can do whatever you want on your own.

As long as you are not publishing entire books and selling them or publishing them as if they were your own work you're fine. Discussing the contents of a book is not illegal or immoral in any way (even if GW finds it easier to control their purchasing population if we do believe this).

Name any other book in which you cannot openly select quotes from and post them and discuss them.... there is no such thing, just don't publish a whole book (such as making a PDF document, that is a copy of the book, available for viewers to download) and your fine.

Now if LO wishes to keep said quotations from GW's books a secret then that's your choice, but don't pretend they care enough to sue anyone!
I dont know man.. they've sued Blizzard for their non-creative result of Starcraft arts, I dont see why not if they find out about what's going on on LO. :p Last time I checked, GW was losing lots of money, maybe they are getting desperate! .. hint hint.. the new army books and all.
 

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That's LO's policy, and as part of the mod team, I've accepted the position of upholding its policy. Do I think they would come after LO? I doubt it, but the owner's position as well as the mod's team has always been better safe than sorry. Moreover, I don't think it's asking much to omit costs of upgrades, units, and the like. That's not going to limit anybody's discussion.

What I do know is that when army books have appeared as PDF files, some people have gotten some very nasty emails from GW, not to mention the heads that were chopped within GW when an unrelased release schedule showed up on Warseer.

Regardless, why risk it?



 

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I dont know man.. they've sued Blizzard for their non-creative result of Starcraft arts, I dont see why not if they find out about what's going on on LO. :p Last time I checked, GW was losing lots of money, maybe they are getting desperate! .. hint hint.. the new army books and all.
And they would spend even more money to sue an insignificant individual with no money over exposing a few details about their book? Would that make sense, to waste more money on court fees than you coupld recoup from the individual that isn't a massive corporation with plenty of money to take away?

Like I said it's cool to limit what you discuss, but it's deffinitly nota legal issue ever. LO policy is fine about limiting exposure of "secrets" no problem there.
 

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Ya, I'd be really surprised if they actually sued a forum. They'd alienate a lot of temperamental fans that way. What I'd be less surprised with is a pointed letter or email.

Anyhow, we're drifting off topic.

Having had a chance to read the book now, it's going to be a lot of fun building armies. So much more variety and strategies available with the new units and rules.

Gav Thorpe is now deified in my book.



 

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After a more thorough look at the new book, I couldn't help but feel that I would have trouble keeping the cost of characters down. So I did a quick calculation, and if you really want to you can spend 1515 points of a 2000 points army on characters!

Check it out, Vampire Lord on Abyssal Terror, Mannfred the Acolyte on Abyssal Terror and with the Skullstaff, Vampire BSB with Drakenhof Banner on Hellsteed and Vampire on Hellsteed. :rofl
 

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It rocks!

I

LOVE

IT

The options! The options!!

I was so bored with the same old routine of the old book, now it will take literally thousands of games to try out everything :D

<3:)

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