[mynameisgrax]

I'm very new with Dark Eldar (as in 'still putting together the models new'), but I wanted to put together a first list, to get an idea of how I want to arm and assemble my army. I trying to focus on a simple, troop heavy army, with only a minimal amount of Raiders. I kept the Dracon independent, so I can join him with a unit later. I thought about putting him on a Reaver bike, but couldn't find the spare points for it.

(EDITED)

-Dracon w/agonizer, shadowfield, splinter pistol and plasma grenades

-Wyches x9 w/wych weapons and plasma grenades
Succubus w/agonizer and plasma grenades
Raider

-Wyches x8 w/wych weapons and plasma grenades
Succubus w/agonizer and plasma grenades
Raider

-Warriors x10 w/2 Dark Lance

-Warriors x10 w/2 Dark Lance

-Warriors x10 w/2 Dark Lance

-Warriors x14 w/2 Splinter Cannon and 2 Blaster
Sybarite w/power weapon

-Warriors x14 w/2 Splinter Cannon and 2 Blaster
Sybarite w/power weapon

-Warriors x14 w/2 Splinter Cannon
Sybarite w/power weapon

-Ravager w/1 Dark Lance and 2 Dissies

-Ravager w/1 Dark Lance and 2 Dissies


Again, I'm very new, so please let me know if I've overlooked something important. Thank you!

 

[Toloran]

I'm very new with Dark Eldar (as in 'still putting together the models new'), but I wanted to put together a first list, to get an idea of how I want to arm and assemble my army. I trying to focus on a simple, troop heavy army, with only a minimal amount of Raiders. I kept the Dracon independent, so I can join him with a unit later. I thought about putting him on a Reaver bike, but couldn't find the spare points for it.

I don't have as much experience with this type of list (I'm mostly a Webway portal army guy) but I'll see what I can do.

-Dracon w/agonizer, shadowfield, splinter pistol and plasma grenades

I suggest you don't put him on a bike unless you plan on having other guys on jetbikes. The reason is that they can run a screen ahead of the dracon and make him (effectively) untargetable. Otherwise you you won't be able to make use of its speed. As for the agonizer: I personally prefer the punisher over the agonizer but thats just me. I suggest you look at the Punisher vs Agonizer sticky on the main DE forum. If you can skim points from somewhere else to give him combat drugs, that would be grand.

-Wyches x8 w/wych weapons and plasma grenades
Succubus w/agonizer and plasma grenades
Raider

-Wyches x8 w/wych weapons and plasma grenades
Succubus w/agonizer and plasma grenades
Raider

I notice that both of these squads are under sized to be able to stick the lord in. If you plan on sticking the lord in the wyche squads, I suggest you isntead take a Wych Lord since she is better in assault then even the Dark Eldar lord is (and has wych weps and 4+ invul to boot).

The only think I have to point out though is that your raiders are going to be shot down turn 1 or 2 since you have so few of them (the enemy will fire more anti-tank per raider). Even with the skimmers moving fast rule, you still die on a 4+. That also means everything inside (a 6+ armor save won't save you here).

-Warriors x10 w/2 Dark Lance

-Warriors x10 w/2 Dark Lance

-Warriors x10 w/2 Dark Lance

-Warriors x14 w/2 Splinter Cannon and 2 Blaster
Sybarite w/poisoned blades

-Warriors x14 w/2 Splinter Cannon and 2 Blaster
Sybarite w/poisoned blades

-Warriors x14 w/2 Splinter Cannon and 2 Blaster
Sybarite w/poisoned blades

I'm not a big fan of poisoned blades: You don't get the extra attack from having two CC weapons and you don't get the effects of plasma grenades. I suggest you remove a guy or two from each squad and then give him a power weapon or agonizer.

-Ravager w/1 Dark Lance and 2 Dissies

-Ravager w/1 Dark Lance and 2 Dissies

Looks good. Might want to consider getting a talos at some point in the future.

Again, I'm very new, so please let me know if I've overlooked something important. Thank you!

No problem. If you haven't already, I suggest you look at the tactica sticky in the main DE forum.

 

[mynameisgrax]

Thank you!

Thank you for responding. You're probably right on virtually every count, but I'll have to rethink my army to do it.

I honestly overlooked the fact that poisoned blades don't give you the extra CC attack. I didn't read closely enough. Still, an agonizer for every sybarite seems like a waste of points. I'll have to give power weapons and punishers a closer look.

You're right, those raiders are going to have trouble, but I'm not a big fan of the 'rush all raiders with fingers crossed' approach. I was thinking of starting battles with the raiders hidden, the large troops slogging, and the snipers and ravagers firing dark lances at the more dangerous targets. When the coast was a bit clearer (or the enemy moved closer), then I'd move in the raiders. I could always turn one of the slogging units into as a sacrificial raider squad. I'll have to think on it.

I was looking for more of a support HQ, instead of spending a lot of points on them, which is why I went for the vanilla dracon, rather than an Archon, Wych Lord, or one with combat drugs, but I'll look into it. Yes, the slot is open in the Wych's to allow him to join, but now that I think of it, I really only need one wych squad with a spot in it. It's not like he can join both at the same time.

Reaver squads seem interesting, especially as anti-tank units, but I don't currently own any. I'm still trying to decide if they're worth both the points and the money.

The talos seems too slow to use in a non-wwp army. It's the same reason I didn't take incubi. They seem far too slow.

I've considered the web way portal strategy, but 100 points for two is a large chunk of the army in a 1500 point list, and only taking one for 50 seems risky.

At this point, I can't really say anything until I give the different strategies a try, but thank you for the advice. I'll update the list for the changes so far.

 

[mynameisgrax]

Thank you!

(Accidentally posted the same message twice, sorry)

 

[Toloran]

Thank you for responding. You're probably right on virtually every count, but I'll have to rethink my army to do it.

I honestly overlooked the fact that poisoned blades don't give you the extra CC attack. I didn't read closely enough. Still, an agonizer for every sybarite seems like a waste of points. I'll have to give power weapons and punishers a closer look.

You're right, those raiders are going to have trouble, but I'm not a big fan of the 'rush all raiders with fingers crossed' approach. I was thinking of starting battles with the raiders hidden, the large troops slogging, and the snipers and ravagers firing dark lances at the more dangerous targets. When the coast was a bit clearer (or the enemy moved closer), then I'd move in the raiders. I could always turn one of the slogging units into as a sacrificial raider squad. I'll have to think on it.

I was looking for more of a support HQ, instead of spending a lot of points on them, which is why I went for the vanilla dracon, rather than an Archon, Wych Lord, or one with combat drugs, but I'll look into it. Yes, the slot is open in the Wych's to allow him to join, but now that I think of it, I really only need one wych squad with a spot in it. It's not like he can join both at the same time.

Reaver squads seem interesting, especially as anti-tank units, but I don't currently own any. I'm still trying to decide if they're worth both the points and the money.

The talos seems too slow to use in a non-wwp army. It's the same reason I didn't take incubi. They seem far too slow.

I've considered the web way portal strategy, but 100 points for two is a large chunk of the army in a 1500 point list, and only taking one for 50 seems risky.

At this point, I can't really say anything until I give the different strategies a try, but thank you for the advice. I'll update the list for the changes so far.

I have to agree with holding off on the raider rush. It really requires you have 5+ raiders in your list to work and even then the strategy isn't all that great IMO.

Reavers ARE great anti-tank but I've personally never been able to use them properly.

Depending on the mission, the Talos doesn't have to move a whole lot. Cleanse, for example, is a perfect for the Talos since he can be placed semi-near the center and then reach one of the other quarters in a turn or two. Also his 3+ armor save and toughness 7 make him immune to anything with 3 or less strength and heavily resistant to everything else. As to the incubi, they are one of the best CC units in our army and some of the best in the game: They are fast (5 initiative beats just about everything), powerful (2 Attacks, Power weapons, 5 WS, and strength 4 for 25 pts? Yes please), and tough (3+ armor save). Yes, they can't Fleet of Foot but you can always mount them in a raider and then it doesn't matter as much.

As for WWP in a 1500pts list, Think of it this way: Right now you are probably thinking of those 100pts as "I could get X instead with those 100pts." That isn't the proper way to think of WWPs since they don't kill anything. Instead think of it as "Is this 100pts going to protect an equal or greater number of points in my army?" The point of the WWP is to keep your guys safe from fire for a turn or two while your enemy gets in to position (ie, closer to you) and then you rush out and beat the poop out of them. It is hard to hide a lot of troops on a map and by condensing them down in to a smaller area, you'll lose fewer troops in the opening turns and then rush out when your opponent is in striking range. Now, this isn't the strategy for everyone. If your opponent runs snipers you are likely doomed or at least in trouble. Also if your opponent goes first they can deepstrike near your portal and then move to block it.

As for the dracon: A kitted out Archon is a CC monster. They can take out anything of their points value and higher in a fair fight. In an unfair fight (because who wants to fight fair?) you can slaughter just about anything. A week or two ago, I had my drugged up archon slaughter half a team of assault marines by himself. As you can see, I am a big fan of using them offensively That said, I suggest trying both ways and seeing what works for you. A unit of Incubi + Archon is a frightening sight to the enemy (well, once they see them in action anyway).

As to your strategy: It sounds like a good plan. Just keep in mind that your games will rely heavily on your skill at placing terrain. A bad set up will easily get you killed. Also beware of deep strikers popping in behind your lines and blasting your hiding raiders.

In either case: Good Luck ;Y

 

[mynameisgrax]

Sounds good

Thank you for the advice. Despite my initial hesitation, after glancing around online, I've found that most competitive 1500pt DE armies use two web portals. I guess I have to stop thinking of them as points wasted, and instead think of them as upgrades for whatever is held inside them.

Here a second version of the list, incorporating some of the advice:


-Dracon w/agonizer, shadowfield, splinter pistol and plasma grenades

-Wyches x8 w/wych weapons and plasma grenades
Succubus w/agonizer and plasma grenades
Raider

-Wyches x7 w/wych weapons and plasma grenades
Succubus w/agonizer and plasma grenades
Raider

-Warriors x10 w/2 Dark Lance

-Warriors x10 w/2 Dark Lance

-Warriors x14 w/2 Splinter Cannon and 2 Blaster
Sybarite w/power weapon, web way portal

-Warriors x14 w/2 Splinter Cannon and 2 Blaster
Sybarite w/power weapon, web way portal

-Warriors x9 w/2 Splinter Cannon
Sybarite w/power weapon
Raider

-Ravager w/1 Dark Lance and 2 Dissies

-Ravager w/1 Dark Lance and 2 Dissies

 

[Toloran]

Thank you for the advice. Despite my initial hesitation, after glancing around online, I've found that most competitive 1500pt DE armies use two web portals. I guess I have to stop thinking of them as points wasted, and instead think of them as upgrades for whatever is held inside them.

Here a second version of the list, incorporating some of the advice:


-Dracon w/agonizer, shadowfield, splinter pistol and plasma grenades

-Wyches x8 w/wych weapons and plasma grenades
Succubus w/agonizer and plasma grenades
Raider

-Wyches x7 w/wych weapons and plasma grenades
Succubus w/agonizer and plasma grenades
Raider

-Warriors x10 w/2 Dark Lance

-Warriors x10 w/2 Dark Lance

-Warriors x14 w/2 Splinter Cannon and 2 Blaster
Sybarite w/power weapon, web way portal

-Warriors x14 w/2 Splinter Cannon and 2 Blaster
Sybarite w/power weapon, web way portal

-Warriors x9 w/2 Splinter Cannon
Sybarite w/power weapon
Raider

-Ravager w/1 Dark Lance and 2 Dissies

-Ravager w/1 Dark Lance and 2 Dissies

List looks good. Only a few strategy concerns (nothing major, just something to keep in mind while playing):

If your opponent knows to worry about WWPs (usually the second time you play against them) they'll immediately target your two WWP units. Since the squad is large enough your guy should be fine for one round but rarely two. So unless you can quickly hide them, drop your portal as early as possible.

Your biggest worry (from my own personal experience) is against Chaos using Lash of Slaanesh. If you aren't familiar with it, it is a Psyker power that allows you (the chaos player) to move a single enemy unit quite a distance in any direction you want and it ignores difficult terrain. A common tactic i've seen is to lash your guys nearer to him and then assault them. If they are in assault, they can't use the WWP.

Also, any pie-launcher army (ie, shoots lots of large blasts) will ruin your day since their indirect fire can hit you just about anywhere and shred your guys. The most common army I've seen use this tactic are IG using basilisks.

Lastly, always defend the WWP if you still have guys remaining in reserve. I've seen it too often where I go "Oh, that unit won't be a problem since I'll likely make my reserve roll next turn." Well... I didn't and they surrounded my portal and blocked it off.

Besides that: Good luck and happy hunting ;Y

 

[mynameisgrax]

Funny you should mention it...

I was just voicing concern over 'lash' and shooy armies in another topic.

To counteract both problems, I was planning on setting up the web way portals as quickly as possible, after getting the squads in a more favorable position.

Thanks for all the help!