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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Hey All!

I'm relatively new here, but I've been lurking for quite some time. I took a long break from the hobby for about a year and a half/two years, so I haven't really played or painted/modeled since 4th edition. Back when I was leaving the hobby I became really intrigued with the idea of an all Death Company Blood Angels army. Something about the idea of a crazed bloodthirsty hoard of marines unable to hold themselves back from relentless slaughter sounded so terrifying to me. So, I figured I should just jump back in where I left off and see where that takes me.

Anyway, at that time I did a little research and found an army list online back however long ago my lapse began. The list seems pretty decent to me at the time, but I wanted to post it here to see what you guys think and get some C&C.

The second problem is that I haven't had a chance to grab a new rulebook yet. I spoke with some old buddies of mine down at the local store and they were filling me in on some of the changes, however until I get my hands on the book I won't really have a good sense as to how much these massive changes will affect my army choice.

So here's the list, any thoughts or comments would be appreciated!

HQ
Astorath the Grim: 220 pts
Executioner's Axe, bolt pistol, jump pack, frag and krak grenades, rosarius.

Death Company Tycho: 175 pts
Blood Song, bolt pistol, The Dead Man's Hand, frag and krak grenades, Iron Halo

Elites
Sanguinary Priest: 90 pts
Power weapon, bolt pistol, jump pack, frag and krak grenades, Blood Chalice

Brother Corbulo: 105 pts
Heaven's Teeth, bolt pistol, frag and krak grenades, The Red Grail

Chaplain: 100 pts
Crozius Arcanum, power fist, frag and krak grenades, rosarius

Chaplain: 100 pts
Crozius Arcanum, bolt pistol, frag and krak grenades, rosarius

Troops
Death Company: 140 pts
7 Death Company with boltguns, chainswords, frag and krak grenades

Dedicated Transport: Rhino with storm bolter, smoke launchers, and searchlight: 51pts

Death Company: 180 pts
1 Death Company with power fist and bolt pistol
1 Death Company with power weapon and bolt pistol
5 Death Company with chainswords and boltguns

Dedicated Transport: Rhino with storm bolter and smoke launchers: 50 pts

Death Company: 325 pts.
1 Death Company with chainsword and hand flamer
1 Death Company with power fist and bolt pistol
2 Death Company with chainswords and bolt pistols
Lemartes, Guardian of the lost with Blood Crozius and rosarius
All have jump packs, frag and krak grenades

Death Company: 185 pts
1 Death Company with thunder hammer and bolt pistol
1 Death Company with power fist and bolt pistol
2 Death Company with chainswords and bolt pistols
All have jump packs, frag and krak grenades

Death Company Dreadnought: 125 pts
Blood fist with built-in storm bolter, blood fist with built-in meltagun, smoke launchers

Death Company Dreadnought: 125 pts
Blood talon with built-in storm bolter, blood talon with built-in meltagun, smoke launchers
Total: 2000 pts

Basically I was looking for something simplistic enough that it would be relatively easy to work my way back into the game/rules etc, but also fun to play with and build. I know there are no scoring units,, so I will always be going for "Wipeout!" rules, as I think is fitting to any all Death Company army.

Astorath, Lemartes, and the Chaplain are attached to Death Company squads, and the Blood Chalice and Red Grail are necessary to extend the awesome rules of the Death Company to the Chaplain. The Dreadnoughts are mostly there to deal with any unforeseen armored targets or masses of enemies (respectively).

Thoughts? Changes? Tips? Just from what my friends told me, I get the feeling I'm going to be pretty vulnerable to flyers...

Also, what do people think of the new rulebook? I was debating just purchasing the Dark Vengeance box set because I get a mini rulebook and a whole slew of pretty cool models for like, 15 bucks more than just a full size rulebook. I think buying the 4th edition rulebook just to have it change again will stand as the last time I purchase a full rulebook.

Thanks!

-sad
 

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Son of LO
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well, the model count is rather abyssmal, even for a Death Company list. 15 points for a jump on DC is quite the point sink, especially when a drop pod will serve as a better deliver system. I feel you could drop some of those chaplains or Lemartes. With the spare points, you could buy drop pods for your dreadnoughts as well. I would downsize special weapons within squads. 1 power fist per 5 models is more than adequate - Thunder hammer are not worth the extra points. I would consider removing the hand flamers in favour of a plasma pistol or infernious pistol for more armour punching on 1 deep striking squad.

As such, you could trade the two rhinos for pods, have two more pods for the dreads, and perhaps remove Jump packs from 1 unit for a 5th pod. That would give you quite a first turn disruptive punch, with a good second wave.
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
Thanks for the reply! Yea, the more I look into drop pods the more alluring they're becoming. I've also been reading that you can technically drop an entire army (units inside of transports that must be held in reserve only count as one unit). However, my main concern is dealing with flyers. My buddies tell me that Guard have much better AA, but I'm wondering if maybe I should take a Whirlwind Hyperios to deal with flyers. Is it worth it to factor in some AA to this list?

-sad
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
Revamped the list after discussing some of the rules changes with my buddies down at the store today. After much debate, I ended up with what I have below. I had wanted to use a full drop pod army that specialized in CC (that way I could drop right in their face and engage the next turn), but I'm not sure how viable that is at the 2000 pts range.

HQ
Astorath the Grim: 220 pts
Executioner's Axe, bolt pistol, jump pack, frag and krak grenades, rosarius.

Elites
Sanguinary Priest: 90 pts
Power weapon, bolt pistol, jump pack, frag and krak grenades, Blood Chalice

Brother Corbulo: 105 pts
Heaven's Teeth, bolt pistol, frag and krak grenades, The Red Grail

Chaplain: 100 pts
Crozius Arcanum, power fist, frag and krak grenades, rosarius

Chaplain: 100 pts
Crozius Arcanum, bolt pistol, frag and krak grenades, rosarius

Troops
Death Company: 320 pts
1 Death Company with power fist and bolt pistol
1 Death Company with chainsword and infernus pistol
6 Death Company with chainswords and bolt pistols

Death Company: 310 pts
1 Death Company with power weapon and bolt pistol
1 Death Company with chainsword and infernus pistol
6 Death Company with chainswords and bolt pistols

Death Company: 395 pts
1 Death Company with power fist and bolt pistol
1 Death Company with chainsword and hand flamers
4 Death Company with chainswords and bolt pistols
Lemartes, Guardian of the Lost

Death Company Dreadnought: 135 pts
Blood talon with built-in heavy flamer, blood talon with built-in meltagun, smoke launchers

Dedicated Transport: Drop Pod with locator beacon: 45 pts

Death Company Dreadnought: 135 pts
Blood talon with built-in heavy flamer, blood talon with built-in meltagun, smoke launchers

Dedicated Transport: Drop Pod with locator beacon: 45 pts

Total: 2000 pts

Was thinking that this army would get into the fray quickly and be nasty in close combat. I'm relying on deploying far out, moving full distance first turn and attempting to charge. The Dreads would come in turn two (hopefully) behind enemy lines to wreck some havoc there. Two biggest concerns: lack of firepower and having to deal with flyers. Thoughts? Tips? Comments?

Thanks,

-sad
 

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Son of LO
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Thanks for the reply! Yea, the more I look into drop pods the more alluring they're becoming. I've also been reading that you can technically drop an entire army (units inside of transports that must be held in reserve only count as one unit). However, my main concern is dealing with flyers. My buddies tell me that Guard have much better AA, but I'm wondering if maybe I should take a Whirlwind Hyperios to deal with flyers. Is it worth it to factor in some AA to this list?

-sad
The Storm Raven is arguable the best all round flyer in the game. With PoMS, it can pop two flyers at once conditions permitting, while carrying a heavy cargo. The Valkyrie is just a better anti-flyer option due to it's 3 lascannons.
 

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There's no need to list a unit's standard equipment. Just the upgrades.

Why are you bringing Priests? Their buffs are hardwired into DC and you've got Chaplains to take challenges. I'd drop them for a higher bodycount even if Corbulo is a CC beast.

I had wanted to use a full drop pod army that specialized in CC
There's an article on Drop lists in the Tactics forum you could read. For now, there's no such thing as a Drop list that specializes in CC. Podded units will NEVER get a charge unless the enemy allows it. Your DeathCo wouldn't benefit from either Furious Charge or their Chaplains. You can do tiny DC squads in Pods, to employ plasma/infernus pistols, but don't think for a second the enemy will let a Podded DC squad do one of those super-buffed charges.

The Dreadnoughts can keep the Pods, though. I think grapples will be more useful than heavy flamers here. What your DeathCo need more than anything is to break the enemy's transports early, so your charges won't be wasted on armor.


There are two ways to do a good DC list: Land Raiders and Storm Ravens. Both get your DeathCo around quickly, practically guarantee you'll get those super-buffed charges and provide the support firepower any CC-oriented list depends upon.
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
Why are you bringing Priests? Their buffs are hardwired into DC and you've got Chaplains to take challenges. I'd drop them for a higher bodycount even if Corbulo is a CC beast.
You're right, I realized that late last night when I was reading over stats and I was just like, "wait, why am I bringing these guys?" So they've been dropped in order to spend points elsewhere. I'm debating keeping Corbulo however. At first he seems like a point sink, but he has a 3+ save, a 2+ save on top of that (thanks to Fell No Pain), and as an independent character he also gets a Look Out, Sir! save. So as long as you keep him in front of a unit, its going to take a lot of shots to take this guy down. I figure just for that alone he should be worth it, but he also has far-seeing eye, which I think has the potential to be priceless. Put him with a Chaplain/Lemartes/Astorath and some DC, and that means the whole unit re-rolls all their hits and wounds on assaults (which they'll mainly be doing), and it gives the Chaplain/Lemartes/Astorath an FnP save. Thoughts?

There's an article on Drop lists in the Tactics forum you could read. For now, there's no such thing as a Drop list that specializes in CC. Podded units will NEVER get a charge unless the enemy allows it. Your DeathCo wouldn't benefit from either Furious Charge or their Chaplains. You can do tiny DC squads in Pods, to employ plasma/infernus pistols, but don't think for a second the enemy will let a Podded DC squad do one of those super-buffed charges.

The Dreadnoughts can keep the Pods, though. I think grapples will be more useful than heavy flamers here. What your DeathCo need more than anything is to break the enemy's transports early, so your charges won't be wasted on armor.
Also something I've become aware of these past few days. Not being able to assault kills the Drop Pods for me. The only use I could think of would either be: dropping DC firing squads down to punch a hole for storm ravens/later pods, or dropping dreads in later in the game near enemy armor and magna-grappling tanks (trying to tank shock as many units as possible) and putting the tanks in range of assault next turn.

There are two ways to do a good DC list: Land Raiders and Storm Ravens. Both get your DeathCo around quickly, practically guarantee you'll get those super-buffed charges and provide the support firepower any CC-oriented list depends upon.
I'm leaning more towards stormravens because they seem more maneuverable, have greater capacity, and are pretty even otherwise with stats and points with LRs. The only issue is that they can't start on the board, and from what I've read you basically need 2 geared towards the same goal so that you can guarantee 1 makes it to its mark. So 2 stormravens loaded up with CC specialists and Dreads, that's easy enough (probably around 1100 pts right there, with no upgrades on the DC). Now I need something to start on the field. Since the real benefit of DC is CC, obviously shooting units aren't really what I should be spending points on.

So, we need good CC that can start on the board and won't soak up a ton of points. They need to be fast, so jump packs/transport are almost a necessity, but they're crazy expensive (jump packs and LRs that is), or not strong enough (I'm looking at your Rhinos). So what do we do?

I was debating going another way, straying a bit from the All DC, and using a buffed up Honor Guard (more shooty than assault), Astorath and Corbulo, along with a terminator squad in Drop Pods landing close enough to the enemy to unload on them and have Astorath close to assault range, but then when I think of this I just wonder, why wouldn't I just take a better, more cost efficient HQ, only have one unit of DC in a storm raven, and make a regular BA army?

TL;DR: Here are the issues I keep running into:
-DC are best in CC, so we need to get them close to the enemy, quickly and relatively unharmed. Conventional means just don't seem fast enough (even with jump packs and great rolls, you only might be able to assault turn 1). Drop Pods don't let you assault, LR aren't really THAT fast and storm ravens just seem like the better choice overall). But storm ravens can't come in turn 1, so that means you need to have a decent force on the ground, and whoever is on the ground needs to (1) last until the next turn, and (2) kill off enough things that the SRs aren't facing an entire army of guns when they do arrive.
-DC are incredibly costly, so even a 2000 pt army is only going to be a few models, and every IC or transport you have it taking valuable points away from troop count.
-Astorath is not cost efficient

I appreciate the comment Intrepid, any thoughts about how to get around these problems? You mentioned SRs and LRs, but I don't think they can be run together in a cost efficient manner (even if you get two land raiders with troops on the field turn 1 while you're waiting for SRs, what do you do? The entire enemy army can aim their fire at those two units. So do you just hide until the SRs arrive?

Thanks in advance,

-sad
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
Moved to the lists subsection, carry on.
Thanks pilot00!

EDIT: Updated List is below. C&C is welcome.

HQ

Astorath the Grim: 220 pts
Executioner's Axe, bolt pistol, jump pack, frag and krak grenades, rosarius.

Elites

Brother Corbulo: 105 pts
Heaven's Teeth, bolt pistol, frag and krak grenades, The Red Grail

Furioso Dreqdnought: 190
Frag Cannon, blood fist with multi-melta, magma grapple, extra armor

Dedicated Transport: Drop Pod

Furioso Dreqdnought: 190
Frag Cannon, blood fist with multi-melta, magma grapple, extra armor

Dedicated Transport: Drop Pod

Troops

9 Death Company: 230 pts
1 Death Company with chainsword and plasma pistol
8 Death Company with Boltguns and chainswords

Dedicated Transport: Drop Pod (Brother Corbulo will be joining this unit)

8 Death Company: 495 pts
1 Death Company with chainsword and infernus pistol
7 Death Company with power weapons and bolt pistols

Dedicated Transport: Storm Raven "A" (Astorath will be joining this unit)

Death Company Dreadnought: 135 pts
Blood talon with built-in heavy flamer, blood talon with built-in meltagun, smoke launchers

Dedicated Transport: Storm Raven "A"

5 Death Company: 255 pts
2 Death Company with chainsword and bolt pistol
3 Death Company with power weapons and bolt pistols
All have jump packs

Dedicated Transport: Drop Pod

Death Company Dreadnought: 170 pts
Blood talon with built-in heavy flamer, blood talon with built-in meltagun, smoke launchers

Dedicated Transport: Drop Pod

Total: 1990 pts

Basically Drop Pod waves. 1st wave is the 2 Furiosos and the 9 DC with Corbulo (he eats up wounds for breakfast).

They clear enough space/do as much damage as they can while we hope the reserves come in turn 2. Storm raven aims to harass/tank hunt after it gets the DC + Astorath to the front, and that DC Dread into some CC. Second round of drop pods basically either (1) reinforce the first group if necessary, or (2) aim to take out split off groups that might be claiming objectives.

Thoughts?
 

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The Storm Raven is arguable the best all round flyer in the game. With PoMS, it can pop two flyers at once conditions permitting, while carrying a heavy cargo. The Valkyrie is just a better anti-flyer option due to it's 3 lascannons.
Don't forget to mention that the Vendetta is nearly half the price.
 

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A DC list still needs the Raven's additional functions, however.

Speaking of which, for a 2,000 point list I wouldn't rely on a single Storm Raven. You can count on the enemy having at least reasonable antiair defences at this size. What do you think about having both a Land Raider and a Storm Raven? The LR will give you a stronger ground presence than two Podded Dreads. Going with two SRs would also be acceptable...maybe one with Lemartes and the other with Astro?

If you're set on using Corbulo then I would give him a regular ASM squad to run with. While pure-DC is fun, the ability to hold an objective will be essential for long-term enjoyment of your new army. Corbulo will actually be better protected this way because ASM squads have a sergeant that can take a challenge on Corbulo's behalf. (Deathco have no sergeants except Lemartes.) You'll also save a few points in the process. Besides, somebody needs to keep an eye on those crazy death ninjas, right?

Typos: Storm Ravens aren't dedicated transports. That third DC squad can't have both jump packs and a Pod.

...it gives the Chaplain/Lemartes/Astorath an FnP save.
Lemartes already has FNP. The others, I've found, have a strong tendency to be instakilled in challenges. Either that or their inv. saves get them through the day.
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
Besides, somebody needs to keep an eye on those crazy death ninjas, right?
I love the fact that they are "death ninjas," because calling them just 'ninjas' doesn't quite relay enough suicidal rage!

Okay, so I've again revised the list taking some comments I've received from you guys and a few other commenters elsewhere, and I've come up with two lists (one with Corbulo and one stormraven, and one without and two stormravens). It seems that no matter who I talk to, half the people think Corbulo is useless and the other half think he's essential, half the people think one stormraven will get the job done while the other half swear that you can't field less than two if you want to succeed.

Well, either way I'm posting the two lists below. Feel free to comment if you see anything out of place, or small changes that could make improvements, but I think I'm going to just have to get these bad boys on the board and see how they play. I'm leaning more towards the list with Corbulo, simply because that list has Corbulo in the first wave, 7 more troops on the ground, and an extra Dread.

Here we go:

(With Corbulo and 1 Stormraven)

HQ

Astorath the Grim (220pts)

Elites

Brother Corbulo (105pts)

Furioso Librarian: searchlight; dedicated transport, drop pod (211 pts)

Furioso Librarian: searchlight; dedicated transport, drop pod (211 pts)

Troops

Unit 1 - 9 Death Company: All with boltguns; dedicated transport, drop pod (215 pts)
Unit 2 - 10 Death Company: 2 infernus pistols, 2 power fists; (280 pts)
Unit 3 - 10 Death Company: All with boltguns; dedicated transport, drop pod (215 pts)
Unit 4 - DC Dread: Blood talons, meltagun and heavy flamer, searchlight (136 pts)
Unit 5 - DC Dread: Blood talons, meltagun and heavy flamer, searchlight; dedicated transport, drop pod (171 pts)

Heavy Support

Stormraven: TL multi-melta, TL assault cannon, extra armor, searchlight (216 pts)

Total: 2000 pts

The strategy with this list would be to land Unit 1 (with Corbulo) and the two Furioso's first. The Furioso's concentrate on trying to achieve two of the following powers (hopefully different ones!): Divination 2 (Forewarning), 3 (Misfortune), 5 (Precognition), 6 (Scrier's Gaze), or Telepathy 3 (Puppet Master), 6 (Hallucination). I tried to only pick powers that I thought the Primaris power wouldn't be a bad alternative. The Furioso's job is to (1) do some damage, and (2) help keep Corbulo and the 1st wave DC alive. The 1st wave DC are there just to do some damage, with Corbulo soaking up a huge number of wounds.
Unit 2 and Astorath, along with Unit 4 arrive by Stormraven, and are carted into close combat wherever they can do the most damage. Unit 3 and Unit 5 face similar uses: drop wherever they can do the most damage, or back up the first wave units (if they're still kicking about).

(Without Corbulo, and 2 Stormravens)

HQ - SAME, but with dedicated transport, drop pod (255 pts)

Elites

Chaplain: Has jump pack (125pts)

Furioso Librarian: dedicated transport, drop pod (210 pts)

Furioso Dreadnought: Blood fist with heavy flamer, frag cannon, magna grapple; dedicated transport, drop pod (185 pts)

Troops

Unit 1 - 9 Death Company: All with boltguns; dedicated transport, drop pod (215 pts)
Unit 2 - 9 Death Company: 2 infernus pistols, 1 power fists, 1 hand flamer (245 pts)
Unit 3 - 4 Death Company: 1 with power fist; all have jump packs (135 pts)
Unit 4 - DC Dread: Blood talons, meltagun and heavy flamer; dedicated transport, drop pod (170 pts)

Heavy Support

Stormraven: TL multi-melta, TL assault cannon, extra armor (215 pts)
Stormraven: TL multi-melta, TL assault cannon, extra armor (215 pts)


Total: 2000 pts

The strategy for this bunch is similar to the last group, however has a few distinct characteristics. To get it out of the way, the first wave is still Unit 1 and the two Furiosos, even without Corbulo it preforms the same function, but is most certainly going to lose more troops.
Second turn hopefully brings the rest of the force. Here's the thing, I'm only using the three drop pods from the first wave. The other two, although dedicated transports, will not be docked by troops. Instead they will be aboard the two storm ravens (1 carrying 9 DC and Astorath, the other carrying 4 DC with jump packs, the Chaplain, and the DC Dread). These either get to CC as quickly as possible or go to wipe out split off units. The storm ravens will be tank hunters/extra firepower if they survive delivering their loads.

The interesting thing about these two empty drop pods is their versatility. Even empty, I can use the to block off roads, distract enemies, and if I'm feeling particularly cheesy, operate an enemy's fortification (more specifically the aegis defense line + turret).

Well, that's all I have folks. Thoughts? Comments? Criticisms?

Thanks again,

-sad
 
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