[Duchat]

I've been playing CSM for a year now, however I bought my first squad of metal thousand suns SEVERAL years ago, I believe just as 3rd edition codex came out. I never played the previous codex, so I don't have anything to compare the current version; until now. I have been reading the last codex just for fun because I have a word bearers army, which is just a generic CSM army now. I wanted to see what my army USED to be like. Well, now I feel like I got to the candy store and it was closed.

These days a good CSM army has a Lash DP, troops, oblits and defilers. I respect that this forum has some highly creative strategists with some fantastic ideas, thanks everyone, and that our current codex has been a respectable book. Unfortunately these days you really can tailor an army to take out CSM's, while in the old list, you couldn't predict what kind of CSM army you were facing. Every chaos god had a totally different tactic and strategy, and all the original heresy armies were tailored differently as well. I can still make a Word Bearers army with a Dark Apostle Crozius if you play the numbers right, but I used to have every Daemon in the arsenal. Now all daemons are either greater or lesser,

What do you miss about the last Codex?

 

[Mad Cat]

If you take a look in the Rules Development forum Doomlord has started a Chaos Legion codex thread.

http://www.librarium-online.com/forums/rules-development/181954-legion-chaos-codexes.html

We are currently working through rules to recreate the 8 chaos legions and update their unique rules in line with the new CSM and Chaos Daemon codexes. At the moment we have rules for the 4 cult legions and the Iron warriors and night lords. Alpha legion and word bearers rules should be up shortly when I get them typed up.

 

[Nhyx]

I miss all the upgrades you could give troops and vehicles
I also have around 100 cultists for my alpha legion army :-/

 

[thenewKhan]

I miss the individuality with lists. And with that individuality, it still worked. I can't make a very individual army anymore. A lot of the units in the new dex are basically "bad" or "good". Take fast attack for example. In theory, bikes and raptors COULD be good. But in actual game play, they tend to lack what they are supposed to excel at. And other units can do basically the same thing, but are cheaper and less threatening to other players simply because of how they look.

I just can't seem to get my World Eaters list to feel the same... I can't fully dedicate my lord like I could, I can't get the same feel out of anything. Granted, I do like being able to use Raptors in the list, but they don't get used often because... Heck, you guys know about raptors...

I must admit, as terrible as it was to see romping around the board, I miss the Slaaneshi-Siren DP... I miss Land Raiders with Fire Control. I miss individual Daemon types. I miss Oblits with a unit cap. I miss seeing them goofy lil Nurglings running around the feet of defilers and Daemon Princes from time to time. Dedicated vehicles (The Slaaneshi dreads that would make opponents like -3 or -4 LD when in base contact kinda stuff...)

I MISS DREADNOUGHTS ONLY SHOOTING ME IF IT WAS MY FAULT FOR NOT HAVING ENEMYS WITHIN RANGE, NOT BECAUSE I WAS .000001% OF AN INCH CLOSER!


I miss the legions. I miss Abbadon not getting negative marks against him because Drach'nyen. I miss the massive choice of equipment and daemonic gifts Independent characters could get (and how beastly a Lord could be with the simple additive of 150pts of stuff...haha) Individual Princes (Yes, to the new players, Lash princes have not been all the rave since chaos was made) I miss the times when the red corsairs were only briefly mentioned in the big yellow dex[the one before the one we are talking about])




Don't get me wrong, I do like the new dex. But its just much more like I am playing spiky marines than it used to be. There isn't nearly as much individuality between lists. All lists now days seem to have lash prince, marines in rhinos, and oblits.

 

[Nhyx]

I miss being able to model arms and legs and faces and saws and spikes and bodies on my vehicles, and it actually DOING SOMETHING in the game. Not just looking awesome!

 

[hotspike18]

I miss the individuality with lists. And with that individuality, it still worked. I can't make a very individual army anymore. A lot of the units in the new dex are basically "bad" or "good". Take fast attack for example. In theory, bikes and raptors COULD be good. But in actual game play, they tend to lack what they are supposed to excel at. And other units can do basically the same thing, but are cheaper and less threatening to other players simply because of how they look.

I just can't seem to get my World Eaters list to feel the same... I can't fully dedicate my lord like I could, I can't get the same feel out of anything. Granted, I do like being able to use Raptors in the list, but they don't get used often because... Heck, you guys know about raptors...

I must admit, as terrible as it was to see romping around the board, I miss the Slaaneshi-Siren DP... I miss Land Raiders with Fire Control. I miss individual Daemon types. I miss Oblits with a unit cap. I miss seeing them goofy lil Nurglings running around the feet of defilers and Daemon Princes from time to time. Dedicated vehicles (The Slaaneshi dreads that would make opponents like -3 or -4 LD when in base contact kinda stuff...)

I MISS DREADNOUGHTS ONLY SHOOTING ME IF IT WAS MY FAULT FOR NOT HAVING ENEMYS WITHIN RANGE, NOT BECAUSE I WAS .000001% OF AN INCH CLOSER!


I miss the legions. I miss Abbadon not getting negative marks against him because Drach'nyen. I miss the massive choice of equipment and daemonic gifts Independent characters could get (and how beastly a Lord could be with the simple additive of 150pts of stuff...haha) Individual Princes (Yes, to the new players, Lash princes have not been all the rave since chaos was made) I miss the times when the red corsairs were only briefly mentioned in the big yellow dex[the one before the one we are talking about])




Don't get me wrong, I do like the new dex. But its just much more like I am playing spiky marines than it used to be. There isn't nearly as much individuality between lists. All lists now days seem to have lash prince, marines in rhinos, and oblits.

I hear ya dude. I miss the old dex as well. I've been sort of window shopping the last few months for a new army to play, I'm kind of bored with Chaos.

 

[thenewKhan]

I hear ya dude. I miss the old dex as well. I've been sort of window shopping the last few months for a new army to play, I'm kind of bored with Chaos.

As far as I can tell, the newest Space Marine dex has more potential to make more radical lists and work... They at-least have the leaders who can drastically alter the lists play styles. We don't have leaders that do that, or even our old lists.


Just seems like we cannot tailor our armies to our own unique feels of how to play the CSMs... Weren't Space Marines supposed to be the more boring list?

 

[Doomlord]

I miss the ols dex so much. *cries: come back good o'l lord taloring and litunants*. Something that makes me angry, is peoples that think that we only want is back pecause of the legions. Okay the of course we want the legions, but i want also to be abel to play a pure dedicated army, and still be competetive. That is what i miss the moast.

 

[Mars]

I miss 2nd Ed. Chaos. Daemon Princes were only special characters, no oblits, heaps of customization and smaller more tactical games.

 

[Mad Cat]

I see your 2nd edition Chaos codex and raise you 'Realm of chaos - Lost and the Damned'.

Oh how I miss 85 points for one plague bearer and the ability to take the 'Uncontrolable Flatulence' chaos upgrade.

 

[Nhyx]

I see your 2nd edition Chaos codex and raise you 'Realm of chaos - Lost and the Damned'.

Oh how I miss 85 points for one plague bearer and the ability to take the 'Uncontrolable Flatulence' chaos upgrade.

How about greater demons with 10's across the board?

 

[The_Outsider]

I miss the infiltrating speed lord.

Oh wait, no I don't.

What I do miss was marked units as opposed to icons (though I do support icons for summoning purpsoes). I wouldn't change the effects that we have now (that way berzerkers stay awesome without the csm massively encroaching on thier ability).

 

[Typhoon Jetson]

I played Tau during the time of third ed. Chaos, but i have been subverted into the service of the Chaos Gawds since then.

I really miss the individual daemons, the vanilla "lesser" and "greater" just dont do it for me. Al tho, I dont miss the Super Daemon Prince-lord that could rip apart the entire opposing force on his own. Those were a little OP.

I also miss the Nurgling-infested hull upgrade. I dont know why, but i always thought it was a cool thing.

 

[Doomlord]

I played Tau during the time of third ed. Chaos, but i have been subverted into the service of the Chaos Gawds since then.

I really miss the individual daemons, the vanilla "lesser" and "greater" just dont do it for me. Al tho, I dont miss the Super Daemon Prince-lord that could rip apart the entire opposing force on his own. Those were a little OP.

I also miss the Nurgling-infested hull upgrade. I dont know why, but i always thought it was a cool thing.

you also must remmember that HE was the most part of your army annyway

 

[Typhoon Jetson]

You have to understand that i was complaining aboot the super-lord from the position of an opponent.

It was disheartening when the opponents DP used your railhead as a club to pummel your troops with

 

[Doomlord]

Yea that i must agree whit, but if he DID mannage (something that rarely happened) to take the DP down then you was as good as dead.

 

[THELuc]

me too miss it big time

me too miss the old 3rd ed on big time

in any case just to have to wait till an other and hope for better than this one