[Morfius]

I haven't seen this guy in many army lists, nor much discussion on him. What is the general consensus? I think he looks pretty sweet. His rules are pretty competative and he has an awesome name, plus the model is really nice.

I guess people don't like the stupidity aspect and he would certainly be more worth it if he could pass his stubborn onto the unit he joins, as he does his walk through terrain rules.

I plan to put him with my chosen so they can wander through the woods and avoid incoming enemy fire, then probably steed of shadows him into an enemy unit in turn 2-3 (he can hack away, his stubborn will protect him from running and his regen from dying).

I also like the LD10, he's the only other guy in our army besides Archaon with that as far as I can see. Let me know what you think!

 

[DraagDarkfire]

The thing is that over here there arent many fans of special characters. Plus as you might have noticed the most famous lists are those made of all cavalry or magic heavy lists in which he wouldn't obviously fit.

Sigvald is too slow to effectively get in combat. Now the idea of having him flying around with steed of shadows is very good but still you need a lot of magic in order to successfully cats it, as there will be few players stupid enough to leave such a character fly into their units.

As for using him to protect your Chosen from shooting, you could protect them at far cheaper price by giving them mark of Tzeentch and a blasted standard (thats a 4+ ward against shooting).



Red text edited after i was chastised by Rork.

 

[Rork]

I think you'll find people will just end up avoiding his unit. Stubborn ld10 (and ItP if you go Slaanesh) just isn't pleasant to face, and combined with the fact he's infantry means that most opponents will send their hammers elsewhere.

Your tricks might work for one game, then your opponents will be wise to it. After that your opponent will know what he has to stop.

Ironically, Sigvald is almost too good.

And Draag, no textspeak please. It doesn't take that long to type a word out fully.

 

[Mal]

I've only seen him used in one game locally, as few people like with special characters around these parts, he did very well once he got into combat. He didn't fail his stupidity test during the, but he had to travel on foot which stuck me as inefficient. It is a sweet looking model and he is a great character assassin.

Good luck with your stratagem.

 

[Morfius]

He doesn't pass on his Stubborn to the unit though does he? I thought if the unit had Stubborn then it gave it to any characters who joined it (obviously still testing on its own leadership though) but characters couldn't give it to the unit they joined. In Sigvald's rules it only specifies that his terrain ignoring abilities are passed onto his unit.

I just thoughtl, upon having a gander through the book, the two main strengths I could pick out were the knights and the special characters! Since I would like to take WOC to UK GT 2010 then it'd be silly to not use its strengths.

He's also not that hard in my opinion. A dwarf Lord would smash him up real good. He's T5 with a horrible armour save so Sigvald won't kill him. Then he'll hit poor Siggy with a massive flaming weapon that ignores armour saves and wounds him easily (being only T4). And I think if Sigvald came up against a normal Chaos Lord he wouldn't like it very much either! I was also thinking of using him to assassinate Skaven characters. They're so weak and his regen and stubborn will protect him, you could steed of shadows him into a large rat unit, slay the seer and then he can sit there and wait for back up!

 

[Nighty]

If a character is into a unit then the unit can use his leadership... if the character is stuborn then he never modifies his ld so
the unit can use his unmodified ld to check. In other words if a stubborn character joins a unit then the unit becomes stubborn.

I don't find sigvald that great... but it could fit great into a unit of warriors.. thinking in a big unit of warriors, you can combine the high armor save, the T4, and mark of tzencht with blasted standard to get a nearly invulnerable unit vs ranged, sigvald can wipe out frontals and the unit will stay almost always... still i find him slow...

 

[Enigmatik1]

It's a sad day.

Unfortunately, however, any character on foot will be viewed much the same way unless he's a Wizard. Combat characters on foot seem to be big no-no's in today's land of Hero-, Monster-, Cavalry-Hammer.

I'm with the OP. I love the idea/model behind Sigvald and he'd probably be really good if you were facing an opposing force that's heavy on the infantry. But who runs those anymore? :\

 

[Morfius]

Hmm, but I would suggest that Sigvald isn't necessarily a 'combat' character. His two most useful aspects are his ASF (especially against HE) and his move through cover rules which can essentially make a big unit of Chosen or Warriors much more mobile. It does seem that the most popular WOC armies around at the moment are all or mostly cavalry armies. But I've put together a more balanced list (with a unit of knights and horses in + some dogs) which I'm hoping will proved effective. Sigvald in a unit of Chosen with great weapons is very handy as he can strike first and deal some damage to the front rank of an enemy unit, then the chosen will be protected and there will be more to strike(when they go last).

On a similar not to my stubborn question, how does the whole mark system work when mixing characters and units with different marks together? For example, if a character with the mark of nurgle joins a unit with the mark of slaanesh. Is unit both immune to fear and terror and panic AND enemies will have -1 to BS when shooting at them? (obviously they'd only have -1 WS if they actually directed attacks agains the character himself...that seems clear).

 

[Nighty]

they only get the -1 to BS when aiming the character, so if the shoot is aimed at the unit they won't get it... in other words if a character with mark of nurgle joins a unit without it and an enemy unit shot at it, they won't get the -1 BS

 

[Enigmatik1]

Hmm, but I would suggest that Sigvald isn't necessarily a 'combat' character. His two most useful aspects are his ASF (especially against HE) and his move through cover rules which can essentially make a big unit of Chosen or Warriors much more mobile. It does seem that the most popular WOC armies around at the moment are all or mostly cavalry armies. But I've put together a more balanced list (with a unit of knights and horses in + some dogs) which I'm hoping will proved effective. Sigvald in a unit of Chosen with great weapons is very handy as he can strike first and deal some damage to the front rank of an enemy unit, then the chosen will be protected and there will be more to strike(when they go last).

Fair enough. Keep in mind, that I have a modest interst in Warriors of Chaos (I run Tomb Kings as my primary army and probably always will). I haven't bitten the bullet and given in to the temptations of the Dark Prince...yet. At any rate, these are very good points. If I were going to run Sigvald, it'd definitely be in a unit of Chosen as well. My main problem with him is that I always envisioned my WoC army being led by a Daemon Prince (yes, I know they blow...I can't shake the concept from my head despite them being terribly overpriced).

I also considered him in a 20+ man unit of Slaaneshi Marauders given his fluff. I can't see Chosen holding his mirrors and tolerating his preening whereasin Marauders would be less inclined to defy him. :freaked-out:

 

[neobubblez]

tell me, what is the point of giving him stubborn if he doesn't confer it to his unit? Waste of text if you ask me.... But let's put that aside for now, even if the unit eats a charge, unless the ensuing challenge is with a character that has killing blow, you will find that he's very survivable, he has the same armor save as a knight with a regen save, and to boot, he's striking first, so you know even if he is facing killing blow, he's gonna get his 7 attacks at ws8 str5 to add to your combat res. I'll put it to you like this, the one time i used him for a themed event at GW, i had the unit of warriors around him get slaughtered by a flank and norm charge of ogres, he stood alone and even after locking up a challenge for 5 rounds of combat, he still ended up wiping out both units of ogres by himself, he more than made up his points in kills. However, for competitive play, i would recommend against using sigvald as most armies will be fielding some sort of killing blow to get rid of models like him in an instant. Best of luck to you!