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Hi guys n gals,

I currently field, in most 1500 and 2000 point games a 10-man squad of khornate raptors with 2 meltaguns and a power fist-armed champion. I wanted to know how to use/field them better, or whether I should use them at all, because I try to use them but they honestly get shot down/melted/incinerated/vaporised and generally steamrolled in every game that I use them in (I'm not saying that I do, just this unit).

Is chaos fast attack a joke? Am I better off fielding another small sqaud of terminators, along with a land raider.

On an unrelated note, I hope it isn't to arrogant to have a picture of Abaddon as my avatar, I just think he is a walking God!!! Trivial eh?
 

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Well after what it hear you can say that CSM's fast attack is a joke. i have acctualy only used bikes one time but newer used raptor for just the same reason that you just said, they get shooten down to fast. one idea would be to force your opponent to shoot another unit, some thing that can be very hard.

on the picture part: of course it is not my profile pic is of Sanguinus the primarch of the Blood angels. you are free to chose a profil pic of what ever you like :p
 

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That Which Has No Time
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I rarely see berzerkers or khornate raptors make it into close combat. Yes, they do get shot up. For a very obvious reason, though: because they would be absolutely devastating in the assault and few can afford letting that happen. These units will always be priority targets for ranged combat: assault the shooters and shoot the assaulters, some of the most basic tactical principles, nothing to wonder about.
Note that these units, though they may not fulfill their actual purpose, still benefit the army very well, because it means that other units are targeted less and will be able to fulfill their mission in return.

Raptors in general are vulnerable. They can tote those two meltas and move very quickly, which is very awesome. But they do not have mobile cover in form of a transport and they risk losing models when landing in and/or starting from area terrain, meaning they can often be easily targeted without protection.
If you want to use them think about running them up behind some rhinos and/or at least lose the icon of Khorne on them. They are good enough without it and it will undo that big red crosshair on their power armor to some extent. Maybe even consider giving them an icon of Nurgle as it greatly increases their survivability.

In the end, though, I recommend not using the raptors at all in a competitive setting. You are probably better off with some berzerkers in a land raider or another rhino squad or something like that. It is really hard to say, though, without knowing what else you have in your army list and what would thus be a good complement.
 

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The other Kind of Fluff
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Red Archer summed it up fairly well, although I will disagree with his Berzerker assessment (for a later discussion).

Raptors are not a unit that can be plugged into any army with great effect; they require a build that is somewhat customized towards their strong and weak points. You won't, for example, get away with inserting a raptor squad into a mechanized unit, as they become the obvious target for enemy infantry hunters.

On the other hand, custom lists designed around the raptor assault can actually be quite potent, especially in all-infantry builds that include havocs, chosen, flying lash sorcerers (great synergy with raptors), TS, Noise Marines, Plaguers.
 

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The only use I've found for Raptors is in busting melta torpedoes--those Rhinos/Chimeras whose passengers have maxed out on meltaguns. Jump pack close, hopefully kill the transport and then assault the contents. The theory is good but in practice it isn't exactly reliable. Everything else they do can be done better by other units.
 

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Murder
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Keep them out of line of sight? do you use tanks? I have a fully mechanised army and the enemy rarely see's my deamon prince, granted a full 10 man squad of flying bad-ass guys is harder to hide but maybe you need something more threatening to distract if you can't get them to the lines or hide them.
 

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I totally disagree. Ok, I am no tournament player but already had some games with CSM.

I think of a 5 men squad of raptors with 2 Meltaguns for 120 points. They are just a little more expensive than a termicide but I believe far more versatile.

I think you simply have to make new terrain when you have a problem to hide raptors.

Just imagine this squad to support some CSM when attacking. You can easily choose to go where support is needed.

And, most important, such a unit is a lot of fun to play. Simply nothing equals them and it gives a lot of variety!
 

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I totally disagree. Ok, I am no tournament player but already had some games with CSM.

I think of a 5 men squad of raptors with 2 Meltaguns for 120 points. They are just a little more expensive than a termicide but I believe far more versatile.

I think you simply have to make new terrain when you have a problem to hide raptors.

Just imagine this squad to support some CSM when attacking. You can easily choose to go where support is needed.

And, most important, such a unit is a lot of fun to play. Simply nothing equals them and it gives a lot of variety!
I use a similar unit in my Alpha Legion list. Their job is basically to deep strike in and bust up transports. In higher point games, I use another with dual flamers to help clear objectives.

Deep striking is fun!
 

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Hmmm, I've recent had to make a decent for a tank popping unit, it was either a unit of Raptors, or a unit of Chosen, I can see where the benefits of the movement of the raptors, but with chosen, there’s the joy that is being able to park your bum with 5 melta's next to a monolith, or something of that stature, makes chosen a better option as far as tank popping units are concerned in my honest opinion.

There's nothing worse that deep striking too soon, leaving your raptors a long way off the mark and only to be shot to high heaven before they get to where they are going.
 
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