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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
this will be my first army and im might be making some mistakes so any imput will be appreciated. i am a little worried at some one yelling "cheese" but yeah the army does have many exploitable weaknesses if they play me right.

Saim-Hann eldar

wild rider chief 65

4 rangers 76

4 rangers 76

4 rangers 76

vyper squadron 285
crystal targeting matrix
star cannon
t/l shuriken catapults

3 vyper squadron 285
crystal targeting matrix
star cannon
t/l shuriken catapults

3 vyper squadron 285
crystal targeting matrix
star cannon
t/l shuriken catapults

3 vyper squadron 285
crystal targeting matrix
star cannon
t/l shuriken catapults

2 vyper squadron 190
crystal targeting matrix
bright lance
t/l shuriken catapults

2 vyper squadron 190
crystal targeting matrix
bright lance
t/l shuriken catapults

fire prism 180
crystal targeting matrix
halo-field
spirit stone
prism cannon
t/l shuriken catapults

1993

the idea will be to outmanouver the opponent and dance in and out of range and in and out of cover. but yeah the main weaknesses seem to be that bolters can glance me and any heavy weapons will really hurt. any other info or suggestions would be helpfull
 

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It seems to be a good way to really disorientate them with speed and power, if you really wanna screw them up get a Falcon with its pulse lasers and give it a starc cannon. But all in all it should do pretty good, the only thing to worry about are heavy weapons. use the vipers to destroy them.
 

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wow, I've never seen an all vyper saim-hann list, it looks pretty good. Have you tried bikes in the army?

I would really like to see the army in action, it would be pretty neat.
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
Im wondering if I should take a farseer or stick with the rider chief. at least the farseer might be able to augment the ranger squads. it should be a fun army to play. but yeah like i said im a lil worried people will yell cheese at me but its gotta be better then beil-tan with all 6 troops slots of reapers.

it must have cost a FORTUNE!
as for the cost i should be able to get the army for under $400 so really not that much for how much arse i should be able to kick. i did i double check through all the battles with this army in mind and aside from controlling bunkers (few infantry) it should be pretty easy. that and eldar have a strategy rating of 3
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
okay new idea apparently theres not usually enough cover for a squad of three vypers which makes the CTM rather useless. So this leaves me with two options ether drop the CTM from all the vypers and spend the points elsewhere or bring my own cover. for the second part does any one know if a wave serpent can provide decent cover for three vypers? i havnt seen any models for this to give a comparason.
 

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i wouldnt drop the matirx on all of them. have some guy in the back just thorwing shots out

u may want to drop the rangers (all of them) and have like 1 squad in the back firing and give all the other vypers, holo flieds and spriit stones.'

no point using wave serpent for jsut cover.
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
maybe i should have been a little more descriptive of what i wanted to do with the wave serpents Salamander. wave serpents also make great tank buster what with there twin linked bright lances. i can have them advance right up to the enemy taking out a few tanks here and there with a squad of vipers behind them. when the wave serpents finally do get thrashed (as i expect they will) i can have a far seer inside them who pops out to use guide on the jet bike squadron that was using the wave serpent for cover. thereby increasing the effectiveness of some of my vypers and allowing me to pop in and out of cover even if there isnt alot to start off with. but if wave serpents dont offer any decent cover then this tactic is kinda screwed. also can i use guide on a twin linked weapon (bright lances on the wave serpents). i seem to remember seeing some where in my travels that you can only reroll once to hit but im at work now and dont have my books.
 

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my khorne army would need lassos to fight you in hand to hand i think...

but yes people will yell cheese at you, thats alot of star cannons mate.
 

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actually thats a nice idea. it maybe alittle, well i dont wanna say waste but i will for lack of a btter word i liek the idea tho and i do think it will work. pm me and tell me how it works!
 

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The all Vypers is a huge weakness.

My suggestion, get at least 20 regular Jetbikes.

I would love to face this army with any marine army, your entire army save one tank is vulnerable to bolters.

That many starcannnons is also considered powergaming around here, getting some jetbikes would change that though.

thats alot of star cannons mate.

Agreed.

Thrawn

- semper fi -
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
okay look *sighs* yes star cannons are bad arse but my entire army has a BS of 3! I feel like the tau, a shooty army with a bs of three. its the only decently ranged weapon with a high rate of fire i could get. i like shooty so that means good range and the rate of fire is necessary becuase i can hit worth crap. now as far as i can see jet bikes dont seem to be good at hth or shooty. the howling banshees or striking scorpions would be a better choice for hth and how can a shooty army (im a very shooty person btw) only shoot 12" its just not right. not to mention the low model count and weak armor. I would think it would even out in the end even with the starcannons.
 

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Hmm I would disagree.

Starcannons are over powered.

Of course it would all end up back to starcannons, but where would the fun or variety come into play?

I'll be dead honest with you, if I ever brought that many Starcannons on to the field where I play I would be humilated and skinned alive. I take 2-4 In most lists.

The reason I said regular Jetbikes was cause...

a ) They're fluffier in a Saim Ham army
b ) There more resilant, you need to kill at the minimum three jetbikes before destroying a heavy weapon.
c ) You need more models in this army. An armoured company would stomp you.

BS 3 doenst matter when you have a total of 12+ Starcannons. Tau are off set by there pathetic intiative, strike just as fast as a genetically enhanced super-human.

:: shrug ::

Don't think I'm being critial, I'm just saying that this list is playing on all the loopholes in the Saim Han army list.

Thrawn
 

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Hoooo-leeeee crap.
That's some serious whooping!
However, If you face foes with alot of tanks or extremely high toughness, Starcannons tend to be a bit too str.6 for their own good. I'd consider replacing some Starcannons with Bright Lances (as they cost just as much).

However, this is an army I would fear to meet on the battlefield.
 

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Discussion Starter · #15 ·
I respect your opinion thrawn but personally dont feel an army is cheesey if it also has easily exploitable weaknesses. and as we can booth see this army has many. what i do feel is cheesy is where you say take several war walkers with the two star cannons and then have a unit of wraithguards and a warlock with conceal blocking LOS to the war walkers. that i feel is cheesey. no exploitable weaknesses and lots of power. now jet bikes (as ive heard) used to be fluffy for the Saim-hann army list but it seems that they completly dropped any mention of those in the new craftworld codex. now Saim-Hann seems to be somewhat like the chaos night lords (i think it is) where they just emphasis a speedy mobile army. but i will take all your words to heart and try to skim down on the star cannons. not becuase i feel the army is cheesey but becuase every one (even if i get my trash kicked by them) will yell cheese and i dont want to argue my point to every one. it would just get annoying. although i was trying to see if i could do an army of allmost completely fast moving vehicles. never have to make moral checks never have to make all on your own test, things like that. yeah ill redo the army list with less star cannons though (I think ill go with just two vyper units with star cannons).
 

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Discussion Starter · #16 ·
okay heres the modified army list and it should be able to work over more armies since it has more variety when it comes to weapon types.

farseer = 205
guide
runes of witnessing
ghost helm
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wave serpent = 125
t/l bright lances
_____________________________________
farseer = 205
guide
runes of witnessing
ghost helm
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wave serpent = 125
t/l bright lances
_____________________________________
5 dark reapers = 310
-------------------------------------
wave serpent = 125
t/l bright lances
_____________________________________
3 vyper squadron = 285
crystal targeting matrix
star cannon
t/l shuriken catapults
_____________________________________
3 vyper squadron = 285
crystal targeting matrix
star cannon
t/l shuriken catapults
_____________________________________
3 vyper squadron = 210
eldar missile launcher
t/l shuriken catapults
_____________________________________
3vyper squadron = 165
scatter laser
t/l shuriken catapults
_____________________________________
2 vyper squadron = 165
scatter laser
t/l shuriken catapults
_____________________________________
1830 pts

so heres how it should work. the dark reapers start out disembarked from the wave serpent and at a commanding point of the battle field. the two far seers start inside the wave serpents and making a wall with the dark reapers wave serpent. the advance with the starcannon and missile launcher vypers taking cover behind them. the other two units fo vypers speed up the flanks possible taking pot shots at the enemy on the way. the wall of wave serpents takes out as many tanks and vehicles as they can untill the crash and burn. then use the burned out hulks as cover for the advancing vypers. well there ya go. and another thing why do most tournaments use such an odd number like 1850 for point total?
 

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I reaally really like the second army better, you made it even more powerful while removing the element of discontent amongst most players.

Its also much more versatile and should be able to handle just about anything save really really big horde armies, but you seem to have your srats down and thats all it takes alittle strategy...and some finesse.
 

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Ok most likely you can catch a peek of your opponets army before you play him
so if hes playing a swarms army, then star cannons are like a little boy to michael jackson :unsure: and if you see the guy carring in 10 boxes then i would asure my thoughts to think hes playing tank company, then you load your vypers with britght lacnes and ctm around trees and crap to over come your victory
 

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I took my mostly vyper army against a white scars list a few weeks ago. Even though my bikes were mostly in terrain/hull-down, 7 out of 9 of my vypers were destroyed in turn 1 before I ever got a chance to use them. They were mostly killed by heavy bolters. How is that cheesy?

And, how are your farseers getting the wave serpent transports? I don't think they can take them. You'd have to put a guardian squad in a WS then have the farseer join them.
 

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Zeb mate, this is a dead thread that Hyper Vyper appears to have dug up for some reason, the entire discusion is near to a year old mate
 
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