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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Hi, I'm just slowly getting into back into 40k, and am new to 5th Ed so am wanting to check one rule that keeps vexing me. The rules clearly state that if you fire assault or pistol weapons at a unit, then want to charge in the assault phase you must charge that unit.

My first question is does that rule still apply if that unit is wiped out? (I know in 4th ed you couldn't shoot up a transport then assault the troops inside, same for 5th?) Or can you then charge another enemy unit.

And my second question is the same, but replace wiped out with fleeing.

Thanks for your help!
 

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You can never assault a unit that you did not shoot at.

This comes with 2 exceptions.

1- If you can get into combat with a second unit while also charging the first (a risky maneuver).

2- Shooting a transport and then assaulting the troops that make an emergency disembark.

Sucks, I know, but it just means that sometimes you have to not shoot to get that assault that needs to go off.
 

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The rule applies regardless. If you wipe out the unit you've shot, or it's out of range, then you cannot assault.

The only exception is as listed. If you destroy a transport, you can still charge a unit that is then forced to disembark.
 

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Dark Eldar Zealot
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This is interesting as you could well argue that if the target is eliminated in the shooting phase then there is no unit in existence that you shot at to carry out that rule and therefore no carry on effect in the game after elimination.

Now the way that I have played it in the past has been if the target is eliminated you can’t assault anything due to your only allowed to assault a now non -existent unit. (Having said that it now makes no sense to the way that I have been playing it.)

But there is another thread here on the rules forum that claims a similar effect with blasts scattering into close combat, that if the enemy is completely destroyed then you are free of any encumbrances and you can go on your merry way with the rest of your turn shooting who ever you wish – and yet here it’s the opposite.

An eliminated unit has an effect on the game with whom you can assault after shooting but an eliminated unit has NO effect on the game with whom you can fire at when in close combat.

I sense a double standard in play here.

Cheers.
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
But there is another thread here on the rules forum that claims a similar effect with blasts scattering into close combat, that if the enemy is completely destroyed then you are free of any encumbrances and you can go on your merry way with the rest of your turn shooting who ever you wish – and yet here it’s the opposite.

An eliminated unit has an effect on the game with whom you can assault after shooting but an eliminated unit has NO effect on the game with whom you can fire at when in close combat.

I sense a double standard in play here.
I'd just read that thread before I posted, it makes for interesting reading actually! It's good to know you can at least charge the passengers of vehicles you blow up, thanks for the clarification.

What gets me still is if I'm 12" away from 2 enemy units sitting next to each other having a tea party, if I don't shoot I can charge them both, but if I do and kill one I can't still charge the other. Just seems odd, that's all. :)

Thanks
 

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This is for the haters...
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I'd just read that thread before I posted, it makes for interesting reading actually! It's good to know you can at least charge the passengers of vehicles you blow up, thanks for the clarification.

What gets me still is if I'm 12" away from 2 enemy units sitting next to each other having a tea party, if I don't shoot I can charge them both, but if I do and kill one I can't still charge the other. Just seems odd, that's all. :)

Thanks
Well warhammer is suppose to represent a minute or two of an actual battle. So when you shoot and charge with the same unit, essentially you shooting at them while your running at them and essentially are in combat instantly after shooting at them. So if you shooting and they fall over you can't just change direction since you were already running at the enemy you shot at

makes sense?
 

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Dark Eldar Zealot
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Well warhammer is suppose to represent a minute or two of an actual battle. So when you shoot and charge with the same unit, essentially you shooting at them while your running at them and essentially are in combat instantly after shooting at them. So if you shooting and they fall over you can't just change direction since you were already running at the enemy you shot at

makes sense?
Well that’s the extracted meaning of ‘Rapid Fire Weapons’ from page 28 and since you may not assault the squad you shot at after using these weapons this makes no sense to me, sorry.

The shoot and assault the same squad rule I believe exists to devolve the game into separate skirmishes that are more easily digested and played out to completion.

Imagine lending fire to some far away unit and then assaulting your most immediate threat, it creates mayhem and confusion. The current system is much simpler and easier to understand.

Cheers.
 

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Scourge Lord
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Each player turn represents a few seconds of battle. GW has us assign each unit to a single target during that time. I believe this is to bring about more tactics in the game, since it becomes more like a game of chess this way. The other example actually sticks to this principle, because the unit that is suddenly "unlocked" during the shooting phase has yet to pick a target (they just didn't have a choice in who it would be until that moment).
 

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The ORIGINAL Sniper Puss
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The shoot and assault the same squad rule I believe exists to devolve the game into separate skirmishes that are more easily digested and played out to completion.

Imagine lending fire to some far away unit and then assaulting your most immediate threat, it creates mayhem and confusion. The current system is much simpler and easier to understand.

Cheers.
*Dreams of 3rd Ed and the fun he used to have with his Space Wolves*

*blinks*

Sorry, was caught up in fond memories there! Yes, the current system is a lot more straightforward....but the 3rd Ed one was great fun for annoying your opponent.

E.
 

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Firefly
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For the second part of the OP's post. If the unit you shoot fails it's morale check and is running, you can still assault it, as long as they are in range.
 

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The ORIGINAL Sniper Puss
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The particular rules for this latter situation can be found on P.46 BRB.

E.
 
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