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on the force organisation chart s the tervigon count as one troop choice with the termies or as a seperate troop slot? cheers
 

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Hive Fleet Pandora
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If you wanted to max out on the tervigons, you could go 5 tervis and 3 units of termies - that's 2 HQ terivgons and 3 troops.
 

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The Future
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If you wanted to max out on the tervigons, you could go 5 tervis and 3 units of termies - that's 2 HQ terivgons and 3 troops.
And on Wednesday, I'll have a good idea on how well that works! My mate is fielding 5 of them and 90 termigants for a 1250pt Planetstrike defence game.
 

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Hive Fleet Pandora
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Honestly, I don't think it'll do well at all. It's durable but doesn't really have any hard-hitting power. Mech up in rhinos or other transports and just move 6"+ when the MC's are nearby.
 

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Supreme Evil Overlord
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Just Tervigons and Termagants is a recipe for disaster as the first tank in sight will cause a lot of trouble for him.
 

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well if you give the tervi Aglands the termagaunts can glance to death almost every tank in the game barring monoliths, LRs, and some russes (or stun/immobilize them to allow the tervi to finish it off)

i would honestly drop the size of the broods on the field (as the tervi should make up their numbers with spawned gaunts) and bring a trygon they make excellent tank killers, are resilient, and will keep the heat off the tervies
 

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Im sorry but they just cant. Hormaguants, yes, termies with furious charge, no. 2 reasons for this.

1. The tanks can outspeed the termies quite happily, that or just plain reduce the numbers so that point 2 is even harder.

2. Lack of attacks, a squad of 20 can only put out 40 attacks, so if it moves 12" your never going to have enough it make it count. And for evey guant killed thats then harder and harder to do.

And speaking of the lith, in this list, there is Psycally nothing that can kill it off, so if there is one, or worse 2 youre powerless to do anything to them.
 

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if you are fielding 5 tervigons then 90 models is nothing. your spawning anyway between 15 to 270 gaunts a turn! and god help you if you want to paint that many models.
 

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if you are fielding 5 tervigons then 90 models is nothing. your spawning anyway between 15 to 270 gaunts a turn! and god help you if you want to paint that many models.
270 per turn? You realize, that would require 15 Tervigons, and every one would have to max out.

5 Tervigons will spawn at most 15 - 90 Gaunts per turn. But bare in mind that any Tervigon that spawns 16-18 Gaunts will not be able to spawn any more in subsequent turns.

Each Tervigon will spawn an average of 10.5 Gaunts for 2.25 game turns; or, each Tervigon will spawn an average of 23.625 Gaunts per game. With 5 Tervigons, that's 118 extra Termagaunts. Taking this into consideration.. 1/3 of your games will be Annihilation, and Tervigons offer easy KP.. the other 2/3 of the time your games will be Seize Ground and Take & Hold, and the multiple, small Gaunt broods will provide more targets to remove from Objectives.

Still.. Dropping 1 HQ and 1 Troop Tervigons, 1 Termagaunt Brood, and the other two Termagaunts back to 20x per brood will make room for a Flyrant and two Harpies w/ TL HVC, which will cover the holes left by the lists current lack of versatility.

As is, the current meta-game love mech and melta/plasma spam. Properly designed lists will be able to completely ignore Termagaunts, and systematically wipe out 5x Tervigons with relative ease (I'd estimate about 1.5 Tervs / turn, while suffering minimal casualties in exchange)
 

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The Future
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Honestly, I don't think it'll do well at all. It's durable but doesn't really have any hard-hitting power. Mech up in rhinos or other transports and just move 6"+ when the MC's are nearby.
If it wasn't Planetstrike, and it wasn't the game where the defender only has to hold one objective to win, I'd agree. However he can just put down a dozen bastions and use their automated guns to do the ranged stuff for him. As long as he holds the tervigons in reserve, he should do OK, as he'll hopefully have enough units to swarm one bastion to stop it being contested.

That being said I hope he does lose, because he's on the other team to me in our tournament and I don't want his team mate to have four bonus strategems in our game (another team mate already lost)
 

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Im sorry but they just cant. Hormaguants, yes, termies with furious charge, no. 2 reasons for this.

1. The tanks can outspeed the termies quite happily, that or just plain reduce the numbers so that point 2 is even harder.

2. Lack of attacks, a squad of 20 can only put out 40 attacks, so if it moves 12" your never going to have enough it make it count. And for evey guant killed thats then harder and harder to do.

And speaking of the lith, in this list, there is Psycally nothing that can kill it off, so if there is one, or worse 2 youre powerless to do anything to them.

first off both the hormagaunts and termagaunts need furious charge to glance a RAV 10 tank, which is alot easier/cheaper to give the termagaunts

second if the rhinos are just running away from gaunts how is he gonna get anything done, which is almost as good as actually killing them. as soon as the rhinos are getting hit from the gaunts there is no escaping them unless you run into cover (which is also good for you for that 16.6% chance to get immobilized)

its a trade off on what you want to achieve

Hormagaunts - twice the attacks and rerolls 1s to hit (16.6%)
Tervigon/termagant combo - an abundance of free gaunts, with Free adrenaline glands, with a 4+ FnP save just needs to stun or immobilize the vehicle for the tervigon to finish it off

I wouldn't run this list but it can be effective, especially in a low point planet strike game, since they will have to come to him

there's only 4 things that can deal with monoliths in the new nidz book
-Hive guard - glancing weeee!
-Zoans - 18 inch range
-Carnifexes - would get particle whipped to death before in charge range
-tyrannofex - widely considered a point sink but really good against only one unit in the game . . . the monolith

at 1250 if his opponent is bringing 2 monoliths he will only have 30 or so necrons. Phasing him out would be a better course of action
 

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first off both the hormagaunts and termagaunts need furious charge to glance a RAV 10 tank, which is alot easier/cheaper to give the termagaunts

second if the rhinos are just running away from gaunts how is he gonna get anything done, which is almost as good as actually killing them. as soon as the rhinos are getting hit from the gaunts there is no escaping them unless you run into cover (which is also good for you for that 16.6% chance to get immobilized)
Firstly im aware of the hormaguants S3, i just made the point for termies scince its far rarer that they have AG. Obviously in this case from the tervgion, but normally, its a rare sight.

And secondly, i never mentioned rhinos, if your using furious guants (either sort) to assault a transport, your doing it wrong most of the time. What you want to fire them at (and this was the case in 4th too) is tanks with 1 main weapon, eg vindicators, hammerheads, fire prisms ect. In the broad scheme of things, hormaguants are much better for this task than termaguants. Theyre faster, they get the re-rolls from the tallons, they have an extra attack, they dont form as much of a target as the guants do because of the lack of acompanying tervigon, they have the bonus all the time, as apposed to getting it from the tervigon, theyre a close combat unit so dont get killed as quickly by the support that turns up and they dont get backlash when the tervigon dies.

And your overestimating the tervigons capabilitys, as we recently discoverd in another thread, the tervigon gets on average 2-3 rolls a game before going caput (45% chance per roll) so its hardly an Abundance of frere guants.

Lastly if your giving feel no pain to some guants, its likley that youd be better off with it elsewhere, such as on an MC or some zoanthropes perhaps. The only time its really worth doing is on devourer guants.

So im afraid termies arnt nearly as capable as hormies in terms of destroying key elements of a vehicle.
 

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I think the fact that we can have this debate at ALL is testiment to the fact that the Tyranid Codex is FAAAR more flexible and will allow lots more playstyles than the earlier versions!

Happy me!

-Dragons
 

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Firstly im aware of the hormaguants S3, i just made the point for termies scince its far rarer that they have AG. Obviously in this case from the tervgion, but normally, its a rare sight.

And secondly, i never mentioned rhinos, if your using furious guants (either sort) to assault a transport, your doing it wrong most of the time. What you want to fire them at (and this was the case in 4th too) is tanks with 1 main weapon, eg vindicators, hammerheads, fire prisms ect. In the broad scheme of things, hormaguants are much better for this task than termaguants. Theyre faster, they get the re-rolls from the tallons, they have an extra attack, they dont form as much of a target as the guants do because of the lack of acompanying tervigon, they have the bonus all the time, as apposed to getting it from the tervigon, theyre a close combat unit so dont get killed as quickly by the support that turns up and they dont get backlash when the tervigon dies.

And your overestimating the tervigons capabilitys, as we recently discoverd in another thread, the tervigon gets on average 2-3 rolls a game before going caput (45% chance per roll) so its hardly an Abundance of frere guants.

Lastly if your giving feel no pain to some guants, its likley that youd be better off with it elsewhere, such as on an MC or some zoanthropes perhaps. The only time its really worth doing is on devourer guants.

So im afraid termies arnt nearly as capable as hormies in terms of destroying key elements of a vehicle.

im far from over estimating the capabilities of tervigon, every game you will get on average 22 free gaunts per tervigon. the tervi buys a small ugrade and those 22 free gaunts, plus the 10 you bought for that one tervigon all charge at STR 4. speed is not an issue since they will either be coming at you, or running away from you

and they can tear through marines thanks to counter-charge and toxin sacs

FnP is best used on gaunts over MC on all cases except Krak misslie spam and hellfire rounds; most guns pointed at MCs or zoans will be STR8+ AP2+

hormagaunst are good but i'd rather take the more resilient, shooting, and numerous termagant over it any day, they can just fill so many roles vs the single purpose hormagaunt

honestly i find it odd that you still want to entertain this debate since it is obliquely one sided as the tervigon itself does more damage to a RAV 10 vehicle
52 termagaunts + tervigon = .54 rolls on the glance table + .533 rolls on the pen table
Vs
30 hormagaunts = .74 rolls on the glance table

say lets throw in toxic sacs so they can handle the things that spill out
30 hormagaunts w/ toxic sacs and Aglands = 300 points

10 termagaunts w/ nothing + 22 spawned termagaunts + tervigon w/ catalyst, toxic sacs, a glands = 360 points

between the 2; hormagaunts will get +1 attacks, fleet/bounding leap, and rerolls on 1s. Teramgaunts will get 12" bolters, counter charge, a FnP save of 4+ (which is big since hormagaunts won't get armor saves from most guns), and more bodies/wounds so they can stick around longer
 

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Be wary that FNP doesn't work against AP1 and AP2 weapons, Power Weapons, Rending hits, attacks that inflict instant death, or any other attacks that ALWAYS deny armor saves. It does, however, greatly help against things like bolters and normal CC attacks.
 
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