[Tashin]

Hi everyone (this is my first post on these forums, so please bear with me if i make any stupid mistakes)

Im having some troubles against a friend of mine who plays WoodElves. We're usually playing 2000points, and we've played 4 times over the last months, of which i've had 3 draws and 1 lose - not a very positive statistic.

First of all we've playing at his place, which means that we're only using his terrain (which ofcause is only woods), so im always ad an disadvantage from the terrain point of view.

i've been trying different approaches considering my choice of units, but i always end up being stuck between forests, getting slammed by treesinging, and then violently flanked by his dryads - while my mainunits gets hammered by arrows from all sides.

Anyway he'll probably use Gladeguards, Wardancers, Waywatchers, Dryads and 1 treeman against me.

I was thinking of using (havnt used the last 100point yet):

Arch Lector w/ Meteoric iron, Sword of Rightous stell

Battle wizard (lvl 2) - fire w/ Doomfire Ring, Wizard staff

WP, mounted w/ Aldred's Casket of Sorcery, Sword of battle

24x Swordsmen, full command
9x free company
5x handgunners

25x Halberdiers, full command
10x free company

20x Flagellant warband

6x Knightly Orders, full command

6x Knightly Orders, full command

6x Pistoliers, musician

10x Huntsmen

1x Great Cannon

1x Helstorm Rocket Battery

This is a new list. Usually i never bring artillery (which probably is a mistake). I was hoping for a aggressive-defensive magicphase in order to passify his damned treesinging. On top of that im bringing in Pistoliers and huntsmen for the first time trying to counter his skirmishharrashment by harrashing him.

Anyway - i still dont really feel that my army has the punch yet. Its just blocks of weaklings really. Besides im really failing at realising what tactics are strong against the woodelves.

So please, if you can give me some advice on how to beat the hell out of woodelves or atleast comment/criticise my armylist.

- cheers

 

[ArchonFarseerGuy]

Welcome to LO! Always great to see new faces around these parts. If you need anything, poke me and I'll see what I can do.

Anyway, to your list and what I know about Woodies in general:
*The things are dangfangled quick. If he uses glade/wild riders, you'll need to take any chance to pop those units that you can get, as they can wreak lots of havoc among your army.
*A common trick is the bait-and-flee, in which a unit of glade riders will slap itself right in front of an infantry unit, forcing you to charge (in which case they'll flee and you'll only get a 4" movement in the direction they choose), move around them (placing them out of position) or simply ignore them, effectively forfeiting your movement. How to put them off is up to you, really. Pistoliers are legendary in epic proportions against Wood Elves, as they're quick, have a ton of shots that have little penalty to use and wound most things on a 3+. Meanwhile, most enemy units will be small and expensive. Likewise, if you can have a firebase to cover your unit's back, such as a volley gun or XBowmen on a hill, that can help, if only by putting your opponent off being too open with them.
*Ground control units can work fairly well. A helblaster volley gun effectively has a 24" 'zone of death' around it that opponents tend to veer from or be very cautious in, despite any brave talk they may put up.
*Their shooting will always be another major strength. I rate Wood Elves as the best shooting army out there, simply because they're reliable. Out-shooting them without some tips and tools is like trying to beat a South American team at football. It won't happen. To that end, XBowmen really come into their own as they can outright return fire or strike the first blow. Again, Pistoliers are excellent as they're quick and have lots of damage potential.
*Combats tend to be short and sharp. A Wood Elves general will tend to try and use their speed and manoeuvrability to place two or three units against one of yours, featuring at least one flank or rear charge. They will annihilate that unit, then move onto the next one. As such, I would be very tentative with my units. Maybe drop the halberdiers for more gadgets (as described later) and use the knights to tag-team with the infantry blocks, holding before looking to counter-charge the next turn. The longer the combat goes on, the more of his figures die and the more susceptible to CRes they become (incidentally, one of our major strengths in combat).
*This does leave waywatchers. While incredibly expensive, they can do a lot of damage, particularly to gunlines. They deploy in your zone behind an infantry block or somewhere and use their duel hand weapons to roll up units, if they're not marchblocking or sending accurate arrows into the back of a unit uncontested. However, they are very vulnerable to magic missiles, particularly ones that don't require much in the way of LoS (I'm looking at you, lore of death). Also, if you can get clever with deployment, that will tend to reduce their effectiveness. Slightly hold back and angle a unit of knights: they can catch up quickly and can push the unit's possible deployment zone back. Be tactical with your warmachine crews: as skirmishers, they'll reduce deployment options dramatically.

Hopefully that helps and isn't too outdated or anything .

To your list:
It looks alright, but not too focal in anything. I would make a few adjustments to it:

Arch Lector w/ Meteoric iron, Sword of Rightous stell

Battle wizard (lvl 2) - fire w/ Doomfire Ring, Wizard staff
Not bad. Doomfire Ring can be a bit hit or miss, but is generally alright. I'd also consider swapping out the staff for a Rod of Power, as it grants a lot of flexibility, and can enhance an attacking magic phase if the WEs don't have a lot to show for it.

WP, mounted w/ Aldred's Casket of Sorcery, Sword of battle
Not much use for the CoS to be perfectly honest. Drop that and give him an Icon of Magnus or Rod of Command. Psychology is an important part of a Wood Elves player's game, so if you can stave it off, it gives you a better chance to hold. I'd also give serious thought to dismounting him and slapping on a pair of hand weapons/GW/something else, freeing up your magic item allowance.

24x Swordsmen, full command
9x free company
5x handgunners
Change the ranged detachment to archers. An improved LoS will help a lot.

25x Halberdiers, full command
10x free company
Remove this lot. They're fairly expensive and will free up quite a few more points for other things.

20x Flagellant warband

6x Knightly Orders, full command
Drop the banners. They give away 100 VPs if lost and probably won't see much use if you'll be working with the infantry.

6x Knightly Orders, full command

6x Pistoliers, musician
Lovely unit. Take an Outrider with repeating pistols if you can find the points. Not a necessity though, just very nice to have.

10x Huntsmen
Drop these guys for XBowmen. If you get a hill, this unit should provide a nice firebase. They can go toe-to-toe with glade guard (range-wise) or take pot shots at fast cavalry silly enough to get in LoS, or something.

1x Great Cannon

1x Helstorm Rocket Battery

With the dropped unit of halberdiers, I'd chuck in a helblaster volley gun and a mortar. Maybe go for a steam tank if you're feeling particularly mean, as they can be fairly resistant. Bear in mind that if an opponent can place a few wounds on it, it will find its effectiveness reduced. Don't be afraid to compete in all phases, and if used tactically, some units can really enhance each other.

If you feel like surprising your opponent, go very magic-heavy (ie, drop the Lector for a Lvl4). Some lists I've made are so magic heavy, they'd get rejected by a large amount of tournaments around here. If you can pop the opposing wizard or two, you'll open the floodgates for spamming direct damage spells. Fireball, fiery blast, soul stealer (to a degree), creeping death and so on are all very effective at hurting WE units, as they tend to be small and fragile, yet hard to hit (mitigated by the magic).

Hope this helps .

 

[Tashin]

Awesome reply! thanks alot Archon.

Lets say i dismount my WP, where do you think would be appropriate spots to put my characters?

Also - considering the Rod of Power. I dont really get it. Lets say its been Woodelf magic phase. I've got 2 unused dice, he has 1 unused dice. So we both roll a dice. He scores 3, I score 4. I win, meaning that i get to put all the 3 dice in my rod.
Next magic phase is mine. My wizard, being lvl 2 with a max of 3 dices to use, is he able to use the 2 standard dice, his own 2 dice and the 3 dice from the Rod of Power?
Can you confirm this is how it works?

- Tash

 

[CmdrWrein]

Reading AFG's reply I thought of another possible way to combat the WE. While I hardly use them myself Outriders might make a good firebase with their 360 deg shooting LoS. The only big drawback I see is that you will have to be careful with them. They are expensive and only have T3 5+ sv. so easily shot by the WE arrows.

The Rod of Power works in the following way:
* In either your or his magic phase you are left with X dice.
* You tell your opponent you store Y dice in the Rod of Power, Y <= X and Y <= 3.
* The next magic phase (his or yours, respectively) you roll a D6.
-> If D6 >= Y you can keep the dice and any wizard in your army can use them.
-> If D6 < Y you discard the dice.

I use the item a lot to continuously store 2 dice to the next defensive magic phase.

Good luck against the WE.

 

[Tashin]

not a bad idea either. Im kinda in awe thinking about the fact that my 6 horsemen are able to deliver 18-20 shots in a single round of ranged combat. Thats just pure awesomeness
That being said im still a newbie at maneuvering my units, so im affraid i wont be up for the job controlling those guys. Anyway , i'll think about it Cmdrwrein. Thanks for your comment and thanks for explaining the Rod of Power to me

- Tash

 

[HighPlainDrifter]

Playing wood elves myself hopefully I can give you an insight into what kicks my ass.

MAGIC AND CR!
These are the main things WE players have to be careful of.


Magic:
Offensive WE magic lists are little to none. Most defensive magic focused lists will have 5-7 rerollable DD. While 7 rerollable dd is no laughing matter, he sacrifices all his characters and a lot of points to get it. If he doesn't go that route then he should have 1-2 scroll caddies or hes asking for trouble.

I would suggest going magic heavy against him.


CR:
Most WE units are skirmishers, thus no rank bonus. Empire is great at CR. This might surprise you, but this is how I would suggest taking out his Treeman. Stubborn can only go so far when you have ranks and both flanks. If you can get the Treeman away from his main force, try and grab him in combat with 25 swordsmen and 2 detachments. He'll be running off the table before you know it.

Don't underestimate CR against WE. Just be careful not to get flanked yourself.


Glade Guard:
36" s3 bows that become s4 when you are no longer at long range. Very dangerous to state troops, not so dangerous to knights. 6 knights should be able to take out a unit of 10 without taking a wound (unless the dice gods hate you)


Dyrads:
Most wood elves have no armor at all, the only save dryads get is a 5+ ward save, which is great except that it cannot be used against magical attacks. 1 or 2 magic missiles and the unit of dryads will be severely diminished (if he uses the regular 8 strong dryad unit). They are t4 so use your knights or Halberdiers to clean up the rest.


Wardancers:
KEEP YOUR KNIGHTS AND HEROES AWAY FROM THESE. If charged he will use the 4+ ward save dance and then switch to the killing blow dance and take out your knights and heroes easily. Focus the rocket battery on this unit if you can. They only have a 6+ ward save when not in combat. Either overwhelm them with CR or shoot them down until they no longer pose a threat. If you're not careful you could very easily lose an entire unit to these guys.


Waywatchers:
KEEP YOUR KNIGHTS AND HEROES AWAY FROM THESE. 5 bs and Lethal shot (long range killing blow) when not at long range. These guys are my favorite unit by far. I've taken out a unit of 6 knights before they could turn around and charge me. Not much good news for you with these guys other than they cost 24 points each and they are as fragile as the rest of his army.

Depending on what your willing to sacrifice to get them, you could rack up 240 points for taking them out. That's why hes going to try and protect them with everything he can. If you can get into combat with them you should be able to win by CR, but good luck getting into combat. 5" movement speed, 360 line of sight, and no modifier for moving and shooting. Sadly empire has no medium cavalry which is perfect for taking these guys down. You will probably lose a lot of whatever you throw at them. What I would suggest would be to stay in long range of these guys, that way they are only 5-10 bs archers with no killing blow. He will try and move them closer, and when he does smash them into elf mush.


Treeman:
Scariest dude on the battlefield. Hit him with cannonballs, hit him with fire attacks from your lore of fire wizard (hes flammable/x2 wounds), and if he is not dead by then CR him off the table. This one is going to come down to dice rolls more than any others. I've lost my whole WE force except for my treeman and hes taken out the remaining 500 points of my opponents army by himself. Don't underestimate him.


You should be fine if you use these strategies.
Sorry If I was vague on a few things, there was just too much to write about. Good luck.

 

[Tashin]

really really nice answers

I really feel alot more confident facing him (tho it'll have to wait another month due to xmas and all that jazz). Highplaindrifter, thanks for taking the time to write me a WE-walkthrough (and that a really great straightforward walkthrough).

Alright i've been reading (and listening to most of) what you guys have said, and my new setup has become alot more ranged-oriented than it was before. Anyway i thought i'd post it here. Again feel free to criticise/comment/yell at me

And thanks for the help everyone. Im really impressed with these forums - will definatly post a battle report when i get this game going down!

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Arch Lector of Sigmar, mounted + barding
w/ Armour of meteoric iron, sword of rightous stell

Battle Wizard (lvl 2) - fire
w/ Rod of Power, Ring of Volans (death)

Warrior Priest, additional hammer, heavy armour
w/Icon of magus

24x Swordsmen, musician, standard, champion
(warrior priest & battle wizard goes here)
9x Free company
5x Archers

10x Huntsmen

10x Crossbowmen

10x Crossbowmen

17x Flagellant Warband

7x Knightly Order, musician, champion

6x Knightly Order, musician, champion
(Arch Lector goes here)

6x Outriders, musician, champion w/ Hockland long rifle

Great Cannon

Helstorm Rocket Battery

Helblaster Volley Gun
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Total: 2000 point
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

[HighPlainDrifter]

I forgot to mention that dryads fear. Yeah, dryads are awesome.

Arch Lector of Sigmar, mounted + barding
w/ Armour of meteoric iron, sword of rightous stell
Good thinking with the SoRS to counter the WE high WS. You might want to give thought to a war alter. WE have no s7 attacks so it will give him a lot of trouble. If you put him on the alter I'd give him dawn armor instead of AOMI.

Battle Wizard (lvl 2) - fire
w/ Rod of Power, Ring of Volans (death)
I personally prefer the Doomfire ring.

Warrior Priest, additional hammer, heavy armour
w/Icon of magus
I prefer a 2hander.

24x Swordsmen, musician, standard, champion
(warrior priest & battle wizard goes here)
9x Free company
5x Archers
I'd use swordsmen and crossbowmen instead. Free company will fall very quickly to archer fire and surviving will be more important than more attacks.

10x Huntsmen

10x Crossbowmen

10x Crossbowmen
I would drop this unit, trying to outshoot WE would be impossible. 1 unit should be enough.

17x Flagellant Warband

7x Knightly Order, musician, champion
You could put the WP here. Don't underestimate rerolls. But he might be better suited where he is now with the icon of magnus.

6x Knightly Order, musician, champion
(Arch Lector goes here)

6x Outriders, musician, champion w/ Hockland long rifle
I'd keep these guys at 5 strong, and only bring the hochland if he has a alter kindred. (solo character than runs around and smashes face.)

Great Cannon

Helstorm Rocket Battery

Helblaster Volley Gun
Not sure if this is necessary. Might be hard to hit the skirmishers.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Total: 2000 point
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

[CmdrWrein]

Your army looks solid. Though I would suggest a few minor tweaks.
* Drop the Hochland long rifle. I found one doesn't usually make a difference. Or use a neat trick and use your Hammer of Sigmar prayer on this unit champion (allowing re-roll to hit and to wound). In which case he does become rather nice.
* Drop the AoMI on your archlector and give it to your priest. Then give him a two-handed hammer. I say this because the mounted archlector can achieve the 1+ save also in a cheaper way:
-> mounted, barding, heavy armour, enchanted shield.
At the moment you are "wasting" the save from mounted and barding. Personally I would kit out my general a little further, maybe gain some points by dropping 1 knight on each unit. Though I'm not completely sure it this is the right move.

And definitely keep us posted on how your battle went. It's rare to give advice on an army and get feedback.

To HighPlainDrifter:
Very nice tactica. There was one thing I was wondering about though: What units would you label "medium" cavalry (which would be good at removing waywatchers)?
Another thought I had was the mobility of a general on griffon or pegasus to help Tashin. Would you have any advice on that? The obvious advantage is a highly mobile combat force to counter the WE mobility. The big downside for both I think is the lack of armour on the monster meaning they can get shot relatively easily.

 

[HighPlainDrifter]

Hey Tash, do you have his exact list? I would be happy to pick it apart for you.

To HighPlainDrifter:
Very nice tactica. There was one thing I was wondering about though: What units would you label "medium" cavalry (which would be good at removing waywatchers)?
Another thought I had was the mobility of a general on griffon or pegasus to help Tashin. Would you have any advice on that? The obvious advantage is a highly mobile combat force to counter the WE mobility. The big downside for both I think is the lack of armour on the monster meaning they can get shot relatively easily.

When I say medium cavalry I mean a movement 8 cavalry unit that can hold its own in close combat, not as fragile as fast cavalry(pistoliers), and not as expensive as heavy cavalry(knights). e.g. the wood elf wild riders. These would be able to take out the Waywatchers and you wouldn't lose too many points doing so.

If I were playing my WE and I saw a general on a griff or peg I would target him first because I knew he would fall very quickly from archer fire. Yet again this is where Waywatchers would shine. A lucky 6 on the first round and there goes your general. Same goes for the W Alter, I take back what I said earlier about it.

It might be worth it if the opposing army had war machines or if he had warhawk riders, but from what tash said he doesn't have them in his list and WE don't have war machines. He probably should get some warhawks to counter tash's war machines though.

 

[Tashin]

No sorry i dont have his exact list - but i know for a fact he wont be putting Eagles on the table against me (he doesnt have any), that he'll probably list the units i mentioned earlier (wardancers, glade guards, dryads, waywatchers and 1 treeman, with the general often sitting tigth with the waywatchers or upgraded GladeGuards - think its Scouts or something).
Having played him already 4 times i can make you an estimated list. Dont know if that'll be interesting for you tho.

And again you're help is much much appreciated :dance:

I'll take a look at my list later and get those last tweaks sorted

 

[ArchonFarseerGuy]

Waywatchers with his general? I'm intrigued as to how this works. It's possible to have a WW hero (who, to my mind, is far more efficient than the actual unit, because he's cheaper and much harder to hit), but he can't be the general. I remember the days of having a Ld8 branchwraith acting as the general for my 1500pts army, heheh. Anyway, how does he use the waywatchers? Either he's holding them back (a very silly move, to my mind) or doing something illegal. However, the main thing for these guys is disruption. If you're using 4 units to surround and bring them down, that's a ton of points that will have to spend one turn killing them, one turn flipping back around, and one turn actually getting closer to where you actually want them - that's at least half the game with most of your units being used to pop one annoying unit.

One more mention should go to the Alter kindred. They are fast, annoying, pack a mean punch, and tend to be difficult to kill. One of my favourite combos against shooty armies was a GW, briarsheath and amber pendant. I moved him into the free forest turn 1 within LoS of some enemy shooting, and watch them shoot me at -4 off the bat (I had a unit of dark elves hitting me on 12s once. No lie). WE warcmachine hunters are second-to-none. However, they also tend to be vulnerable to fire that doesn't require hit rolls (cannons, fireballs, soul stealer etc) being T3 and few of wounds. Admittedly, there are a few things he can do to stymie this (Armour of the Fey: 4++ save against magical stuff; Glamourweave: 3++ against non-magical stuff. Thankfully he can't have both), but if you're well anchored, then you can guarantee yourself a turn of attacking them before he strikes (18" charge range requiring LoS).

I think that covers most of the elf-tricks I know .

HighPlainDrifter, I agree that the helblaster is indeed not necessary. However, like I say, there'll always be that one turn window between showing their faces and charging, simly because you need LoS to charge. This is when you get to punish him. If the WE player uses glade riders, wild riders, an alter with the HoDA etc, there's a good chance that you can inflict some serious damage to them. And it only takes one good volley to make a player very wary of the thing. Even the skirmishers tend to be small (except dryads, mind) so a few hits count for more. Mind you, like I say, I've used Empire and I've used Wood Elves, but I've never used the two against each other, and it's something I'd be cautious of myself.

Tash, Your list does look like an improvement on your first one, but could possibly use a couple of tweakings. If you don't want to use a HBVG, you could drop it and your second unit of XBowmen for a unit of pistoliers and a mortar. Though I suspect this is where it comes to a situation of how you use the gun, as opposed to what you're carrying (WHFB tends to be less list-oriented than 40K in my experience).

While I hardly use them myself Outriders might make a good firebase with their 360 deg shooting LoS. The only big drawback I see is that you will have to be careful with them. They are expensive and only have T3 5+ sv. so easily shot by the WE arrows.

This could work, though I'd issue the caveat that the sneaky blighters can nick off around the forests, limiting your zones of fire (and it sounds like there are a few of them here). That said, they could be used as some decent ground control.

 

[Tashin]

Alright, updating:

The general found a holy relic in the debts of his pockets
Half of the Crossbowmen in one of the units turned into horses and all of their crossbows turned into pistols !
All of the free company let go of their savage nature, got an education, and turned into welldisciplined swordsmen.
The helblaster exploded in a fiery sky of smoke and iron, leaving just scraps of metal, that the guncrew succededly turned into a mortar,
.. And i think a flagellant may have killed himself in the process. poor fellow.

Anyway, thanks again for the help everyone Cant wait to test this list.


Linking it for those few who might find my updating abit confusing.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Tashin Empire List (Anti-woodelf setup) 2000point. v.3 !
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Arch Lector of Sigmar, heavy armour, mounted + barding
w/ Enhanced shield, Holy Relic, Sword of Rightous Steel

Battle Wizard (lvl 2) - fire
w/ Rod of Power, Ring of Volans (death)

Warrior Priest, great hammer
w/ Icon of Magus, Armour of Meteoric Iron

24x Swordsmen, full command
(WP & Battle Wizard goes here)
11x Swordsmen detachment
5 x Archers detachment

17x Flagellant Warband

10x Huntsmen

10x Crossbowmen, champion

5x Outriders, musician, champion

5x Pistoliers, musician, champion w/ repeater pistol

6x Knightly Orders, musician, champion

5x Knightly Orders, musician, champion
(Arch Lector goes here)

1x Great Cannon

1x Mortar

1x Helstorm Rocket Battery
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Total: 2000 point
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------


- Again, thanks everyone

Tash

 

[alvenom]

I'm a bit late here but hopefully my advice might still be of use.

Two L2 Wizards using the Lore Of Shadows as well as Pistoliers and Huntsmen means you can stop him being so maneuverable; Outriders and Knights can be usedt o react quickly to other threats. Hopefully what's left of his army should be able to be taken apart piecemeal.

Of course, the best laid plans...

 

[HighPlainDrifter]

Alright Tash, Im going try a little experiment that I hope helps. I havent looked at your newest list yet and Im going make a list that I would take against Empire with just the units you mentioned that he has. Then Im going to compare it to your list. Hopefully you see this before you play him

Also I don't have any rule books with me so Im sorry for the mistakes. Im not going to be able to go that in depth with magic items either.
This is just an idea off the top of my head of what you might be up against. I might play different than some WE players, but this list should be pretty cut and dry average.

Lord:
SpellWeaver(Level 3-4 Wiz): Wand of the Witch Elm (Give rerolls for all dispel attemps), DeepWood Sphere(Damages enemy units in the same forest as the SpellWeaver)

Heroes:
SpellSinger(Level 1 Wiz, Maybe some scrolls)
SpellSinger(Level 1 Wiz)
Noble: Alter Kindred, Helm of the hunt(+1 attack on charge), Hail of Doom Arrow(3d6 arrows, one use only)

Core:
10 Glade Guard
10 Glade Guard
10 Glade Guard

8 Dryads
8 Dryads
8 Dryads

Special:
8 Wardancers
8 Wardancers
6 Wild Riders

Rare:
10 WayWatchers
10 WayWatchers


I feel like Im off on points. I think I might have 1-2 to many units. Id probly drop a unit of wardancers. Ok now lets see what I would do against your list.

Arch Lector of Sigmar, heavy armour, mounted + barding
w/ Enhanced shield, Holy Relic, Sword of Rightous Steel

Battle Wizard (lvl 2) - fire
w/ Rod of Power, Ring of Volans (death)

Warrior Priest, great hammer
w/ Icon of Magus, Armour of Meteoric Iron

You might get a few spells through, but with 6 rerollable dd I should be fairly safe.

24x Swordsmen, full command
(WP & Battle Wizard goes here)
11x Swordsmen detachment
5 x Archers detachment
Avoid at all cost. M4, if you ever get me in combat with this unit I will have failed at wood elfing. When there are no other targets, Ill pepper them with arrows and hit them from all sides.

17x Flagellant Warband
Bait/Flee/Avoid. Slowly pick off with archer fire.

10x Huntsmen
Stay in cover, skirmishers + soft cover + long range = hard to hit.

10x Crossbowmen, champion
Same as above.

5x Outriders, musician, champion
Focus fire with glade guards 2nd priority. Dryads clean up the rest. Move or shoot drops their priority for me.

5x Pistoliers, musician, champion w/ repeater pistol
Focus fire with glade guards 1st priority. Dryads clean up the rest.

6x Knightly Orders, musician, champion
This group belongs to the wardancers. 4+ wardsave if charged. Then switch to killing blow after. With 2 units of 8 wardancers this battle should go my way. Ill try and chase the rest down with my Wild Riders or alter noble.

5x Knightly Orders, musician, champion
(Arch Lector goes here)
Focus fire this unit with both waywatcher groups. I would try and stay in lethal shot range. It might only take 2 rounds to elimate your general. 20 lethal shots each round. The survivors will taste the spears of my Wild Riders or great sword of the alter noble.

1x Great Cannon
Third target of noble

1x Mortar
Second target of noble

1x Helstorm Rocket Battery
First target of Alter Noble. Able to get to it by the 2nd round.

After writing that I definitely feel like I over did it on the points.
Off the top of my head this is what I think would be the best all round strategy. I would be moving and running around trying to avoid being charged as well as the above strategies. I would feel pretty confident with this list against yours, but like avlenom said, the best laid plans mean nothing when your opponent doesnt follow them.


IMPORTANT!!!

If you see this formation:

-=Glade Guards
x=Dryads

^facing this way^
----------
xxxx
xxxx

Do not make a frontal charge at the Glade Guards. This is called the Wood Elf Shuffle. The glade guards will flee, you will fail the charge, and will be charged by the dryads. This is a common Wood Elf tactic.

 

[Tashin]

Whoa , that was awesome help. - thanks for taking your time to make a list (perhaps abit off on the points tho), and test it against my own. It actually gave me some pretty nice insight. I know now, that he'll be avoiding my mainregiment of swordsmen and my flagellants, i know that he'll probably focus fire towards my pistoliers/outriders, and that he'll try to get my huntsmen and crossbowmen to shot at his skirmished units (hiding in the woods).
While ofcause i cant be sure about this, making it a possibility in my mind somewhat prepares me for it.

So Highplaindrifter, now that you've teared my list apart, do you still feel its a good enough list? :\

Anyway, thanks for taking your time to answer everyone.

p.s I'll first have the time to battle him with this list some time during january, so it'll be a while before i report back

- Tash

 

[HighPlainDrifter]

I like your hero set up. WP can do some nasty soulfire damage against dryads and treemen. Another option would be to throw a captain in there with the sword of fate, just to make sure that treeman dies 1000 deaths. What I would do (risky, but fun) is go with 3-4 lore of life wizards. Mistress of the Marsh, Master of the Wood, and The Howler Wind would hurt a wood elf army so bad he will never want to play again.

I would drop the state troop block and the huntsmen. Keep the flagellants. I'd even add a few to make them 20. A lot of units in WE are ItP which means they cannot flee from a charge. Use this to your advantage. It will take awhile for a wardancer unit to eat through 20 models, it might even take them out by itself. If not, then finish the job with a rear knight charge.

I would drop the outriders if you need points, but keep the pistoliers. If you don't need points put the outriders in key positions that your opponent will have to cross, like a gap in between 2 forests. Or give the champ the long rifle and snipe his alter kindred. (Expect to lose a unit or 2 of your fast cavalry from archer fire) Use the pistoliers in conjunction with the knights. Use his own WE tactics against him. If he charges your pistoliers, flee (Make sure they have a musician) and counter charge with a group of knights. Try 2-3 units of pistoliers and 2-4 units of knights. Killing blow might be scary when you have 6 knights, but when you have 24 knights you can risk it.

I like the war machine set up. You could always drop the mortar for some points if you need them.

You might run into a problem if he decides to hid in his forest for the whole game. This is where magic will come in handy. Lucky for him you don't have a stegadon with engine of the gods taking a stroll around the forest killing everything in a 2d6"(is burning alignment 2d6 or 3d6?) radius (lizard bastards god damn skinky sons of bi- *cough*). But there are still spells that have an area of effect from the caster. Master of the Wood will scare him out of the forest in a heart beat. This can draw him out without you getting tree sung to oblivion.

You said in an earlier post that he puts his general with his gg scouts right? Does he deploy them like a regular scout unit? (Out of sight on your deployment side.) If he does make him pay for separating his general from the rest of his forces. (Taking a page out of the WE book here, I'm realizing how much playing WE affects my Empire play style.) Place 1-2 quick moving units that can hold their own in combat near where you think he will deploy his scouts, but don't make it obvious. Place them so he will think it you don't know what hes thinking. Knights will be your best bet. Spin around on the first round, say a prayer to Sigmar and charge him.


Long story short, your list is good, but I would change a few things to make it more maneuverable.

 

[Tashin]

Thank you Highplaindrifter

I must admit i really appreciate that you've been putting so much effort into helping me out here. I like your ideas and reflections, and i'll seriously consider chancing my army abit - even though it might just be small chances now that all you guys has helped me build an army versus those woodelves.
Im gonna face him in the beginning of the new year (mid january to be exact). I'll post a link to the battlereport here on this thread, so those of you interested can see how much your ideas helped me out/f***ed me up :act-up:

- Tash

 

[Tashin]

For those of you, who're interested. The match has been played, and my opponent got massacred. Linking a BattleReport within the next few days

 

[Marnepup]

Why no mortars? I'd think that against WE, you'd want to spam state troops in order to bring the elusive little twerps to battle or spam artillery to rain death on them without having to contend as much with the "You missed because I'm hiding in this bush" effect.

I guess you need a cannon or two to deal with a treeman, but shouldn't the rest be templatey death? Won't that work on everything up to and including dryads? I'd say three mortars, one great cannon, and a rocket battery, and you'll clean up. Station a block of handgunners near the artillery park to ward off enemy cav, and just go to town with templates and crossbows...maybe throw in a fireball or two for general purpose mayhem...

Plan B would be as many staties as you can cram in for the points, a cannon to deal with the obligatory treeman, a flamey death wizard or two, and advance online till they run out of space to flee. 5 points a model for spears or halberds...you can't help outnumbering 3 or 4 to 1...