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Discussion Starter #1
Hi guys look at my list give me your thoughts

Lord

Lvl 4 necro tali of pres master of the dead.
265pts

Hero's

Vamp lvl 1 staff of Damnation, dragon helm, red fury, lance, heavy armour, shield, barded nightmare bsb.
260pts

Vamp lvl 1, +2 attack sword, enchanted shield, barded nightmare, heavy armour, red fury.
220pts

core

5 wolves

5 wolves

5 wolves

5 wolves

15 skeletons standard spears
85pts

15 skeletons standard spears
85pts

15 skeletons standard spears
85pts

15 skeletons standard spears
85pts

special

35 grave guard great weapons standard banner of the barrows
475pts

rare

4 blood knights standard kastallen sword of battle banner of leadership
255pts

total 1975pts

so plan is the vamps go with blood knights they are the mobile heavy hitters they smash units with an insane amount of attacks (23 vamp 6 nightmares without staff 29 vamp 12 nightmare with staff). I did give some thought to the special banner but decide against it. The necro hangs behind the gg within 12 inches of all 4 skeletons so he can raise them up. He will raise a unit of zombies to bunker in. The grave guard take the heaviest fighting. The wolves go up the sides to be a pain. So thoughts?
 

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I really like it. It seams to have a flare to it that I have not seen any vamp players use before. Around my area its a case of chucking near 100 zombies at something while you kill everything else off with screams and it just gets boring. Anyway nice to see a well thought out and fun looking army.
 

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Discussion Starter #3
Well i get board with march all you infantry forwards. I have used the blood knight unit minus 1 vamp at 1000pts and gave this unit a couple of run outs and it's carnage cannons only kill 1 at a time I can raise a few back each time and the amount of carnage they cause shocks people it's fun. The bases is the same as most vamp lists with skeletons holding gg hitting hard the level 4 necro raises between 5-10 skeletons per turn so it has potential to be a pain. It's annoying that the vamp lord is so expensive points wise as it's feels wrong having a necro lead a vamp force
 

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No you don't 4 is minimum unit size
I'll be damned. At any rate, I've really never found them worth the points with how fragile they are. One good searing doom and they're gone. Along with that your list really struggles against anything with higher armor saves or tougher units in general. Skellies are going to be hard pressed to earn kills for themselves. You're better off making them into a single larger unit and going deep on ranks. They're going to crumble and crumble hard at that. I'd trade the extra attacks for an Ogre blade on your second vampire that way that unit has a little more punch to it. They're still really fragile either way. A lot will pull them apart with relative ease and they're very slow to bring back. I find Black Knights are much better for a bus. If you want to run Blood Knights, run them on the opposite flank of your bus and let them work by themselves. You have a lot of points in a unit that doesn't even grant LoS in it's current set up. A good cannon or BT shot and a Vampire is dust. Just a fragile set-up IMO.
 

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Discussion Starter #8 (Edited)
2 dice is all I need :p though yeah its risky but I think it makes a game a he'll of a lot more interesting don't you? But you like the list? Think it will do well?

It's not ment to be a bus it's to shock and awe the gg are to smash at str 6 and I have played that unit 4 times and it has always killed it's points worth if not more the. I have only lost them once and that was to a chaos warrior bus will halberds and 2 characters and even then took them 3 turns I was winning every time kastallen killed both characters in challenges though he did die once lol its solid and fun I take a black knight bus at 2500 when you can get numbers without losing out on other stuff
 

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I like the list! though blood knights are always squishy.

Don't forget A'zreal, he has MoTD, so from his first IoN, assuming an average roll of 3.5, that's 7.5 Skellies back per unit, which is 30 down on the first turn. There's enough target saturation so casualties will be low, and it'll probably manage to go off again second turn for a further 30. assuming no casualties, that's 4 units of 30 Skellies marching towards you on turn 2!

Also, what's 'Banner of Leadership'? And can I ask, why the spears on the Skellies? They're much less survivable without their shields, unless there's a ME around, in which case spears are better...
 

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Discussion Starter #10
I couldn't remember it's name the one that gives +1 leadership to help with frenzy :)

I get what is being said about blood knights but I can Bring back 2 per cast of ion with both vamps with red fury and 5 of the 6 knights being str 7 on the charge they are very effective more so than your giving them credit for are the black knights better as a bus yes can they put out the damage no I have plenty of hold units sure skeletons won't win fights alone but the can hold. On spears I just like their model more tho I am thinking of doing them as bret men at arms so then I will do hand weapons.
 

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I like the list! though blood knights are always squishy.

Don't forget A'zreal, he has MoTD, so from his first IoN, assuming an average roll of 3.5, that's 7.5 Skellies back per unit, which is 30 down on the first turn. There's enough target saturation so casualties will be low, and it'll probably manage to go off again second turn for a further 30. assuming no casualties, that's 4 units of 30 Skellies marching towards you on turn 2!

Also, what's 'Banner of Leadership'? And can I ask, why the spears on the Skellies? They're much less survivable without their shields, unless there's a ME around, in which case spears are better...
Let them come! Skellies aren't going to generate their own combat res and will die like flies to pretty much anything. 4 units of 60 skellies isn't scary even :p That's with getting off those IoN's too. If that gets stuffed for a turn early they can be cleanly wiped off from shooting.

I'm assuming he means the one that gives +1 LD.

2 dice is all I need :p though yeah its risky but I think it makes a game a he'll of a lot more interesting don't you? But you like the list? Think it will do well?

It's not ment to be a bus it's to shock and awe the gg are to smash at str 6 and I have played that unit 4 times and it has always killed it's points worth if not more the. I have only lost them once and that was to a chaos warrior bus will halberds and 2 characters and even then took them 3 turns I was winning every time kastallen killed both characters in challenges though he did die once lol its solid and fun I take a black knight bus at 2500 when you can get numbers without losing out on other stuff
I mean it makes it interesting but it's a lot of reliance on a very fragile unit. It really is very easy to kill that unit clean off the board. Some armies will struggle yes, but I play WoC and dabbled in Dwarves, Ogres and Vamps before settling on Warriors for fluff. I don't see a lot of lists that will have trouble with this one. If you're running it just for the lolz to see what happens than that's awesome but I'm just warning you it IS very fragile.

Also, if you Kastellen killed a pair of Chaos non-sorc champion you got very lucky or they were geared poorly. GG are good but you steal struggle to deal with armor outside of a small, fragile knight unit and a very slow unit that can simply be avoided. Which would be okay but you're also short on ways to deal with warmachines. An organ gun would rip those poor BK's to shreds, as would a volley of Irondrake fire from Dwarfs. Or a set of Maneaters or an Ironblaster. You're light on threat saturation. Your enemy can throw everything at the BK unit and come out profiting because it's the only quick movement hammer you have. Vargheists are a good example of a solid glass hammer unit that could also nuke war-machines for you and you can fly them about backwards to avoid frenzy checks.

I couldn't remember it's name the one that gives +1 leadership to help with frenzy :)

I get what is being said about blood knights but I can Bring back 2 per cast of ion with both vamps with red fury and 5 of the 6 knights being str 7 on the charge they are very effective more so than your giving them credit for are the black knights better as a bus yes can they put out the damage no I have plenty of hold units sure skeletons won't win fights alone but the can hold. On spears I just like their model more tho I am thinking of doing them as bret men at arms so then I will do hand weapons.
They're not more effective than I'm giving them credit. I ran them and they're just no worth the points to put characters into. They res very slowly and while they do hit hard, you can be chaffed off the table because of frenzy. The skeletons aren't going to really hold much. Well, at their current sizes anyway.
 

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Discussion Starter #12
My other list I have toyed with is.

Lord

Necro level 4, Tali of pres, master of the dead
265pts

Hero

Necro level 2
100pts

Necro lvl 2
100pts

Core

Same as first list

Special

28 grave guard standard great weapon
346pts

28 grave guard standard great weapon
346 pts

8 crypt horrors xxx

Total 1961
 

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Discussion Starter #13 (Edited)
Ha ha I got it

Lord

Necro level 4 master of the dead tali of pres dispel scroll
290pts

Hero's

Vamp heavy armour barded nightmare bsb lance enchanted shield staff of Damnation
203pts

Core

20 zombies standard
65pts

20 zombies standard
65pts

5 wolves

5 wolves

5 wolves

5 wolves

20 skeletons standard hand weapon
110pts

20 skeletons standard hand weapons
110pts

Special

28 grave guard standard great weapon
346pts

28 grave guard standard great weapon
346pts

Rare

5 blood knights standard kastallen sword of battle banner of leadership
305pts

Total 2000pts on the nose.

That's alot of threats and target saturation 1 cast of ion and looking at 30+ zombies and 25+ skeletons. 2 blocks of grave guard with great weapons 7x4 i don't have to worry about them running and can bring back potentially 10 per turn so should stick around a fair bit and do some damage. Still have a hard hitting blood knight unit on charge 21 str 7 attacks 27 with staff and 6 or 12 str 4 from nightmares a hell of alot cheaper in terms of points yeah sure still fragile but on your points of range the worst a cannon will do is one and i will brin him back and i would be a fool to leave them in the open for Organ guns and the like to shoot at and sir i am no fool :p. I really think this list has alot going for it my only major risk is my lack of chracters loose them both and the army crumble but to date i have never lost my necro despite my opponents best attempts. it usually revolves around a newly created zombie unit getting in the way :p
 
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