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That Which Has No Time
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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
[Kevin has asked me to take over the Topic of the Week. Look here]

Space Marine armies are the embodiment of a surgical strike force. Crushing through the enemy lines in order to overrun and take out a vital position is a task the elite superhuman warriors excel at. Drop pods with dreadnoughts and veterans disrupt the enemy lines, while scouts and bikes and assault marines -supported by land speeders- eliminate priority threats and break the opposition's resolve. The transports -spearheaded by tanks- then bring in the tactical squads to mop up the enemy's remains. All in day's work...

Capture and control: one of the three standard missions of the rulebook. The one that definitely produces the most tied games. Do your Space Marine armies work the mission as well as they should? What are your tactics, what are the dirty tricks you use?
Please remember to give at least a rough overview over the army build you are using when explaining how you (try to) win this scenario. Feel free to post any difficulties you may face (versus a particular enemy force, for example), what you hate or like about the mission, and anything else related to the topic.
 

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The Future
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I think this is probably my favourite mission as there's so many ways it can go.

I aim to hold ~40%, and at least contest another ~40% of the objectives:
3 objectives, I'll hold two or hold one and contest the others
4, I'll hold two and contest one.
5, I'll hold two and contest two.

There's no point spreading yourself thin by trying to hold 3 objectives (unless playing in a tournament with major victories etc), better to hold two with everything you have and use fast units to strike at his weak points.
Unless you're playing for 3 objectives total there's no point attacking all of the ones he holds. If there's an objective he's got a very short ranged unit sat on, ignore it.
Concentrate your first few turns on what can strike at distance or move quickly, then turn 4ish you can start getting ready to claim/contest. With that in mind, don't worry about infiltrating units starting on objectives. Infiltrate somewhere USEFUL, then walk to the objective later.
Holding objectives for the first 4 turns gets you nothing, so don't bother BUT MAKE SURE YOU CAN GET BACK. Don't rely on a high run roll, have all your scoring units within 8" of an objective at the end of turn 3. Why 8"? Because otherwise all your opponent has to do is put something in the way and you lose that objective.
Don't commit all your contesting units in turn 5 if you don't have to in order to win (unless you went first). There's a 66% chance of a turn 6, which becomes 100% if you really can't afford it to.
 

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Hive Fleet Pandora
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It's easier for our marines than Seize Ground. It's harder to get us off 1 objective than several, especially with Land Raiders and Terminators.
 

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Thanks again RA for agreing to take over the Topic of the Week for me.

Reality, you're thinking of Seize Ground, (Capture and Control is the one with two objectives).

I play a scout army, and my games with that army are 1000 points.

My home objective is held by a large unit of 10 sniper scouts with Telion and a Missile Launcher. With their 3+ cover save, (2+ late game when you need to hold that objective ;)) they can hold out for a while while the rest of my army distracts my opponent. Just in case I have a smaller 5 man scout squad with bolters cloaks and a heavy bolter to support them.

I rely more on contesting the other objective more than actually taking it in capture and control. Scouts have many fast units capable of contesting objectives, my list includes 2 LS Storms, 2 5-man scout combat squads, and half a dozen scout bikes -each unit capable of denying my opponent an objective or helping me claim it as my own. I have my units stay out of the fight for the first turn or two while my opponent comes out a bit to try and flush my units out. Then my marines jump out and attack any weaknesses in my line, like the squad that was moving around the building.

Once i've hit a few of his units i move out on his main force on turn 4-5, (4 if i can make it to enough objectives in one turn) and do as much damage as possible to the units closest to objectives.

The Emperor Protects
 
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That Which Has No Time
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Discussion Starter · #5 · (Edited)
Though I am very tired and should be in bed, I shall share my own thoughts:

Resiliency & Going Second
Space Marines' biggest strength is having no decisive weakness and therefore being very resilient. This resiliency enables us to withstand enemy alpha-strikes and enables us to safely take the risk of giving the opponent first turn in order to have an advantage contesting objectives. It is unfortunate to have one's contesting unit destroyed just seconds before the game ends, and it is even more unfortunate having your own objective contested before the game ends without getting a chance to kill it in another shooting phase. Both of these situations can be avoided by going second, which I try to do in capture and control whenever I can.
The exception to this is when I play a very, very hard-hitting but fragile opponent. E.g. Dark Eldar have their skimmers all lined-up, ready to be shot on turn one without that cover save? Go first and take them down...

Battle Formation & Objective Placement
Space Marines perform best when bundled-up, and they excel at medium range. Having your opponent's objective close to yours can therefore pose a great advantage, where you are able to hold yours and attack his while keeping your force together and having everything in range to accomplish its mission. With a standard mechanized army I would therefore always try to place my objective near my opponent's if I can, unless it is a very assault-strong army to which I want maximum distance.
There is a different approach too, though. You may want to place your objective as far from the enemy's as possible in order to keep a safe distance and in order to make him seperate his own force and spread it as widely as possible, so that your force can then take on one part of the opposition at a time. This is very advisable for more fragile builds (like bike armies).

Home Objective & False Obligations
There is no need to necessarily hold your home objective, it suffices entirely to contest it. In fact it is often easier and more surprising to feint being determined to hold your home objective but then make the move for your opponent's. Do not fix your mind on it, though, just go with that objective at the end of the game which is easier to claim. Remember that you do not need to make any commitment before turn four (when you should move into position to make your end move).
This works especially well with bike armies, but other mobile builds like the standard mech can pull it off too. When the objectives are placed diagonally opposed to one another, you reserve everything. Then you enter play with your force somewhere along your table edge as close to or far away from the enemy as you wish. You are free to decide on which of the two objectives to strike, or even delay that decision further.

Troops & Objective Holding
Forget the objectives for the first three turns, just completely ignore them. Bring your force into position so that it can bring on its damage potential in the most efficient way and do not waste a thought on the objectives before turn four. No need to dedicate any units to objective holding before it is necessary, better to make use of them otherwise until it actually counts. Remember that, while troops are vital in capture and control, they are less precious and more expendable than in seize ground because you will likely need fewer. So no need to be over-cautious.
Don't bother attacking earlier than needed. If your force has to advance towards the enemy in order to fight the best: do it. If the enemy is more assaulty than you are or has fearsome close ranged weaponry that could devastate you: sit back and relax, let them come at you and blast away, until you are ready to jump forward and sweep the remains.

Blocking & Contesting
Contesting objectives holds an even greater power in capture and control missions than with more than two objectives. But it is also harder to accomplish because the objectives will be more heavily defended. Make sure your opponent is unable to contest the objective you hold by forming protective rings around it and blocking them with tanks. Prioritize targets in a way that skimmers or units able to move over your models and tanks in tank shock distance are eliminated before they endanger your objective. Make sure your holding unit can not be targeted directly, hide them in or behind a rhino/razorback (wreck) or other vehicle body, etc.
In the same way try to have tanks ready and in position for tank shocking or skimmers ready to move behind enemy lines in order to contest the opponent's objective. Find a way to break through your opponent's protective ring, for example by pulling it off the objective in the assault (using a unit that has only one model barely within assault range, so that the enemy will have to make the largest possible move towards you).

Notable Units & Victory
Capture and control games are usually fought out in a smaller space than other scenarios as the two forces tend to concentrate on the vicinities of the objectives. Therefore and because troops are not required to be very numerous here, small but elite and hard-hitting units are more viable here than elsewhere. The standard assault terminators and land raider transport combo, for example, is -while still expensive- a perfect unit to spearhead the attack on the enemy base iin capture and control.


Summary
  • Try to go second (unless you seriously need to obliterate the enemy before it hits you).
  • Keep your units together and in the most optimal battling position.
  • Don't commit before it is necessary and pick unprepossessedly which objective to focus on when the time has come.
  • Try to either entirely crush the enemy by placing the objectives close together and bringing your entire power to bear, or weaken it by placing the objectives far apart and forcing it to spread very widely.
  • Protect yourself from contestation by forming protective barriers and prioritizing your targets.
  • Make sure you are able to contest the enemy objective with skimmers or tank shocks (or anything else if you are desperate).
 

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personally when playing capture and control with my blood angels i normally win quite a lot. A good trick i normally use is to put a 5-man tactical squad behind the objective but within '1' of it. They are hidden from enemy fire but still hold the objective. For me massed assault squads with the right equipment will be able to over-run the enemy position as long as you can make sure you hit them with enough and get the charge.
 

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Alrighty, most of the stuff here has covered most of the thoughts in my head. However, there are some "easy" tactics that i use. When I played Seize Ground, people around here tend to want to deny everything and hold one. So, to counter, a denial (what a conundrum) I like to place my Razorback, or rhino over an objective. With my tactical marines surrounding the rhino. If you look closely, the rhinos hull leaves enough space for the marines to still capture it. However, with the game rules, people are not allowed to closer than 1" from moving. With the rhinos hull covering the objective, and the space marines making a "ring" of defense. You can essentially deny a denial.

Now you may say. OH i know! you can just charge! Nope.
If you had measured properly the marines should be placed as to receive a charge without giving away the objective.

Example

RHINO| 3" |MARINES||CHARGER|

Since the marines are exactly at the 3" limit, the charger is still not in denial range.
The rule states that, as long as one of your scoring units is within 3" of the objective you claim it. If there is no enemy WITHIN 3" then, the objective is uncontested. However, If this squad, dies in combat, or falls back. The objective will be contested via consolidation.

Thats a trick I like to use around here. There are a few counters to it, but not everyone will have the knowledge.

This can be done with Landraiders and any other transport.

For early Objective denial, I like to throw my Ironclad in a drop pod right into the thick of things. Pop smokes first turn, in order to survive long enough to get him into close combat. Where he should be safe. As I doubt someone will hurt the dreadnought in close combat. The average marine with Kraks definitely will NOT hurt this thing..

With a dreadnought running amok in the enemies army, your troops should be safe. As they will spend the early turns trying to kill it. Or being killed by it. While also denying an objective.
 

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The Future
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Reality, you're thinking of Seize Ground, (Capture and Control is the one with two objectives).
Holy crap, that means every single person in my gaming group has got the two of them the wrong way round in our heads :D

In that case, it's my LEAST favourite game type and frequently the most boring. Like most people I'll aim to hold one and contest the other, but if I'm facing a shooty opponent I'll pile my whole force towards the enemy to control his and then worry about contesting my own later on.
 

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Don't automatically go second in an objectives game, take a moment to size the board/opposing force up.

While the reactive deployment, objective placement, and last turn grab are appealing the capture and control format means that the first player down isn't deploying blind and will have the opportunity not only to strike first but to castle up, embarking into buildings, popping smokes on transports, and blocking lanes in no-mans land.

Perhaps more significantly - going first gives you the choice of deployment zones. Sometimes you take a look at the way the terrain has fallen and find that it's either of notable benefit to you, or simply worth denying to your opponent.
 
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