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Hello LO, my gaming group has seen a possible recent addition of a Space Wolves player (previously Dark Angels). I gave him my Space Wolves codex and he has since become fairly set on playing Space Wolves. Me and the rest of the group are somewhat intimidated by this new army, seeing as how they can destroy things in melee and are fairly adequate at range (gather from my quick glance over of the codex). The Necrons player is going to screwed over by Jaws of the World Wolf, the Chaos player is going to be matched (if not outmatched) in melee (and certainly in ranged), etc....

So, I've been wondering, what is the weak spot of the Space Wolves? What is the weak point that every Space Wolves player hopes he doesn't have to go up against? (preferably from a codex marines army, but any advice is welcome)

Thanks!
 

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You may not like this but, from my perspective, Space Wolves are a very well balanced army. A good Space Wolf list can pretty much handle anything you throw at them, being that fire from range or close combat. They are far for being unbeatable, but weak spots, they have none.

By the way, the same applies to regular Space Marines chapters.
 

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You may not like this but, from my perspective, Space Wolves are a very well balanced army. A good Space Wolf list can pretty much handle anything you throw at them, being that fire from range or close combat. They are far for being unbeatable, but weak spots, they have none.

Now hold that thought... Space Wolves have weaknessess, and one of them is rather a major set back. It is rather hard for a Space Wolf army to out shoot anyone first of all... Well I guess they can out shoot Bloodletters just fine. Secondly, Wolves will not outcombat Chaos if the Chaos player is using Noise Marines or Berzerkers. I know... I've tried. Secondly, most new Space Wolf players are going to spend quite a few points into their HQ's. This can be a big mistake because they die just the same to a battle cannon or lascannon.
 

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There weakness is their speed when you've knocked out the rhino's.
Another weakness is that their basic assault units isn't up to fighting specialists.
 

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Secondly, Wolves will not outcombat Chaos if the Chaos player is using Noise Marines or Berzerkers. I know... I've tried.
And that, good lads and lasses of LO, is why the Wolves shouldn't leave home without Ragnar Blackmane, that charming Furious Charging rapscallion. :)

Also I consider it a hindrance that the Wolves' bikers and jetpackers are all crummy Blood Claws, and the thing that terrifies me down to the bone and marrow is the price of the only model on an actual Thunderwolf.
 

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Hive Fleet Pandora
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You are right to be concerned about the space wolves. They are one of the most balanced armies if built properly. Moreover, everything they do, they do quite well. 3 squads of Long Fangs with 4 missile launchers and the ability to split fire means they're more capable of taking down your rhinos than you are of taking down theirs. A squad of Grey Hunters with Power Weapon, Mark of the Wulfen and Wolf Standard led by a Power Fist Wolf Guard and attached to a Wolf Priest means 3 power weapons + 1d6+1 rending attacks with re-rolls to hit on the charge...and that's not including Ragnar! Rune Priests nullifying your Lash or Warptime on 4+ and using Jaws on your slower I3 plaguemarines or Living Lightning to wreck your transports is nasty indeed. Now consider a wolf army that can have up to 4 of them!

Consider my SW army which recently won 1st at a local tourney (at 1250pts, batrep here):

1250pts Space Wolves

Rune Priest Loki - Meltabombs, Living Lightning, Murderous Hurricane
Rune Priest Blackheart - Chooser of the Slain, Living Lightning, Jaws
Rune Priest Goldmoon - Jaws, Murderous Hurricane

3x Wolf Guards - 3x Combi-meltas, 3x Power Fists (attached to Grey Hunters)

6x Grey Hunters - Meltagun, Power Weapon, Rhino
6x Grey Hunters - Meltagun, Power Weapon, Rhino
6x Grey Hunters - Meltagun, Power Weapon, Rhino

5x Long Fangs - 1x Lascannon, 3x Missile Launchers
5x Long Fangs - 1x Plasma Cannon, 3x Missile Launchers
Vindicator

1249pts

While they may not out-assault a pure Khornate army, they'll blow up their transports, make them footslog and hurt them while they do. In my 1850 list, I've actually outshot Dark Eldar and Tau and kept it about even with a mechanized Guard army. Though I did have problems against a Chaos list with 3 Daemon Princes at 1850pts. I couldn't take them down fast enough before they got close enough to assault and my list was more shooty than assaulty.

My 3 main weaknesses IMO are 1) I'm as slow as any other marine army, 2) Dawn of War deployment hurts my Long Fangs as I lose 1-2 rounds of shooting, and 3) I have a lot of Kill Points. Other than that, there isn't much weakness.
 

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That list sounds alright but I find a huge weakness to spacewolves is their point costs. I use lysander 6 thss termies and a librarian with null zone and vortex of doom in a crusader. I walk alover my friends sw army. Long fangs are fine but they don't. Do mmuch against high armor. Also dreadnaughts being dropped ontop of them slows them down enough for my dev squads to mop them up. On the back side I play almost always 2000pt games. I find lower pt games boring. In any event they can be beaten just like anyother army
 

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Though I did have problems against a Chaos list with 3 Daemon Princes at 1850pts. I couldn't take them down fast enough before they got close enough to assault and my list was more shooty than assaulty.
How in the Emperors name did he take three? I hope that was a typo... Unless you ment Daemons....
 

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Hive Fleet Pandora
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How in the Emperors name did he take three? I hope that was a typo... Unless you ment Daemons....
One was a Summoned Greater Daemon and 2 were normal HQ Daemon Princes. For only 100, that summoned GD is a steal.
 

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Ahhh I see, one was a Summoned Daemon. That sneaky Chaos player.
 

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That list sounds alright but I find a huge weakness to spacewolves is their point costs. I use lysander 6 thss termies and a librarian with null zone and vortex of doom in a crusader. I walk alover my friends sw army.
First of all, in regards to their cost, it can't be overlooked that they can shore up numbers pretty easily with Fenresian wolf packs, which our overlooked by a lot of SM players that are afraid of not having 3+ saves :p. Besides my SW army, i play horde armies, and can tell you that when used properly Fenresian Wolves can win/save a game that would otherwise be lost.

Also, Lysander, six termies, and a Librarian in a land raider? Firstly, how is it not boring to dump so many points into essentially one squad? I can see why you wouldn't play games any smaller than 2000 pts. Thered be nothing else on the table! And that says nothing to the weaknesses of a SW army as any army would have trouble against that unless they plan specifically for it.
 

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That list sounds alright but I find a huge weakness to spacewolves is their point costs. I use lysander 6 thss termies and a librarian with null zone and vortex of doom in a crusader. I walk alover my friends sw army. Long fangs are fine but they don't. Do mmuch against high armor. Also dreadnaughts being dropped ontop of them slows them down enough for my dev squads to mop them up. On the back side I play almost always 2000pt games. I find lower pt games boring. In any event they can be beaten just like anyother army
SW shure has some expensive options like SC and WG-terminator armour with SS/TH. But if you stay clear of the points-sacks, there are some choices who are a great deal for the points, like GH and LF. 6 LF with 5 missile launchers for 140 (with split fire etc) is a bargain.

The ML is not good against AV14, but against transpors. light armour, MEQ, GEQ and MC is awesome bang for the buck.

If you want to go for assault termies with TH/SS, then SW is not the competetive way to go.





:beer:
 

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I find my Space Wolves can handle pretty much anything but one thing. Tau Battlesuits. The Tau player i usually play against absolutely spams those things. He puts a bunch of AP 2 or 1 weapons on them, fits them with tons of shield drones, then keeps them just out of assault range. I've calculated i have to do more than 7 wounds to reduce their firing potential by anything. The only solution I've found is drop pods, an even then my army is basically split in half the first turn.
 

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Hive Fleet Pandora
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I find my Space Wolves can handle pretty much anything but one thing. Tau Battlesuits. The Tau player i usually play against absolutely spams those things. He puts a bunch of AP 2 or 1 weapons on them, fits them with tons of shield drones, then keeps them just out of assault range. I've calculated i have to do more than 7 wounds to reduce their firing potential by anything. The only solution I've found is drop pods, an even then my army is basically split in half the first turn.
That's easy. Two things:

1) Mech up.

2) Long Fangs - they'll instakill those suits with krak missiles and broadsides with lascannons
 

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yeah tau battlesuits lose their advantages when faced with a transport heavy army. Long Fangs may not help though, as a smart tau player can easily find a high wall or something to hide his suits from view, move out to shoot, shoot, and then jetpack back behind the wall. They would be usefull against broadsides though. Or, take a predator with 3 lascannons; if they all hit and wound, thats one dead monat suit, since they have to split wounds and can only have 2 drones (i think).
 

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1) Mech up.

2) Long Fangs - they'll instakill those suits with krak missiles and broadsides with lascannons
The problem is strength 7-8 weapons easly kill AV 10 of most transports. The Tau almost always hit because of markerlights and TL weapons. Then its only a 4+ to penetrate, and suddenly your troops are sitting out in the middle of nowhere being pounded by AP 3 weapons.

I tried long fangs, but they only got one turn of effective shooting in before they lost over 25% and fled, then regrouped, then fled again untill the end of the game. Plus any wounds he would get insta-killed from he puts on his drones, or saves due to his increadable luck while saving. To tell you how lucky he is, he once played a game with Space marines and saved all but two saves the entire game against my old eldar list, which was real good at killing Marines. Statistics just don't apply to him. So i guess thats part of the problem. Some people are just inherently luckier.
 

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sounds like you play one of my friends here! his tau are ridiculously good at making all saves. fireknife config is extremely powerful as well.
 

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Long Fangs may not help though, as a smart tau player can easily find a high wall or something to hide his suits from view, move out to shoot, shoot, and then jetpack back behind the wall. They would be usefull against broadsides though.
Battle Leader on T.Wolf with shield (possibly a claw or frost blade) Wolfkin saga and The Necklace clocks in fairly cheap at less than 200 points, combined with cheap and fast Fenrisian Wolves will give those hiding suits something to worry about soon enough, and with such high numbers... You do the math.

I tried long fangs, but they only got one turn of effective shooting in before they lost over 25% and fled, then regrouped, then fled again untill the end of the game.
Just because you got horrendously unlucky with your high Ld units doesn't mean they'd be bad. They often get the title of MVPs in my games, and that's why I always include two packs of them. Again, each pack is less than 200 points, so that leaves still plenty of points for other stuff. Using one turn to get to high ground is worth it, so don't be afraid to sacrifice a round of shooting if that means you'll be las-sniping from a clocktower-like place afterwards.
 

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Some people are just inherently luckier.
Your telling me! A friend of mine is just like that... He's made more 5+ guard saves than I've made 3+ saves EVER. And, I challenge anyone to top this, in an apoc game, he shot ONCE with a laser destroyer from EXACTLY 5 feet away at my eldar revenant titan, rolled 6 after 6 after 6, byebye structure points, apocalyptic explosion, max area of effect, killed about 50 other of my models that were around its feet...it was like turn one or two...yea. i wanted to cry. :(
 

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And, I challenge anyone to top this, in an apoc game, he shot ONCE with a laser destroyer from EXACTLY 5 feet away at my eldar revenant titan, rolled 6 after 6 after 6, byebye structure points, apocalyptic explosion, max area of effect, killed about 50 other of my models that were around its feet...it was like turn one or two...yea. i wanted to cry.
I can top that. I was playing an apocalypse game with a fellow tyranid player, and needless to say it was going real horrible. We only had two objectives and only a few guants on those objectives. We had one guant, with a spare Tyranid Warrior head on it, sitting on the objective, lurking. This guant withstood fire from 3 basilisks, 4 10-man space marine squads, and about a whole platoon of IG shooting, For two rounds! He finally died when assaulted by a chapter master, and we lost the game, but Warrior-Guant's heroic efforts are forever kept in our local hobby shops lore.

Battle Leader on T.Wolf with shield (possibly a claw or frost blade) Wolfkin saga and The Necklace clocks in fairly cheap at less than 200 points, combined with cheap and fast Fenrisian Wolves will give those hiding suits something to worry about soon enough, and with such high numbers... You do the math.
the only thing I have against this is all the models have to be proxiyed, or a look-alike purchased somewhere else, for an obscene amount. I never liked proxying. Something about it. I dont know...
 
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