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I'm thinking about converting my marine army to traitors. What would this do for my army would I get deamons? Would I be chaos undvided or could I pick a mark? What types of units would I be abole to add to my existing force.

Also heres a list of My current collection. Could you just tell me what I can and can not use. Also some conversion Ideas would be nice.

List:
1 Marine commander
1 Chaplin with powerfist
2 Dreadnoughts
50 Tactical marines with all of the weapons
2 rhinos
3 Landspeeder tornados
10 assault marines
3 bikes
Predator anihilator
Whirlwind


My army is currently painted and played mainly as Ultra Marines, would it make sence fluff wise to have a traitor Ultra Marine army?
 

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LO's Shadow Captain
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Fallout said:
I'm thinking about converting my marine armys to traitors. What would this do for my army would I get deamons? Would I be chaos undvided or could I pick a mark? What types of units would I be abole to add to my existing force.

Also heres a list of My current collection. Could you just tell me what I can and can not use. Also some conversion Ideas would be nice.

List:
1 Marine commander
1 Chaplin with powerfist
2 Dreadnoughts
50 Tactical marines with all of the weapons
2 rhinos
3 Landspeeder tornados
10 assault marines
3 bikes
Predator anihilator
Whirlwind


My army is currently painted and played mainly as Ultra Marines, would it make sence fluff wise to have a traitor Ultra Marine army?
1) First of all, you can pick any marks you want, as long as you follow the rules in the codex. You can even use no marks of Chaos and still use the codex for other rules. Make sure you read up on these pretty carefully.

2) You don't have to include Daemons if you don't want to. If you do, make sure you read all rules pertaining them rather carefully.

3) Chaplains are only available in the Word Bearers rules, but you can use the model to represent something else if you want. Also, Chaos doesn't get Whirlwinds or Land Speeders.

4) As for UltraMarines turning traitor, I would say, fluffwise, absolutely not. They are one of the most devout Chapters in the Imperium, so you may want to maybe use an inkwash or something to darken their armour, or repaint them, to represent a different traitor chapter.

Hope this helps.



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welcome to the dark side :ninja:

you could also just paint them evil looking and say that they're a traitor legion, but use normal Space Marine rules so you can still have the chaplain and whirlwind. Or, you could play them sort of like Red Corsairs and put red x's through all of their chapter and imperial insignia. That looks pretty cool.

However, if you don't want to, you could use the Chaplain as an aspiring champion maybe? And the whirwind could probably be converted into a pred if you so chose. The two dreadnaughts are easy enough to use, just repaint them. If I remember correctly the close combat arms on chaos dreadnaughts look different, but you you could reason not changing them out by saying that they've recently gone traitor. The 10 assault marines could work as raptors, (or use them as Possesed marines with demonic flight) and the rest of your army kinda falls into place. Except the land speeders, they're sorta unusable in a chaos list. Maybe you could proxy them as bikes, but that's really stretching it.

As for which Chaos army you'd play, your options are fairly open. Just beware of the themed armies, (World Eaters, Death Guard, Emperor's Children, etc) because the way they build their armies often prohibits you from using many of these units. World Eaters, for instance, couldn't use raptors, (aka ur assault marines) if memory serves Death Guard can't use bikes, and so forth. So, you could just try Black Legion (undivided) for now. And while you don't have to get daemons, it's something that you shouldn't rule out, especially if you're playing one of the themed armies, because that gives you a tad bit more versitility in creating your list.

As far as conversions, to get really detailed, good ones I'd say you need to decide which army you want to play as first, and from there you could convert away into whatever you want. For instance, if you gave somebody a mark of nurgle, sickly skin and true grit are in order, if they have the mark of slaanesh, just cut them up, bugged out eyes, etc. If it's an Aspiring Champion, be sure to make him especially crazy looking, and for demonic gifts you could really go nuts with conversions. But you have to know what you want first.
 
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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
So I could paint them as red corsairs and be abole to switch between using the chaos codex and the Space marine codex!?

This will also open up more normal marine traits to my army, when I'm not playing Chaos!
 

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Fallout said:
So I could paint them as red corsairs and be abole to switch between using the chaos codex and the Space marine codex!?

This will also open up more normal marine traits to my army, when I'm not playing Chaos!
you might get some sideways glances from rule mongers, but I'd let that go as being able to play both, so long as you don't covert them too heavily one way or the other, or say they're traitor marines using sm rules.
 

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Fallout said:
So I could paint them as red corsairs and be abole to switch between using the chaos codex and the Space marine codex!?

This will also open up more normal marine traits to my army, when I'm not playing Chaos!
You can really do that with any color scheme. The people that are going to get up in arms about Ultramarines playing with Chaos rules are probably going to get up in arms about anything that's interchangable. (Then, if you're lucky, they'll start complaining about how expensive the hobby is.)

If you're worried about keeping things semi-fluffy, just avoid demons and to a (somewhat) lesser extent demonic upgrades. If you strip away everything demonic, CSM are remarkably similar to SM (as far as I've seen.) I have a hard time seeing a way to really explain away demons. They just don't fit for loyalists. Some of the non-vehicle demonic upgrades might slide by, but if you use them you're probably looking at cursed founding/excommunicathingamajigacus. I forget all of the vehicle upgrades, but many of the demonic vehicle upgrades can easily be passed off as either an improved Power of the Machine Spirit or extra armor. Think Scions of Mars, but good instead of bad.

In all fairness, I come from a rather lenient environment. If you regularly play tournaments, this probably would fly about as well as a very heavy rock. Chained to another very heavy rock. On the bottom of the ocean. Sealed in a giant block of cement. With large warning signs saying 'Beware of the Leopard.'
 

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señor brushman!
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Well you could convert you Space Marines to Chaos Space Marines although that would be pretty time consuming. You could convert your

Space Marine Dreads to Chaos Dreads by ink washing them with a darker color, repaint them with a more Chaos colors and/or add bits of spiky things.

You could convert your Tactical Marines to Chaos marines using the same technique as for the Dreadnoughts.

You could convert the Rhino's in to Chaos Rhino's and the Assault Marines to Raptors.

The Predator to a Chaos Predator and the Marine Bikes to Chaos bikes.

For all these you could just add some spiky bits and repaint or ink/dry brush them with a darker more Chaos looking color; while still keeping the a little bit of the Space Marine look (because they used to be Space Marines who came to Chaos).


It's all up to you whether or not you want Daemons or any Chaos unit as long as you stick to the rules in the codex. You can choose any mark or undevided.

It probally woudn't make much sense for the Ultramarines to be traders because they are very loyal to the Imperium; although, you could say that they were some different faction but if you did that you might have to repaint them that way which can be a pain. I'd probally just repaint them with Chaos colors and still give them a slight Space Marine look and just say that they weren't originally Ultramarines if you're worried about to fluff being semi-accurate.

Ben
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
What if I said my Marine army was stranded after a fight on a deamon world(like in the current issue of White Dwarf) and had excapted from the chaos armys but was corupted by the world(Or what ever it is that corupts Marines.)

Might work good sence I just lost a battle on a Deamon world during the Drak Crusade.

Would that make sence?

If this is going to be to hard to pass of I might just start a LATD army.
 

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señor brushman!
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I think thats an excellent idea! You should still do some small conversions though because the Space Marines turned evil ;) If you wanted Daemons in your army, you could say Deamons enslayed and corrupted the Space Marines so they are the Daemons evil slaves :tongue:
 

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Librarian from Hell
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I think you can have any Loyalist turn traitor. I guess the only one people expect is the Relictors though. All the others would (will?) get the "but they are one of the most loyal and would never turn to Chaos"-response.
I guess the exact same thing happened at the time of the Horus heresy. "No, not Horus, he is one of the most loyal..." "Not Moriarton he is one of the..." "No, not.." "No..."
That's the way the Chaos gods do it I guess.
And the guys betraying the Emperor back then were superior in every way to the weakling Space Marines of today (OK, not today, more like tomorrow, or some 40 millenia after tomorrow...but in a different world...bah, you get what I mean.)
 

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red corsairs fluff man, after the badab incident, astral claws changed their legion name to red corsairs and their refuge is the new home to traitor space marines, who join the red corsairs.

So, if you are member of a traitor ultramarine strike force, and you want to flee from the imperium domain, you can go to join the old lugft huron and his red corsairs.

pity that red corsairs don't have its own rules as they had in the 2nd ed.

my first CSM army was a red corsairs one

i had lots of traitors of different chapters, ultramarines, blood angels, dark angels, white scars.... all fleeing to join the astral claws
 
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