Librarium Online Forums banner

Status
Not open for further replies.
1 - 20 of 119 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
464 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Just to clear this up and not insult anyone, there is no such thing as a cheesy army, merely cheesy players 8| ... What I'm really saying is: "what is the easiest army to be cheesy with?" Ulthwe, Necrons, Chaos, Dark eldar...?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
485 Posts
My personal experience is that CSM ( Black Legion) and Eldar (Craftworlds, not main list) are very easy to tweak into being very cheesy armies.

Black Legion is not cheesy per se but when you compare it to the cult armies (WE, TS, EC, DG) I think it becomes apparant. The Black Legion can add the specialist troops like berzerkers and deathguard as troops if they add a HQ with the mark required. Then when you compare this to a pure cult army, which has limits on what other units they can mark, I find that some BL armies are cheesy. This because some players make virtually a cult list, then add other units and claim that it is a BL army instead. Maybe it not very cheesy but it certainly is unfluffy and a good start at becomming a powergamer. A easy solution to this would be either make the cult armies better by restricting the cult armories to cult armies only or restrict the use of marked units in BL armies, maybe in the same way as in the LoD list (All marked troops are elite)

The Eldar speaks for itself especially Biel Tan, when you compare it to the main Eldar list. What other army makes normal hvy support into elite? or elite into troops? Besides that there is the fact with starcannons, some players put them on everything! "Almost all" Eldar vehicles can have one and some players really take advantage of this.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,961 Posts
The Black Legion also can outshoot Iron Warriors. With the right use of marks they can get up to six havoc squads, or three havoc squads and three normal heavy supports.

Something else which has "cheese potential" are genestealer cults. Their stealers can FoF, and "shoot the big ones" doesn't apply to stealer cults - at the same point cost as normal stealers. They also got tons of meat shields, and some IG thingies.

jwu
 

·
Bearded Ninja
Joined
·
2,678 Posts
TAU
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
464 Posts
Discussion Starter · #5 ·
why tau arklite? I think dark eldar are cheesy with their shadow fields (2+ inv.!!!)

I do think csm are cheesy are my friend coolects csm, but calls them thousands sons just to get the 2 wounds and free sorceror upgrade on his chosen, and ahriman.

Where can I find the rules for a genestealer army?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
84 Posts
lol, Dark eldar aint cheesy at all, just strange, you have to use them right or else they just get slaughtered, think about their armor, +5 save and only one shadow field can be taken!! the only one that has a sav of +3 is the talos, then theres teh incubi that has +4 and wyches, but the rest has +5 save!!! all in all, i think it depends on how you make the army, now you can add harlequins to your dark eldar army!!! then their more bad
a wych army with harlequins
psyco cc army!!!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,961 Posts
Just a note, the chance that a shadow fields lasts for four hits is less than 50%. If you take that into account then most marine characters with rosarius and artificier/terminator armour are way more resilient than a DE Lord with shadow field.

jwu
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,164 Posts
Master Belial, i disagreea nd agreew with you at the same time.

i agree witht the fact that biel tan is wrong. having elites as troops isnt right.

i disagree witht he fact that u think that starcannons shouldnt be used alot. i walked into my local gw and i owned a gw manager and he called my ulthwe army cheesy becasuse i ahd alot of star cannons. but i ahve 5-6 troosp in a 1500 point game. whats cheesy about that??
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
485 Posts
I think you misunderstood me. I never said that using starcannons were cheesy, I said that some players take advantage of the fact that eldar can put the starcannons in a lot of their units. A good example of cheesy use of starcannons in my mind is a squadron of warwalkers all with starcannons
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
464 Posts
Discussion Starter · #11 ·
Originally posted by Nightshade@Oct 7 2003, 14:39
lol, Dark eldar aint cheesy at all, just strange, you have to use them right or else they just get slaughtered, think about their armor, +5 save and only one shadow field can be taken!! the only one that has a sav of +3 is the talos, then theres teh incubi that has +4 and wyches, but the rest has +5 save!!! all in all, i think it depends on how you make the army, now you can add harlequins to your dark eldar army!!! then their more bad
a wych army with harlequins
psyco cc army!!!
DE are'nt really cheesy, it's just cos arklite said tau, which i collect, so i said DE cos he collects them. Sorry!

As to the biel tan thing, I reckon being cheesy with them is a death trap as my friens uses a biel tan army, and he uses every special thing (can't remember the name, but they are banshhes, dark reapers, e.t.c) and the only real troops choice he has are 16 guardians. I slaugther him every time as he is too outnumbered to win. :w
 

·
Bearded Ninja
Joined
·
2,678 Posts
no offence taken im sorry but come on geat guns bad bs ;)
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
464 Posts
Discussion Starter · #13 ·
I know what you mean, Bs 3 for elites????? And they cc part (kroot) have no armour, so can be gunned down all too easily.......
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
84 Posts
thought of somewhat cheesy, one of the eldar armies cant remember the ones, that can take Howling banshies (or something like that) pretty evil for troop (if im corectly) they are pretty bad and only cost like 16 pts a pice!!! though there arnt many in their unit they got 3 attack each without charging and something about ignoring saves or something
not sure!!! but anyway
i think they are over powered!!! just me, or are there people that think the same as i do!!



hey and lets not forget that their leaders (if they have jump thing) they can in any assault move, move 6 inches away, does that also count if i charge them???
cause its a real pain in the arse!!!

edit 1
but also a cheesy but then again not cheesy is the basalisk!!!! 240 guess range pretty much!!! how about a battlefield thats 250 inches long and 250 inches wide!!! no can do!!! well could be done but how would you fight on it!!!! mare room between each plate of earth, and so on!!! could bee neet!!!


edit 2
thought you said De elites had 3 bs!!! damh i was like WHAT THE, but then i saw the word kroot!!! dont Gaurdsmen have 3 bs also????
sucky
but hey lets not forget a swoop of my dark eldars and teh tau are history!!! just deep strike behind their lines and webway portal out comes wyches and slam you loos bordsides then fire warriors and so on!!! done seen it happen all the time!!!! its so funny the tau player (my friend) faced forgot allk about the webway portal so all but some troops that just was used for cannonfodder was in reserve and the sourges survived 4 turns!! he was busy shooting at my talos!!! so funny, stupid player!! but hey we all make mistakes!!!
 

·
Bearded Ninja
Joined
·
2,678 Posts
also the Tau have one relly big fault they can get their buts kicked by gaurds men in assault <_<
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,961 Posts
Originally posted by Nightshade@Oct 8 2003, 22:35
just deep strike behind their lines and webway portal out comes wyches and slam you loos bordsides then fire warriors and so on!!! done seen it happen all the time!!!! its so funny the tau player (my friend) faced forgot allk about the webway portal so all but some troops that just was used for cannonfodder was in reserve and the sourges survived 4 turns!! he was busy shooting at my talos!!! so funny, stupid player!! but hey we all make mistakes!!!
Ehm...if you deepstrike, then you can't open the WWP that turn. You can open in in the shooting phase of the next turn if you survive until then, and one turn later the reserves can arrive.

Basically, if you deepstrike in turn two (the earliest possible time for this), then you can open it in turn three and the reserves arrive in turn four. If you failed the first reserve roll (of the deepstrikers), then the reserves won't arrive before turn five, if you fail twice then they won't arrive before turn six. Since most scenarios have a turn limit of exactly six turns, these reserves hardly have a chance to kill enough stuff in in average two turns. The opponent also has two turns to get prepared for this: You deepstrike, he can see where the WWP will be and react to it. You open it, he once again can react to it. Then your reserves arrive into a nice kill zone, and get mowed down.

What i want to say is that this tactic doesn't work against a smart player.

jwu
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
318 Posts
Originally posted by Nightshade@Oct 8 2003, 14:35
thought of somewhat cheesy, one of the eldar armies cant remember the ones, that can take Howling banshies (or something like that) pretty evil for troop (if im corectly) they are pretty bad and only cost like 16 pts a pice!!! though there arnt many in their unit they got 3 attack each without charging and something about ignoring saves or something
not sure!!! but anyway
i think they are over powered!!! just me, or are there people that think the same as i do!!



hey and lets not forget that their leaders (if they have jump thing) they can in any assault move, move 6 inches away, does that also count if i charge them???
cause its a real pain in the arse!!!

edit 1
but also a cheesy but then again not cheesy is the basalisk!!!! 240 guess range pretty much!!! how about a battlefield thats 250 inches long and 250 inches wide!!! no can do!!! well could be done but how would you fight on it!!!! mare room between each plate of earth, and so on!!! could bee neet!!!


edit 2
thought you said De elites had 3 bs!!! damh i was like WHAT THE, but then i saw the word kroot!!! dont Gaurdsmen have 3 bs also????
sucky
but hey lets not forget a swoop of my dark eldars and teh tau are history!!! just deep strike behind their lines and webway portal out comes wyches and slam you loos bordsides then fire warriors and so on!!! done seen it happen all the time!!!! its so funny the tau player (my friend) faced forgot allk about the webway portal so all but some troops that just was used for cannonfodder was in reserve and the sourges survived 4 turns!! he was busy shooting at my talos!!! so funny, stupid player!! but hey we all make mistakes!!!
No offense but PLEASE go to school and learn some grammar! (Not to mention spelling) I understood about a third of what you wrote, it was so disjointed and random.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,164 Posts
i think blood angels are a little too powerful. an extra 6 inch move when u can still get out???( 12 inch deployment, 12 inch move, extra 6 then jump out 2 then assult 6.) the onyl draw back on a 1 he is immoblised. i think its just wrong.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
318 Posts
Originally posted by Salamander@Oct 9 2003, 22:58
i think blood angels are a little too powerful. an extra 6 inch move when u can still get out???( 12 inch deployment, 12 inch move, extra 6 then jump out 2 then assult 6.) the onyl draw back on a 1 he is immoblised. i think its just wrong.
Don't forget that a Dozer blade will let him re-roll any failed diff. terrain checks!
 
1 - 20 of 119 Posts
Status
Not open for further replies.
Top