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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
You and your regiment of Corsairs are marching towards a unit of Glade Guard.

Then suddenly some Warhawks pop out of nowhere behind you and you decide to slow down allowing yourself to take more volleys of arrows... :?

I don't get it.
 

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You and your regiment of Corsairs are marching towards a unit of Glade Guard.

Then suddenly some Warhawks pop out of nowhere behind you and you decide to slow down allowing yourself to take more volleys of arrows... :?

I don't get it.
If an enemy is nearby you when in combat you're going to worry about moving quickly due to the potential for being flank or rear charged because you didn't pay notice to what the enemy was doing.

My guess would be it just represents the moving unit being more cautious due to the presence of another unit that could perhaps rip them to bits if they don't keep an eye on them.

My 2c for what its worth
 

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Sir Proofreader
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I think you're pretty much on the money there, Nachtjager.

I guess the guys at the back of the unit are worried about whatever giant thing they can see coming up behind them, so are trying to move defensively, holding back the guys at the front.

I kind of agree; I'd be wanting to hoe into the guys hurling arrows at me, but if I ended up being sandwiched between the arrow guys and their flying mates... It's probably something I'd like to avoid. So there'd be some hesitation as to whether to charge, and what to charge at.

Something like that, anyway.
 

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I think you're pretty much on the money there, Nachtjager.

I guess the guys at the back of the unit are worried about whatever giant thing they can see coming up behind them, so are trying to move defensively, holding back the guys at the front.

I kind of agree; I'd be wanting to hoe into the guys hurling arrows at me, but if I ended up being sandwiched between the arrow guys and their flying mates... It's probably something I'd like to avoid. So there'd be some hesitation as to whether to charge, and what to charge at.

Something like that, anyway.
Thanks :)

Thats Just the way I always interpreded it from a military pov, now worse than the threat of another other than your target near you.
 

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Formerly BrotherAzriel
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have you seen 300? the part in the village, the stones scatter "BEHIND US" the men weel round fo face bout instantly.

now they were stood still, and are highly diciplined, now imagin your part of a block of infantry, 3rd rank, you cant see much front or read, and you hear enemy behind you, the men behind saying "theres a bloody gurt hawk behind us" me are going to be jostleing for a look, slowing down to figure out what to do, readying weapons for fight etc.
 

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well could be but the explaination is actually more practical. Marching is when you load up all your gear and get ready for a longer journey. So if you march all the way to somewhere you are very likely to be tired and not combat ready. thats why you cant shoot after you march. So when you hear an enemy closeby or even see him i dont think you are going to pack your things and get ready for a hike.
 

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Rushing Jaws
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well could be but the explaination is actually more practical. Marching is when you load up all your gear and get ready for a longer journey. So if you march all the way to somewhere you are very likely to be tired and not combat ready. thats why you cant shoot after you march. So when you hear an enemy closeby or even see him i dont think you are going to pack your things and get ready for a hike.
That's about it. Marching in Warhammer is when the unit packs up their equipment and put all of their effort into moving faster. If there is an enemy nearby then there is a potential threat so the unit has to make themselves combat ready just in case they have to fight, so they can't manage the same speed as when they were marching.
 

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Benevolent Dictator
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This explaination in perfect- the packing your gear idea. For spearmen, that'd just be stowing the shield and shouldering your spear. Most likely means breaking ranks too. Anyone that's ever been in any kind of marching formation will know that tight ranks are bad for speed.
However- i have to know how dwarves are never march blocked. are they just fearless? it makes no sense in the fluff. they should get a penalty for getting charged after the march.

actually, anyone who gets charged after marched should take a penalty- they should do away with march blocking all together. It would just happen naturally.
That way, my cavalry would be able to just breeze through your lines, instead of slowing down in the middle. Sometimes it's better to march AWAY than just calmly walk away.
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
This explaination in perfect- the packing your gear idea. For spearmen, that'd just be stowing the shield and shouldering your spear. Most likely means breaking ranks too. Anyone that's ever been in any kind of marching formation will know that tight ranks are bad for speed.
However- i have to know how dwarves are never march blocked. are they just fearless? it makes no sense in the fluff. they should get a penalty for getting charged after the march.

actually, anyone who gets charged after marched should take a penalty- they should do away with march blocking all together. It would just happen naturally.
That way, my cavalry would be able to just breeze through your lines, instead of slowing down in the middle. Sometimes it's better to march AWAY than just calmly walk away.
Maybe Dwarves are so sturdy that even when they are in rank and file they can still move properly.
 

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Sir Proofreader
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Or (seeing as we're taking cheap shots at dwarves) they're just too short to see the impending danger!
 

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This explaination in perfect- the packing your gear idea. For spearmen, that'd just be stowing the shield and shouldering your spear. Most likely means breaking ranks too. Anyone that's ever been in any kind of marching formation will know that tight ranks are bad for speed.

However- i have to know how dwarves are never march blocked. are they just fearless? it makes no sense in the fluff. they should get a penalty for getting charged after the march.
Hence why the romans tended to march in close formation with shields on their arm? Shields the size of which were used by them the same as elves and many of the races in the game would impede movement if shouldered, rather than helping it. And once in a combat area you don't pack your gear away to march. Armies march from their camps ready for combat, not with gear still stowed.

If you're taking warhammer as being played out on a much larger are than it really is then fine (I.E. one model representing 100 or something), but if you're taking it in the sense as it appears, I'E realistic ranges of weapons representing maybe a hundred+ meters for a crossbow, so table width is about 180 yards ish. You wouldn't stow your gear at that range of an enemy, certainly not your shield.

Sorry but I have to disagree with you on this one.
 

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Benevolent Dictator
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Nachtjagger- i agree with you on most of what you say. However, if you look at WHFB in the scale with the which the WEAPONS are presented, then you have a severe problem. The range of a longbow is a great deal longer than it seems in the game. The design notes even make us aware of that, saying that to mach the scale of the models to the scale ranges of the weapons would mean playing in a parking lot or atleast a very large floorspace.

And I also agree that troops may not shoulder their shields. But if we DO consider the battle at the small scale presented to us, then the troops are moving VERY slowly when they are not 'marching'. At this size, i'd be more apt to beleive that they are walking around with their shields raised against potential arrows or locked together to recieve charges, with spears lowered between the ranks and so forth. This would the GW's "ready for combat". 'Marching' in this situation would be raising the spears to verticle, unlocking shields, spreading out for leg room, and moving at a light jog or even just a steady walk. In this instance, you are still 'battle ready' but it will take you time to lower your spears, kneel in the forward ranks, and raise your shields etc. Time that you wouldn't want to waste when being charged of a sudden.

For the rest of the thread: I would like to see the current "march-block" rule done away with. I beleive that you should be able to double-time at any point in the game on any part of the field. However, troops who are charged after double-timing should be subject to some kind of a penalty. I'd say that they don't get a rank bonus on the first round of combat, since they are in loose formation. This would of course make no difference to skirmishes, but skirmishers should never be marchblocked anyways- it's the nature of their style of warfare.

Sorry for the long post, almost a rant.
Cap'n out
 

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Well I agree with many of the idea that have been said, like when a unit marches they sheath there swords, swing there shield around there back and begin to jog, and when an enamy is close a unit would rather not do that, so must remain ready just in case someone attacks. But personally I believe it goes with more of a game balance thing. It's a way of slowing down cavalry units, so you can get an extra turn of shooting or what not, for instance a unit of chosen khorne knights can carve through many units buy themselves, and if they get first turn they can be hitting you lines buy turn two. If you can march block them it will give you an extra turn of shooting to pick off a guy or two.

I believe that many rules don't make sense when looked at logically, you just have to understand that this is a game that needs a balance in it, because in real world warfare war is not fair, many times one side will have greater number or better weapons and training, and what not. When you transfer warfare to a table top game it has to be fair or else people will get bored of always loosing, because "Joe" has more money than me and can buy more stuff to field in his army.
 

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That's about it. Marching in Warhammer is when the unit packs up their equipment and put all of their effort into moving faster. If there is an enemy nearby then there is a potential threat so the unit has to make themselves combat ready just in case they have to fight, so they can't manage the same speed as when they were marching.
All fine and dandy... but how do you explain charging? The rule book says that when marching a unit needs to pack up all its weapons and move at "double time" the what the hell are you doing when you charge? i get the whole jostling and hesitant thing, but the rule books version of it just sucks ass
 

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Nachtjagger- i agree with you on most of what you say. However, if you look at WHFB in the scale with the which the WEAPONS are presented, then you have a severe problem. The range of a longbow is a great deal longer than it seems in the game. The design notes even make us aware of that, saying that to mach the scale of the models to the scale ranges of the weapons would mean playing in a parking lot or atleast a very large floorspace.

And I also agree that troops may not shoulder their shields. But if we DO consider the battle at the small scale presented to us, then the troops are moving VERY slowly when they are not 'marching'. At this size, i'd be more apt to beleive that they are walking around with their shields raised against potential arrows or locked together to recieve charges, with spears lowered between the ranks and so forth. This would the GW's "ready for combat". 'Marching' in this situation would be raising the spears to verticle, unlocking shields, spreading out for leg room, and moving at a light jog or even just a steady walk. In this instance, you are still 'battle ready' but it will take you time to lower your spears, kneel in the forward ranks, and raise your shields etc. Time that you wouldn't want to waste when being charged of a sudden.

Sorry for the long post, almost a rant.
Cap'n out
Paragraph 2, I completley agree with you on the way you have defined a march move, as this is not completely stowing weapons, it's just opening formation to move faster than you can when maintaining a shieldwall, I.e. a slow walk to a jog as you mentioned. If anything this would be how I see the march blocking as working from this perspective, the troops aren't marching due to the vicinity of the enemy, they are simply maintaining close battle order to recieve charges as you suggested, if charged all of a sudden.

Shouldn't have used the scale argument in my post, my bad, as you said the rules for range are incredibly short, with the effective range of a longbow being around 100m+ your scale would be somthing around 3m / inch which would be somewhat bizzare. Was at work when I posted that and may not have thpought it through properly!

Not a rant at all, good input +Rep

Cheers

Nighthunter
 

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Bearded Ninja
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Well generally speaking we can't compare scale in terms of metric as its clearly a imperial system.

The top range of a longbow is about 300 yards. so when we look at it we can assume that each inch in wfb is 10 yards. Then you have roughly 3 yards to a metre. 300/3 = 100. So in terms of longbows WFB is pretty much on the spot ;)

March blocking however... now its a toughie. All the reasons presented are pretty solid explanations however. This of course points us to the dwarves who never run around, but power walk. Hence we are ALWAYS in close order and are always at the ready :p
 

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Sir Proofreader
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we can assume that each inch in wfb is 10 yards.
This reasoning begins to fall apart when we consider that our miniatures are all about an inch high!

From now on, I get to class everything in my army as a giant!


Vefador_the_cunning said:
All fine and dandy... but how do you explain charging? The rule book says that when marching a unit needs to pack up all its weapons and move at "double time" the what the hell are you doing when you charge? i get the whole jostling and hesitant thing, but the rule books version of it just sucks ass.
Charging is exactly that; charge as fast as you can at the enemy, and damn the consequences! The unit should be moving as fast as it can for a charge, and focused solely on the unit it is charging. You can begin worrying about the Warhalk behind you after you've ground his buddies into the dust.
 
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