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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Is the outlook for humanity that rosy? are we all going to be dead in the next century.

Is civilization at its apex?

We are going to run out of Oil sometime before 2050. China and India's exploitation of thier Coal reserves will knock the climate up to 3 degrees Centigrade above thier current levels. Storms and natural weather disasters may well become more common.

WW III will be fought over the last of the worlds resources.

The inventiveness of humanity as a race seems to have declined. The rate of patenting new inventions has dropped.

Am I being a doom monger or are we in serious trouble?
 

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Have you seen water world? Probably somewhere between here and there.
 

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Son of LO
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I think you can be reasonably confident humanity, in some form, will survive.. You can't wipe out a race with billions of mebmers overnight. Even nuclear war isn't going to do that.. Annihilate all the major cities on a couple of continents? Who cares, the human race continues..

I think humanity is reaching a point of stagnation, perhaps, but that will soon change. The new, vibrant cultures arising in China, India and the like may be highly destructive to the environment, but they will also, I feel, bring a vital new level of competition and energy into the world economy, which will fuel growth and advancement.

I have great confidence in the rat like tenacity and adaptability of this species.. They may not thrive over the next few hundred years, but maybe they will? I'm fairly certain we'll survive, in any case.
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
Shame about Holland though. London too.

Is Bird flu a threat? if its in Turkey it could get anywhere pretty quickly, the 1919 influenza pandemic killed more than WW1 should we be worried about that?
 

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I'm kind of a naturalist. The fact that humans have overcrowded the earth and shaping it too much and trying to make it perfect ot suit our needs, has resulted in the creation of a bug that resists most treatments. So in the time it will take to spread and cause problems and create a vaccine, many will have died, leading to the whole rearrangement of society. Kind of dark and far fetched but I believe is quite possible. Of course I a little off my rocker.
 

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Wings of Doom said:
Am I being a doom monger or are we in serious trouble?
You are being a doom monger :) Most of those things you said are worst case scenarios, especially about WWIII, where did that come from?

I don't see how humanity can reach an apex in creativity, either we are a creative species or we are not. It's not like genius is a finite resource, eg. "By 3075 we will be completely out of new ideas."

What CAN happen is that our old ideas can reach their apex and we are forced to abandon them or be destroyed. At some point we are going to have to abandon the ideas of money, trade, private ownership and war, or else we will destroy the world and ourselves in our never-ending quest for everyone to have what they want. We need to make it so that life is no longer a zero sum game where in order for you to have more someone else has to have less. We need a world like the Federation in Star Trek, it's our only real chance. Everyone knows it, it's just no-one does anything about it because they say "that's science fiction, people are inherently selfish."

I think that's balls. It's an excuse and it will be the death of us unless we grow up. All we have to do is change our priorities. It's what humans do.
 

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Wings of Doom said:
The inventiveness of humanity as a race seems to have declined. The rate of patenting new inventions has dropped.
Have you seen some of the sweet inventions being made lately? There are alot out of Japan, especially robots and such. I heard a rumour that they have alredy invented a flying car, back in about 1998, but the problem was it went too fast, and couldn't slow down, somewhere around the 600 km/h mark. For all I know, they could have just starpped a rocket engine to a car, but hey it's still cool.

I also heard a rumour that Japan was designing big mech suits (like in the animes) to be use by their military in war, how cool.
Wings of Doom said:
Am I being a doom monger or are we in serious trouble?
Yes, I think you are being a Doom Monger, in the Words of Monty Python, "Always look on the bright side of life", so what if we run out of oil? That means we'll have to make a newer, cleaner renewable energy source to replace it.

Woooohhoo, scary, the bird Flu's coming! Just stay the hell away from chickens, and you won't have a problem, that's the only way you can get it. Yeah, I know, people say if it transforms and becomes a super virus, it could go from person to person, but the key word there is if. If I had a 1000 feet tall, solid titanium robot, then I could go fight the war in Iraq by myself, and all the troops could go home, sure, it's possible, doesn't mean it's gonna happen!:)
 

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Wings of Doom said:
The inventiveness of humanity as a race seems to have declined. The rate of patenting new inventions has dropped.

And how long have we been tracking patents? Did Archimedes patent his inventions?


robotnik said:
What CAN happen is that our old ideas can reach their apex and we are forced to abandon them or be destroyed. At some point we are going to have to abandon the ideas of money, trade, private ownership and war, or else we will destroy the world and ourselves in our never-ending quest for everyone to have what they want. We need to make it so that life is no longer a zero sum game where in order for you to have more someone else has to have less. We need a world like the Federation in Star Trek, it's our only real chance. Everyone knows it, it's just no-one does anything about it because they say "that's science fiction, people are inherently selfish."
You make some really interesting points. I don't know that I totally agree with you, nor do I know if I totally disagree with you. You doubt that humankind can live successfully in an ownership society, but I tend to disagree. I think it's possible, but that the owners will have to give a lot more (taxes and community initiatives and such) to make it possible. The problem with communal ownership is that someone must still police and maintain the neighborhood. Residents going back and forth to their daily jobs just won't stop and pick up tasks that the city or other local government previously provided. I've visited sustainable communities and like what I see and want to get involved, but can that same phenomenon be duplicated in the general populace?

Do you get Harper's Magazine where you live? In the current issue is an "Annotation." It's a two-page spread detailing a sustainable city being built in China and designed by William McDonough. Only 12000 people live there now, and their homes will be levled for the enterprise. It's an amazingly progressive plan, especially when one considers China's environmental record, but the government seems to be making a concerted effort to halt the tide. However, they do so at the expense of the indigenous people, some of whom date their lineage back to the seventh century.

This annotation notes how China's government, which acts irrespectively of the people's will, accomplishes meaningful and innovative environmental progress where U.S. policies would impede the progress, in the name of owner's rights. It's really interesting and gives one a lot to ponder.


dr_nick22 said:
Woooohhoo, scary, the bird Flu's coming! Just stay the hell away from chickens, and you won't have a problem, that's the only way you can get it. Yeah, I know, people say if it transforms and becomes a super virus, it could go from person to person, but the key word there is if. If I had a 1000 feet tall, solid titanium robot, then I could go fight the war in Iraq by myself, and all the troops could go home, sure, it's possible, doesn't mean it's gonna happen!:)
The problem with your argument is that the chances of the bird flu mutating to a human-to-human virus are much greater than they are of you occupying the innards of a titanic, solid titanium robot, whilst doing battle with terrorists in Iraq.




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The world will not make it to 2050, the world will not even make it to 2020.
Where do I get that from? An ancient civilisation would you believe. The Mayan's believed that the end of the world would occur on what is now known as the 12th of December 2012; that everything that was up until that point would no longer be; and I for one can't wait to find out :w00t:
 

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I think humanity will make it to 2050 and I for one intend to be around when it does! :w00t:

I am very optimistic and believe the future has many new things in store for us, and being the creative, innovative, and persistent race that we are, we won’t just give up and roll over to die when presented with difficulties. So yes, we will likely be facing a problem concerning lack of fossil fuel, but we already have the technology to replace fossil fuel with other means when it becomes necessary; taxes might be raised a bit, world economy might lay low for a few years, but then we’ll be over that hurdle and continuing onwards.

Global warming is another challenge, but perhaps not as serious as we now fear. Building cities on stakes has been practiced for at least two thousand years already, and I’m sure we’ll be able to figure something out should the water level rise critically within the next few decades.

I for one am excited about what the future will bring. So yes, new diseases will arise that are potentially epidemic, but even the most dangerous virus can’t wipe out the entire human race, and we keep inventing new vaccines and cures. Science will continue to make progress and give us even better living conditions than currently; genetic experimenting will give us new and improved food sources, nanotechnology and medical inventions will keep us alive longer. Hopefully, we will be living on a more peaceful planet too, and before I die I expect to see humanity take its first step towards becoming a true space-faring race.

I just read an article today by a Danish doctor who has invented what is described as a ‘miracle cure’ for liver cancer using new and until now untested technology. In the article was quoted an American scientist who had said: ‘The future isn’t what is has been. It’s better!’ And I believe that too. Every new idea is a step towards making a better future for ourselves, and I believe that we will in the end do just that.

~Greph.
 

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The problem with your argument is that the chances of the bird flu mutating to a human-to-human virus are much greater than they are of you occupying the innards of a titanic, solid titanium robot, whilst doing battle with terrorists in Iraq.
Yes, but would it be as cool?;)

The point I was trying to make, is that the virus mutating is a possibility, not a definite, and people are getting unneccesarily scared about something that might not even happen.

As for the end of the world, there have been alot of predictions about that, and we all seem to still be here, so hey, I'm not complaining.

From what I can remember, there was a prediction the world would end in the year 1000, according to the passage from revelations in the bible that said something about the devil awaking from a 1000 year imprisonment and destroying the world, that didn't happen.

Apparently the world was going to end in the year 2000, as predicted by Nostradamus, a drunken old fool.

And as you mentioned the Mayan calendar says the world is going to end in the yae 2012, which I highly doubt.

The only time that you can be sure the world will end is either when the sun implodes, and sucks most of the planets in the milky way into a black hole, or when the climate levels get so unstable because of the sun growing in size, and the heat becomes too much and the earth turns into something akin to mercury.

But we'll all be long dead by then, so don't worry, be happy.:yes:
 

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God's nutcase
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dr_nick22 said:
according to the passage from revelations in the bible that said something about the devil awaking from a 1000 year imprisonment and destroying the world, that didn't happen.
That was prophesied to happen after the destruction of this world by seven angels, so it's not likely to have happened yet.

dr_nick22 said:
Apparently the world was going to end in the year 2000, as predicted by Nostradamus, a drunken old fool.
Can you give the quatrain where that was cited? The only one that I can remember around that time was that during the seventh month of 1999 (not sure whether that's our 1999, there have been fudgings with the calendar since Nostradams) the King of Terror would come from the skies and the leader of the Mongols would rise up, not that the world would end. And as I remember it, mid-1999 was kinda close to the passing of a comet (Temple-Tuttle?).
 

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Yes humanity is dying, as are we all.
But, that's the way it's always been, that is humanity in a nutshell.

We have always gone a bit too far on whatever road we traveled and some of us said "This will be the end for us!".
Now, even though mighty empires have crumbled and plauges has struck us down we always seem to manage.
It's not all unlike a macro version of our own lives I guess.
"Oh my God, I'm turning 30 soon:O !!! This will be the end of me, I will not survive." Then, a hangover later, you'll see it's still the same.
 

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Son of LO
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dr_nick22 said:
The only time that you can be sure the world will end is either when the sun implodes, and sucks most of the planets in the milky way into a black hole, or when the climate levels get so unstable because of the sun growing in size, and the heat becomes too much and the earth turns into something akin to mercury.
It's going to be the latter, not the former.. our sun doesn't have the mass to implode.
 

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Has anybody mentioned that will happen in, oh, about 12,000,000 years?

Yeah, so...

I actually hope it gets to the point that we are exploring at least our solar system by hand then, have factories in space and fusion power station providing power to every home in the world. If not then I want to be on a farm in some heavliy forested area, because space is the onyl way man can counter our very possible downfall. I actually wrote a poem about the subject around early December so if I can find it I'll post it. (that is if anybods interested)
 

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because space is the onyl way man can counter our very possible downfall
Why?

There are plenty of raw materials on earth, the only problem is energy. Once fusion can provide technically infinite amounths of energy, one can afford to have millions of small bots crawl through dumps and recycling stuff. It's still there after all, just in a form that right now is unsuitable to use as the processing consumes too much energy.
 

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Son of LO
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ArchonAstaroth said:
There are plenty of raw materials on earth, the only problem is energy. Once fusion can provide technically infinite amounths of energy, one can afford to have millions of small bots crawl through dumps and recycling stuff. It's still there after all, just in a form that right now is unsuitable to use as the processing consumes too much energy.
Heck.. we could just release a cloud of self replicating micro-machines into the upper atmosphere (as in tiny robots, not toy cars from the 80s) to reconvert the CO2 back into oxygen and keep the climate stable no matter how much crap we burn down here.

I gotta say, G.W. Bush has the right idea on one thing, and that is that alternative energy is never going to beat C02 emissions, because it's just too much hassle for people to have to turn off their lights every time there's a cloudy day or the wind stops. What is going to help is an easy, technological sollution, which has yet to be researched.
 

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Forger of Civilization said:
I'm kind of a naturalist. The fact that humans have overcrowded the earth and shaping it too much and trying to make it perfect ot suit our needs, has resulted in the creation of a bug that resists most treatments. So in the time it will take to spread and cause problems and create a vaccine, many will have died, leading to the whole rearrangement of society.
Well technically we don't over crowd the Earth. There is way more Earth than people. The entire human population could fit into an are the size on pennsylvania, if we all stood shoulder to shoulder. The probelm is we destroy most of our potential habitat.

The_Giant_Mantis said:
I gotta say, G.W. Bush has the right idea on one thing, and that is that alternative energy is never going to beat C02 emissions, because it's just too much hassle for people to have to turn off their lights every time there's a cloudy day or the wind stops. What is going to help is an easy, technological sollution, which has yet to be researched.
Yea.. Cause im sure it's his own personal idea... not... Anyway, that is correct though. The only problem is that because of our lovely president WWIII is all the closer.

I don't think diseases will kill us. If anything there will be a huge fight (WWIII) over the diminishing resources. Especially since China and India are begining to consume on the level that the U.S. does. When that comes around, our resources (especially fossil fuels) will be gone quick. But I am optomistic in the sense that I think the survivng human race after this war will be able to use some kind of new energy sourse to run most things.

I mean hey, if someone can make a car that can run on water, why can't we find new sources of energy? Of course, the reason we don't have super energy effecient cars is because the government doesn't want to spend the money or let the car businesses go out of commission. This wouldn't be a problem for the surviving humans though. Let's just hope there is no money hungry government ruled by corporations at this time...
 

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so speaking of potential ww3. i'd like to mention something that would follow that...

the inevitable war between humans and mutants following the post-apocalyptic nuclear war.
it's going to happen, hence the word inevitable...

anyways, some of us will end up as humans, and some as mutants, dividing us, well those of us who survived... the saved from the victims, but neither can live in harmony with each other... kind of like whites and blacks... anyways... which side would be the right side, in your opinions
 
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