Because the tyranids don't see a point in having an armour save on the small bugs.

They are supposed to overwhelm the enemy with numbers, and as you see with the extended carapace upgrade, in case of gaunts the "resources" that the hive mind would have to spend for better armour is not worth it.

Tyranids also don't give a ***** about casualties, they just devour the bio mass of their dead after they conquered the planet. From the hive mind's perspecttive the loss is basically zero then.

The other reason is that it simply looks better to have a huge swarm, it's simply the tyranid's style as an army - and there is nothing wrong with that, quantity is equally powerful as quality.

jwu

 

Largely I suspect because of the fluff. While the expensive Tyrannids do have their lovely high saves, the rest of the army is basically meant to be bugs - cheap but limitless.

I mean, can you imagine what it would be like seeing Hormagaunts fleet-of-clawing towards you in terminator armour?

 

Hormagaunts fleet-of-clawing towards you in terminator armour?

I smell conversion! :lol:

But yeah, I thought the saves sucked at first too, before I started to really get a feel for the tyranids. I almost didn't want to field them as an army, but I was stuck with the army box, so *shrug*

I've only played a small scrimmage with my dad, and tyranids are very powerful (especially when your opponent is rolling 1's and 2's constantly).

But when you look at the variety, and see the diversity in tactics and flexibility it can lend you, it's more fun that way in my opinon, plus, I love seeing a huge swarm of little men/bugs (men for people like IG) rushing across the battlefield!

 

Like people said before, its all about the fluff. The Tyranids dont attack you with 1000 guys, they attack you with 100 million guys(no joke), so if one guy dies whats it matter? Also the Tyranids are more of an attack army than a defending one. So they want to so as much damage as they can to you before you can do damage to them. Although I would like to see a 5+ Inv save on Warp Field and a Carnifex...

 

It is however dumb that they have the same save as some crappy Imperial Guard units who only have shirts on. Tyranids have at least a carapace.

 

Originally posted by cybugger@Mar 20 2004, 05:44
Even big assed creatures like Lictors have only got +5 meaning raped vs bolters... BOLTERS

For the bigger bugs this post concerns:

Warriors: Never leave the Hive without ExtCar!

Lictor: You have read the special rule "Stealth"? Read it again!

Raveners: Well, these guys really are fragile... I don't really mind the fragility, but they should be 10 points cheaper than what they're now.

 

I totaly agree with the ravener thing. If they where I would buy a lot of them.

 

Tyranids are used in numbers, if they had good saves they wouldnt have numbers. The tyranids dont care about casualties, if loads die some rippers will come along eat up the tyranid that died and sit in a digestive pool so that the ripper and what ever it has eaten would be digested and the resources sent back to the hive ship. There is no individuality in the lesser creatures so it doesnt matter if they die or not, no one is going to miss them. Anyway in an assaulting army what do you want 5 good save marines or 32 hormagaunts whats it going to be, eh?

 

"whats it going to be, eh"

thats from a clockwork orange.

I duno if you intended that, but its a pretty important and comman phrasae used in that book. good book.

 

Originally posted by ArchonAstaroth@Mar 20 2004, 07:23
The other reason is that it simply looks better to have a huge swarm, it's simply the tyranid's style as an army - and there is nothing wrong with that, quantity is equally powerful as quality.

To quote Stalin, "Quantity has a quality of it's own." Tyranid strategy in a nutshell.

 

Guards only have a shirt on!!?

Hardly!

Your standard guard trooper has flak-armor with mesh-carbon reflective plates etc etc etc. Supposedly, extremely high tech.

So a 5+ save is pretty good.

Besides, Tyranids are supposed to use numbers. Hence, all those 32 model swarms tht cost only 7pts per.

 

The only thing I can see that the Tyranids need is some sort of Inv save... A DH GM can kill a HT or a Carnifex in the first round..(s6, PW and a FW ). So basically you only need to wound once. Maybe give them a 6+I save to basically state that the armour is really thick...I kinda view the big bugs like my Wraithlord ( back in my Eldar days ) , and he never had a problem with pw guys ( cuz they couldn't wound him ) , so maybe the answer is to increase the toughness of the bigger bugs.

 

Originally posted by Damocles@Mar 27 2004, 11:32
Guards only have a shirt on!!?

Hardly!

--- How about the Catachans then?

Well, one could suppose their T-shirts are made of "mesh-carbon reflective plates etc etc etc. Supposedly, extremely high tech"...

Or it could just be because Catachans are so damn hard they don't need no stinking armour! :lol:

Though I'd wager Gaunt carapace to be tougher than Guardsman skin, even if the Guard is a Catachan...

 

Originally posted by Uzi-99@Mar 27 2004, 14:36
Though I'd wager Gaunt carapace to be tougher than Guardsman skin, even if the Guard is a Catachan...

We are talking about tough hombres who've grown up on deathworlds right? And you think they're not tougher than space roaches?

 

If you read the fluff, it goes on about how there is no digestive system so there is more room for muscle, blah blah blah, they all have a skeleton, tough skin and then an exoskeleton. Just read it you'll see.

 

hey your wrong. it says that all armour saves on all the big bugs are invulnveranble, i think at least, im not sure it was like that in the previous edition...

 

Well you got one thing right: "You think"

We have non now, do we need them, well would be nice, but do we need them, i say no.

 

Nightsorrow: What you're looking at is the rulebook army list, which is no longer valid as it got replaced with the codex. In the codex tyranids don't have a single inv save.

However...

Better saves of any kind would result in more expensive models (pointwise), which would defeat the purpose of tyranids as a horde army.
There are more types of resilience than just toughness and saves. A high number of wounds on the table is at least equally effective. This also provides other advantages such as outnumbering in close combat and they more or less ignore the advantages of low AP or inv save ignoring weapons.
Two models with basically no save are exactly as resilient as one model with a 4+ save, but an AP4- weapon still can kill only one of them while the 4+ Sv model would be very vulnerable to it.

Two such virtually weaker models also get two charge bonus attacks, where one more resilient one would get only one...

jwu